• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

"No full preterist views..." ?

Status
Not open for further replies.

Nilloc

Senior Veteran
Mar 6, 2007
4,155
886
✟43,888.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
But then you misunderstand what a full Preterist believes.
LOL. I understand what they teach just fine (I was a full preterist for a time, until God showed me my error).

Preterists do believe that prophecy was fulfilled in 70 AD, and that we are now in the kingdom, but why is that depressing?
It's depressing because it means God will never fulfill His promise to Resurrect the dead (1 Corinthians 15), nor set the creation free from it's bondage (Romans 8:21). i The god of Hyperpreterism is a god who cares so little for his creation, that he's just going to let sin and death last forever. Which means that, ultimatley, Satan has won.

It's also depressing because it means belivers have nothing to look forward to, no hope for the future.

As Christians it gives us the freedom to evangelise and not have to worry about being raptured or left behind. We are free to improve the world and stop it being destroyed.
Christians of any eschatological view has the freedom to preach the Gospel. C.H. Spurgeon, a Premillennialist, was a very famous preacher, who I believe, gained many converts by his preaching. There has never been some great Hyperpreterist preacher who converted many to Christianity, so it appears that very few Hyperpreterists care about converted lost souls to the faith.

As for the above passage, Paul was writing before 70 AD and could not therefore, have been talking about Preterists.
It doesn't matter when it was written. The point I make with the passage is that, if the Resurrection of the dead is future (which it is, otherwise my faith is in vain), then those who teach it is past (Hyperpreterists) will fall under the same condemnation as Hymenaeus and Philetus.

He was talking about the Gnostics, who are very different from Preterists.
Actually, Hyperpreterism is nothing more than Gnosticism, combined with Mysticism, Paganism, Liberalism, and the Hymenaean heresy. Hyperpreterism, just like the Gnostics, don't belive that the creation is good, so that therefore, it won't ever be redeemed. And Hyperpreterism, just like Gnosticism, is a different religion, with a different god, and a different Jesus (followed to it's logical conclusion, Hyperpreterism must teach that Jesus did not physically rise from the dead).

So no, Gnostics are not "very different" from Hyperpreterists.

Btw dude, Hyperpreterists are not allowed to post on this board (or any other Christian Only board).
 
  • Like
Reactions: &Abel
Upvote 0

LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
Site Supporter
May 19, 2015
125,550
28,531
74
GOD's country of Texas
Visit site
✟1,237,300.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
......Actually, Hyperpreterism is nothing more than Gnosticism, combined with Mysticism, Paganism, Liberalism, and the Hymenaean heresy. Hyperpreterism, just like the Gnostics, don't belive that the creation is good, so that therefore, it won't ever be redeemed. And Hyperpreterism, just like Gnosticism, is a different religion, with a different god, and a different Jesus (followed to it's logical conclusion, Hyperpreterism must teach that Jesus did not physically rise from the dead).............
excellent post!
I agree.
You might be interested in this Preterist site which also condemns Hyper-Preterism though she is a Preterist.
She did her own commentary on Matt 24 and I also used to post on her forum some years back......:wave:

http://www.preteristsite.com/

http://www.preteristsite.com/docs/warrenend.html
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote 0

LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
Site Supporter
May 19, 2015
125,550
28,531
74
GOD's country of Texas
Visit site
✟1,237,300.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
A full preterist is a person who believes that every single prophecy of the Bible is fulfilled, that Jesus has already returned, that the Resurrection of the dead has already taken place, and that sin and death will continue on forever. They believe that all prophecy was fulfilled no later than the destruction of the Jewish Temple in the year 70 A.D.

The difference between a full preterist and an Orthodox/Partial Preterist, such as myself, is that while we belive that most (but not all) prophecy was fulfilled by 70 A.D., we still believe in a future Second Coming, Resurrection of the dead, and Final Judgement.
This sums it up quite nicely. Thks NILLOC :thumbsup:
 
Upvote 0

gwynedd1

Senior Veteran
Jul 18, 2006
2,631
77
57
✟25,593.00
Faith
Christian
I think I may stand even between these. Certainly the rub is over the Resurrection.
I believe the final judgment may be occuring now though I am not entirely clear on this. I certainly do not believe it had ended by 70 AD. I believe it describes a very long process. The best evidence against full preterism is we are here, niether resurrected and not judged. There is evidence for and against what I believe.
The biggest problem I have with the on going view is when Jesus was resurrected his body was missing . Was that a special case? It is an obstacle.

My suspected view comes from several scripture the best I like is Matthew 25 and Micah 4. Isaiah also reinforces this.


Matthew 25
31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy[c] angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’​
Micah 4
Now it shall come to pass in the latter days
That the mountain of the LORD’s house
Shall be established on the top of the mountains,
And shall be exalted above the hills;
And peoples shall flow to it.
2 Many nations shall come and say,

“ Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD,
To the house of the God of Jacob;
He will teach us His ways,
And we shall walk in His paths.”
For out of Zion the law shall go forth,
And the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.
3 He shall judge between many peoples,
And rebuke strong nations afar off;
They shall beat their swords into plowshares,
And their spears into pruning hooks;
Nation shall not lift up sword against nation,
Neither shall they learn war anymore.[a]
4 But everyone shall sit under his vine and under his fig tree,
And no one shall make them afraid;
For the mouth of the LORD of hosts has spoken.
5 For all people walk each in the name of his god,
But we will walk in the name of the LORD our God
Forever and ever.

This appear to be the judgment. Is in one big batch or ongoing? I

However what follows seems that there is still flesh and dying of the flesh though it is clear the death of the flesh is not death. Paul said where is the sting of death? This is a big scripture that seems to refute new heavens and earth as ending death of the flesh. Resurrection means to rise and then that defeats death by rising from it.

Isaiah 65
17 “ For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth;
And the former shall not be remembered or come to mind.
18 But be glad and rejoice forever in what I create;
For behold, I create Jerusalem as a rejoicing,
And her people a joy.
19 I will rejoice in Jerusalem,
And joy in My people;
The voice of weeping shall no longer be heard in her,
Nor the voice of crying.
20 “ No more shall an infant from there live but a few days,
Nor an old man who has not fulfilled his days;
For the child shall die one hundred years old,
But the sinner being one hundred years old shall be accursed.​
As I look at the end of Isaiah I also harmonized Mathew 13 with Isaiah

Matthew 13
‘Do you want us then to go and gather them up?’ 29 But he said, ‘No, lest while you gather up the tares you also uproot the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest, and at the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, “First gather together the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them, but gather the wheat into my barn.”’”

Isaiah 65
25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together,
The lion shall eat straw like the ox,
And dust shall be the serpent’s food.
They shall not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain,”
Says the LORD.


Considering the NT quotes all around here I also realized that animals are never about animals. leopards lions, sheep, goats are all metaphors for people. I also realized that instead of Israel conquering the land that the new nation spread by peace "beating swords into plow shares" and lived side by side with the wolf just like the grain with the tares. Consider that the old covenant required Israel to be separate and that it engaged by war with other nations. We live side by side as lambs with the wolf and we plow to plant and harvest.
 
Upvote 0

LamorakDesGalis

Well-Known Member
Sep 22, 2004
2,198
235
Dallas Texas
✟18,598.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
LOL. I understand what they teach just fine (I was a full preterist for a time, until God showed me my error).

If you don't mind me asking, what were the influences that led you to be a full preterist? And what were the influences that led you away from it?


LDG
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nilloc
Upvote 0

Nilloc

Senior Veteran
Mar 6, 2007
4,155
886
✟43,888.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
If you don't mind me asking, what were the influences that led you to be a full preterist? And what were the influences that led you away from it?


LDG
Hi LDG. :wave:

To be brief, as I'm short on time, I was first led into Partial Preterism, which eventually resulted in me beliving in full preterism. Obviously there are the 'time text' that are quoted by both full and Partial Preterists (Matt. 24:34, Rev. 1:1-3, etc), but my main reason for beliving that all Bible prophecy was fulfilled was my own arrogance. I've noticed this seems to be prevalent (not intentionally of course) in the full preterists writings that I've read online. full preterists like the idea of beliving everything is fulfilled--that they have discovered this amazing new doctrine that was buried in the Scriptures; that no Christian has known for two-thousand years. This was how I thought (even if I knew deep down that full preterism couldn't possibly be true) and probably the main reason I became a full preterist.

As for my reasons for leaving full preterism (other than God getting rid of my arrogance) was my study of Paul's view of the Resurrection of the dead. 1 Corinthians 15 (for obvious reasons) proves that the Resurrection of belivers could not and did not happen in A.D. 70--but this was not the only part of Paul's writings that show that, contray to what full preterists teach, the Resurrection of the dead is phyical and bodily, just like Jesus's Resurrection was.

There was also Jesus's teaching in Luke 20:34-36 that there will no longer be marriage after the Resurrection of the dead (full preterists 'explaination' for these verses is so bad, so illogical, and so clearly wrong from the context of the passage, that I couldn't believe anyone really thought that that's what Jesus meant).

There's also the fact that two-thousand years of Christianity never taught anything even close to full preterism. Even the earliest Christian writer outside of the NT (Clement of Rome) spoke of the Second Coming and Resurrection (even quoting 1 Cor. 15) as future, multiple times in his letter.

I have many other reasons as to why I no longer believe in full preterism, but the three above were some of the big ones.

God Bless. :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: &Abel
Upvote 0
B

Bible2

Guest


The church won't be able to stop the world from being destroyed
(Isaiah 26:18b) during the coming tribulation (Revelation
chapters 6-18), because the coming tribulation must happen
(Revelation 1:1).

---

The original Greek word translated as "earth" in Revelation 1:7
means the planet, just as it means the planet in Revelation 1:5.

The original Greek word translated as "earth" in Revelation 6:8
means the planet, just as it means the planet in Revelation 6:10.

The original Greek word translated as "earth" in Revelation 11:6
means the planet, just as it means the planet in Revelation 11:10.

The original Greek word translated as "earth" in Revelation 13:8
means the planet, just as it means the planet in Revelation 13:13-14.

The original Greek word translated as "earth" in Revelation 16:2
means the planet, just as it means the planet in Revelation 16:14.

The original Greek word translated as "earth" in Revelation 20:8
means the planet, just as it means the planet in Revelation 20:11.

The original Greek word translated as "earth" in Revelation 21:1
means the planet, just as it means the planet in Revelation 21:24.

---

The judgment of all those in the church will occur at the same
time: at the second coming (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27).

The judgment of all those outside of the church, and all those
who will become part of the church after the second coming
(Revelation 20:7-21), during the millennium (Revelation 20:4-6,
Isaiah 66:19-20), will occur at the same time: at the great white
throne judgment (Revelation 20:11-15), after the millennium and
the battle of Gog and Magog (Revelation 20:7-10).

---

On the new earth (Revelation 21:1), which will be created after
the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11-15), there
will be no more death, or sorrow or pain, for those who became
part of the church on the old earth (Revelation 21:4).

All those who didn't became part of the church on the old earth
will be in the lake of fire (Revelation 21:8, 20:15).

So the people who will live and then die on the new earth
(Isaiah 65:17-20) must be a new race of people created with the
new earth.

---

The animals in Isaiah 65:25 are literal; God will change all
carnivores into vegetarians, just as all animals, along with
man, had originally been vegetarians (Genesis 1:29-30).

This isn't to say that we have to be vegetarians now
(1 Timothy 4:3-5).

---

Matthew 24:34 was referring to the generation that would see
the rebudding of the fig tree (Matthew 24:32-33), which
represents the nation of Israel (Hosea 9:10) being re-
established. This happened by U.N. Resolution in November,
1947.

Since a generation usually passes after 70 years (Psalms 90:10),
Matthew 24:34 could mean that all of the still-unfulfilled
events of Matthew 24:15-31 will be completed before 2017.

---

"Shortly come to pass" and "the time is at hand" in Revelation
1:1-3 must be understood in the light of 2 Peter 3:8-9.

Revelation chapters 6-22 have never happened.

Revelation 6:4-8 could happen in 2010, starting the tribulation
of Revelation chapters 6-18.

 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.