No Burst of mercy for Hate group

[savedandhappy1]

Most of you pro-gay arguers seem to believe exactly what he does, only watered down, not much of a difference.

Well and now we see another false statement. You might want to point out the things you think that makes us exactly like him, and also point out all the things he does that aren't exactly like us. For clarification.

We may both agree that homosexuality is a sin, but besides that what is it that we are exactly alike on in your opinion?

By the way isn't being pro something mean that you agree with it?

It maybe getting late, because some of your statements seem alittle confusing to me.

 

[BAFRIEND]

I think that I have seen someone close.

Let me know who you think that person is so I can hit him with a stick.

 

[TheFathersDaughter]

Let me know who you think that person is so I can hit him with a stick.

James 1:20 - For man's anger does not bring about the righteous life that God desires.

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

Most of you pro-gay arguers seem to believe exactly what he does, only watered down, not much of a difference.

I don't generalize with u, please don't generalize with me.

 

[davedjy]

Well and now we see another false statement. You might want to point out the things you think that makes us exactly like him, and also point out all the things he does that aren't exactly like us. For clarification.

We may both agree that homosexuality is a sin, but besides that what is it that we are exactly alike on in your opinion?

By the way isn't being pro something mean that you agree with it?

It maybe getting late, because some of your statements seem alittle confusing to me.

No...you have gone a step ahead of that, and said that gays have been "turned up".
Not much of a difference than believing that and that God hates us.

 

[davedjy]

I don't generalize with u, please don't generalize with me.

As I said, "most", I didn't say "all" pro gay arguers. I don't remember you personally saying that gays have been "turned up". If you did, as stated, I don't see much of a difference, other than holding up signs advertising your beliefs.

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

back on topic, i was overjoyed when i saw this on the news. If the guy actually collects I hope that he puts some towards some type of ministry to help counteract these people.

 

[savedandhappy1]

No...you have gone a step ahead of that, and said that gays have been "turned up".
Not much of a difference than believing that and that God hates us.

God hates sin, he doesn't hate us He sent His son to die for us, so you can try and make it sound like am saying whatever you want to. Doesn't make it the truth, but if it makes you feel better go for it I have big shoulders and so does God.

Oh by the way the term in Romans is "gave up". You know sometimes God has to give us up to our sin, because sometimes we have to hit rock bottom to wake up to the fact of what we are doing. It just seems to take that sometimes to get us to call out to the only one who can helps us.... GOD.

Again, if it makes you feel better to say and think that someone out of love is trying to reach others for the Lord, by trying to show them that what they are doing is a sin in the eyes of the Lord, go for it.

Deep down you know the truth, but even more important the Lord knows my heart and so............

 

[davedjy]

God hates sin, he doesn't hate us He sent His son to die for us, so you can try and make it sound like am saying whatever you want to. Doesn't make it the truth, but if it makes you feel better go for it I have big shoulders and so does God.

Which is why I said a "watered down" version. I don't claim anyone is a clone of those crazies. I do believe all pro-gay arguers are using the Bible to justify what I perceive to be bigotry.

Oh by the way the term in Romans is "gave up". You know sometimes God has to give us up to our sin, because sometimes we have to hit rock bottom to wake up to the fact of what we are doing. It just seems to take that sometimes to get us to call out to the only one who can helps us.... GOD.

I don't see any gays or lesbians "hitting rock bottom" for their sexual orientations, but "if it makes you feel better to believe that, well..."

Again, if it makes you feel better to say and think that someone out of love is trying to reach others for the Lord, by trying to show them that what they are doing is a sin in the eyes of the Lord, go for it.

Not so much that, as believing and telling people that gays and lesbians have been "given over", or whatever the belief.

Deep down you know the truth, but even more important the Lord knows my heart and so............

Deep down I know what truth? your intentions or the belief that homosexuality is sin? Deep down I believe that two people of the same sex who love each other are blessed by God. I cannot possibly believe that a God would not bless 2 consenting adult's love for each other because of their genitals. I think of that verse that says that there is no male or female in Christ.

 

[Ave Maria]

Praise be to God! Any victory against Westboro Baptist Church is a victory for God!

 

[savedandhappy1]

Which is why I said a "watered down" version. I don't claim anyone is a clone of those crazies. I do believe all pro-gay arguers are using the Bible to justify what I perceive to be bigotry.

Do you not believe that God hates sin? Do you not believe that God loves us so much that He sent His son to die for us? Do you not believe that without confession and repentance we are not saved?

How confusing it is to be preceived as a bigot, because we believe what the Bible say, and how sad ........... Not sure how believing those things makes anyone preceived as a bigot, but whatever.

I don't see any gays or lesbians "hitting rock bottom" for their sexual orientations, but "if it makes you feel better to believe that, well..."

Dang could that be because you don't know all gays and lesbians? Could it be because not all gays/lesbians are on message boards or in the news talking about how they feel and what they are going through? Knowing that there are people all over the world suffering in their sinful states could never make me feel better, and frankly trying to make people think that is bearing false witness about me. I would ask that you please stop. I thought is I pointed out what you were doing in the last post you would understand, but you didn't so I will come out and ask you to please stop trying to make it look like I am thinking and /or saying things that I am not.
Not so much that, as believing and telling people that gays and lesbians have been "given over", or whatever the belief.

Deep down I know what truth? your intentions or the belief that homosexuality is sin? Deep down I believe that two people of the same sex who love each other are blessed by God. I cannot possibly believe that a God would not bless 2 consenting adult's love for each other because of their genitals. I think of that verse that says that there is no male or female in Christ.

Deep down you know that I am not saying or doing the things you try to say I'm doing, in some attempt to make people think that only crazy people like Phelps..........

Might want to post the whole scripture you referred to so it can be taken in context, since it has nothing to do with what we are speaking of here. Just a thought. You know there is a difference in saying it doesn't matter if you are male or female, free or slave, etc., because salvation is for all. Trying to make that scripture say that homosexuality isn't a sin, when it is saying all can be saved well.....................

 

[davedjy]

Do you not believe that God hates sin? Do you not believe that God loves us so much that He sent His son to die for us? Do you not believe that without confession and repentance we are not saved?

Yet, repentance is an act upon your part, which as Ephesians describes, we are saved by grace, not by works.

How confusing it is to be preceived as a bigot, because we believe what the Bible say, and how sad ........... Not sure how believing those things makes anyone preceived as a bigot, but whatever.

You are believing an interpretation of the Bible, while simultaneously ignoring gays and lesbians for who they truly are. You ignore a valid sexual orientation where people are attracted to the same sex, and call those same sex acts as "sin". Any way you slice it, it's the same thing...

Dang could that be because you don't know all gays and lesbians? Could it be because not all gays/lesbians are on message boards or in the news talking about how they feel and what they are going through? Knowing that there are people all over the world suffering in their sinful states could never make me feel better, and frankly trying to make people think that is bearing false witness about me. I would ask that you please stop. I thought is I pointed out what you were doing in the last post you would understand, but you didn't so I will come out and ask you to please stop trying to make it look like I am thinking and /or saying things that I am not.

In it, your quote said this:

You know sometimes God has to give us up to our sin, because sometimes we have to hit rock bottom to wake up to the fact of what we are doing.

...so how was I making it look like you were saying something that you didn't?

Deep down you know that I am not saying or doing the things you try to say I'm doing, in some attempt to make people think that only crazy people like Phelps..........

My point w/that, is that many feel their intentions are correct, that doesn't make it right. Although, that point can be used against me as well for the anti-gay arguers.

Might want to post the whole scripture you referred to so it can be taken in context, since it has nothing to do with what we are speaking of here. Just a thought. You know there is a difference in saying it doesn't matter if you are male or female, free or slave, etc., because salvation is for all. Trying to make that scripture say that homosexuality isn't a sin, when it is saying all can be saved well.....................

As I've stated, I've used interpretations of the clobber passages, so I've never used this particular verse in that context, but it could be used as an interpretation that way. Does your soul have a sex to it?
I take the verse at face value to what it says...that there is no male or female in Christ, it says "for you are all one in Christ Jesus".

 

[savedandhappy1]

Yet, repentance is an act upon your part, which as Ephesians describes, we are saved by grace, not by works.

Since you didn't even touch on the important part of that post I will just have to pray that you know and believe:

Do you not believe that God hates sin? Do you not believe that God loves us so much that He sent His son to die for us?

In response to the only thing you addressed, Jesus said except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Luke 13:2-5
2And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?

3I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
4Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem? 5I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Romans 10:9-12
9That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

James 2:14-20
14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

You are believing an interpretation of the Bible, while simultaneously ignoring gays and lesbians for who they truly are. You ignore a valid sexual orientation where people are attracted to the same sex, and call those same sex acts as "sin". Any way you slice it, it's the same thing...

Who man says they truely are, not who God says they truely are to be.

Again valid sexual orientation defined by man not by God.

Nope not the same thing, but if you say it enough maybe it will become true to you no matter how much it isn't.

In it, your quote said this:

...so how was I making it look like you were saying something that you didn't?

Are you really having this much trouble putting the whole thought together in my post or do you just not have any true answers to them?

You are making the fact that I said sometimes the Lord has to wait till we hit rock bottom before He can get us to understand how much we need Him. So you want to tell me how that says I am happy about people having to hit rock bottom?

Again, please stop trying to change my words and make them say something they are not saying. Frankly, most people would understand that to me all of us have probably had to hit rock bottom or get close to it before fully surrendering to the Lord.

Golly, darn that would even mean me, and Oh yeah me really happy when I have to be chastise by the Lord, or allowed to follow my own path because I think I know best.

My point w/that, is that many feel their intentions are correct, that doesn't make it right. Although, that point can be used against me as well for the anti-gay arguers.

So this means I should start trying to make people think you are saying and doing things that you really aren't? Sorry, thats not my way.

As I've stated, I've used interpretations of the clobber passages, so I've never used this particular verse in that context, but it could be used as an interpretation that way. Does your soul have a sex to it?
I take the verse at face value to what it says...that there is no male or female in Christ, it says "for you are all one in Christ Jesus".

It would be a big leap to read these scriptures as a whole and take them in context to get them to mean what you want to use them for.

Also if you want to go that route, the bible says that the joining of a man and woman become one flesh like we and Christ become one spirit. Again plainly points out that it is man and woman, not man and man.

 

[davedjy]

Since you didn't even touch on the important part of that post I will just have to pray that you know and believe:



In response to the only thing you addressed, Jesus said except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Luke 13:2-5
2And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?

3I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
4Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem? 5I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Romans 10:9-12
9That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

James 2:14-20
14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

I believe in Eternal security...which these verses do not refute. I do however, believe in the necessity of repenting of your sins, I don't believe that you go to hell if you don't repent of every one. As stated to Mercyburst, I don't use this as a justification for homosexuality, I argued eternal security before I believed homosexuality was a gift from God.



What about the backslider?

"For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire." 1 Corinthians 3:11-15





Ephesians 1:13-14 (KJV)
13In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.


. . .for he hath said, I WILL NEVER LEAVE THEE, nor forsake thee." Hebrews 13:5



". . . him that cometh to me I WILL IN NO WISE CAST OUT." John 6:37


"And THE LORD. . . WILL PRESERVE ME unto his heavenly kingdom:. . ." 2 Timothy 4:18


We are KEPT by the POWER of God

"Who are KEPT BY THE POWER OF GOD through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time." 1 Peter 1:5

"Now unto him that is able TO KEEP YOU from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy," Jude 24

We are saved to the UTTERMOST

"Wherefore he is able also to save them to the UTTERMOST that come unto God by him,. . ." Hebrews 7:25








" NOT BY WORKS of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us,. . ." Titus 3:5

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: NOT OF WORKS, lest any man should boast." Ephesians 2:8,9




"For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, SHALL BE ABLE TO SEPARATE US from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38

"My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand." John 10:29

Again valid sexual orientation defined by man not by God.

The identification of the orientation might have been made by man, but there isn't any proof that the orientation was created by man. Man defines what a sex is geared towards, hence we put into human terms what is observed.

Nope not the same thing, but if you say it enough maybe it will become true to you no matter how much it isn't.

I am not alone in my belief that those who call try converting gays and lesbians, do it out of justifying their own bigotry. It's a religious agenda, anyway you look at it, but of course it is all a matter of personal opinion.

You are making the fact that I said sometimes the Lord has to wait till we hit rock bottom before He can get us to understand how much we need Him. So you want to tell me how that says I am happy about people having to hit rock bottom?

Where did I say you were happy about people having to hit rock bottom? talk about changing what someone said.

Again, please stop trying to change my words and make them say something they are not saying. Frankly, most people would understand that to me all of us have probably had to hit rock bottom or get close to it before fully surrendering to the Lord.

My point was not that you are happy that you think we hit rock bottom, but that you somehow use that term to relate to someone will eventually get to that point with this sexual orientation. I find it interesting you keep accusing me of putting words in your mouth, or accusing you of saying something you didn't, when YOU were the one believing I said something that I never did.

So this means I should start trying to make people think you are saying and doing things that you really aren't? Sorry, thats not my way.

No, I don't see how you arrived at that question for a conclusion of what I said at all!

It would be a big leap to read these scriptures as a whole and take them in context to get them to mean what you want to use them for.

There isn't a huge leap, I just use historical context, and the original language for proof. 1 Cor. 6:9 is an unknown word, and the rest of the passages are connected with pagan worship and idolatry.

Also if you want to go that route, the bible says that the joining of a man and woman become one flesh like we and Christ become one spirit. Again plainly points out that it is man and woman, not man and man.

Yes, but as stated it does not say it can't be a man and a man or a woman and a woman.

I do find it interesting in 2 Sam 1:26 it says:

I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women.

 

[savedandhappy1]

I believe in Eternal security...which these verses do not refute. I do however, believe in the necessity of repenting of your sins, I don't believe that you go to hell if you don't repent of every one. As stated to Mercyburst, I don't use this as a justification for homosexuality, I argued eternal security before I believed homosexuality was a gift from God.

I believe in eternal security also, so not real sure what that has to do with this.

What about the backslider?

"For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire." 1 Corinthians 3:11-15

As I have said many times you have to take the bible as a whole, and to leave it in context. Is your posting those scriptures supposed to take away or change the meaning of the others?

It we are saved by GRACE through FAITH, which is what the Bible says that because of that salvation we will be able to see the different new person in Christ because of their works.

So do you believe that you can believe in God, and that He sent His Son, but no change need be made? You know even the demons know these things, but they won't be going to heaven.

If someone is backslidden, they have to back sliding from something, so they are saved, They have just stumbled and/or even fallen, but it pleases our Lord when we pick ourselves up and continue in the work of the Lord.

I am not alone in my belief that those who call try converting gays and lesbians, do it out of justifying their own bigotry. It's a religious agenda, anyway you look at it, but of course it is all a matter of personal opinion.

So I have some religious agenda and am a bigot, you got to love it.

I commented on this stuff on another post to you before I knew you were even going to go here, so you can read that post not going to type it again.

Will look to see if there is anything else that I really need to respond to later. I have a religious bigots agenda meeting to attend, and a sick grandson I am taking care of.

 

[davedjy]

I believe in eternal security also, so not real sure what that has to do with this.

I thought u were making the point that repentance was necessary for salvation, right? eternal security is the belief that when you are once saved, you are always saved.

As I have said many times you have to take the bible as a whole, and to leave it in context. Is your posting those scriptures supposed to take away or change the meaning of the others?

No, what I posted is not to refute the Scriptures, but to highlight eternal security. As I stated, the Scriptures you posted don't disprove Eternal Security.

So do you believe that you can believe in God, and that He sent His Son, but no change need be made? You know even the demons know these things, but they won't be going to heaven.

I believe that you need to try your best to follow Christ, but I also believe in the necessity of leaving that up to God to judge. He is the one who will ultimately decide who is of Him and who isn't, of course.

If someone is backslidden, they have to back sliding from something, so they are saved, They have just stumbled and/or even fallen, but it pleases our Lord when we pick ourselves up and continue in the work of the Lord.

Which is why I said that repentance is necessary in our walks with Christ.

So I have some religious agenda and am a bigot, you got to love it.

You aren't trying to convert them for any other reason than your beliefs that homosexuality is a sin, right? that would be from a religious agenda standpoint, not because of any other reason. Using the Bible to try to tell someone that their sexual expression to someone because it is the same gender, is bigotry, but that is my opinion.

Will look to see if there is anything else that I really need to respond to later. I have a religious bigots agenda meeting to attend, and a sick grandson I am taking care of.

I don't know what your point of taking it personally is, since that was aimed at anyone who calls it a sin. Discrediting someone's sexual orientation, calling it a sin, or believing someone has been "given over" to satan for the way they are, is why I believe that.

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

Yes, but as stated it does not say it can't be a man and a man or a woman and a woman.

I do find it interesting in 2 Sam 1:26 it says:

I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women.

Lol dave, grasping at straws now bro

 

[davedjy]

Lol dave, grasping at straws now bro

No grasping at straws, I've never needed to do that...

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

No grasping at straws, I've never needed to do that...

Then why the jonathan and david reference? Is that even a debate point? Or does it just shift the focus?
All of a sudden everyone has super homo-sensors when it comes to those passages, even though it has nothing to do with same-sex sex.

So now if I have a close relationship with another guy (non sexual), I have to worry about being called gay by people on both sides of the fence

 

[savedandhappy1]

I thought u were making the point that repentance was necessary for salvation, right? eternal security is the belief that when you are once saved, you are always saved.

If you are truely saved it will be seen by our works the Bible says, and part of those works is confession and repentance. If we don't have those things one would have to wonder if they truely have surrender their life to the Lord.

No, what I posted is not to refute the Scriptures, but to highlight eternal security. As I stated, the Scriptures you posted don't disprove Eternal Security.

Why would they disprove Eternal Security and why would I want to?

I believe that you need to try your best to follow Christ, but I also believe in the necessity of leaving that up to God to judge. He is the one who will ultimately decide who is of Him and who isn't, of course.

Yes, He is the one who knows and will do the judging, but if I had to live my life not knowing if I am of Him or not would totally go against anything that the Bible says we should know. It also goes against all the scriptures that tell us we will be known by our fruits, and that bad fruit doesn't come from a good tree or good fruit from a bad.

Which is why I said that repentance is necessary in our walks with Christ.

You aren't trying to convert them for any other reason than your beliefs that homosexuality is a sin, right? that would be from a religious agenda standpoint, not because of any other reason. Using the Bible to try to tell someone that their sexual expression to someone because it is the same gender, is bigotry, but that is my opinion.

By saying convert are you meaning convert to a denomination or are you meaning salvation?

Since we are told to go forth teaching all nations, planting seeds and maybe even at times being the one who does the harvesting(leads someone to the Lord/salvation), then I guess the Lord gave us an agenda. This would be to grow the Kingdom of God by helping to show how we all are sinners and in need of a Saviour. If you call that an agenda, then yes the Lord gave me an agenda, and I will do my best to allow the Lord to use me for this.

I don't know what your point of taking it personally is, since that was aimed at anyone who calls it a sin.

Originally Posted by davidjy
I am not alone in my belief that those who call try converting gays and lesbians, do it out of justifying their own bigotry. It's a religious agenda, anyway you look at it, but of course it is all a matter of personal opinion.

Let's see, since I believe that homosexuality is a sin, then that would put me on that list of people you say are bigots and have a religious agenda. So that would mean that it was a personnel attack, wouldn't it?

Discrediting someone's sexual orientation, calling it a sin, or believing someone has been "given over" to satan for the way they are, is why I believe that.

If someones sexual orientation is a sin, then it is no more a discrediting than it is to tell a liar, murderer, adulterer, etc. that what they are doing is a sin. So wanting and praying that someone is able to see that they are doing something that the Bible says will keep them from inheriting the Kingdom of God, is hateful, bigotry and a religious agenda?

Quilty as charged, because since it is the will of the Lord that all come to him, and that they don't perish, well.....................I will do as He leads. I will continue to, by the best of my ability follow His will and allow Him to use me daily for the increasing of His Kingdom. The Bible tells us that things that are good will be called bad, and things that are bad will be said to be good in the last days. Kind of makes it clear that daily we are getting closer and closer to His return, which also makes it clear that time is short and we should be working even harder for souls.

It also makes it clear that the great deceiver is also working hard to keep people from coming to the saving knowledge of the Lord.

They, according to the scriptures are "given over" to their own desires/lusts, because that is what the word says happens. This isn't something I made up, as shown, it is me repeating the teaching given us to help us follow the will of God.