i know most of us have read john's gospel where it talks about jesus being the word....
and i have heard the word 'mamre' or something similar, and discussion of 'targums' but please can someone shed some light on this passage for me from a judaic position.
what is meant by 'word' (i already know it means logos, and am aware of 'logos' as a greek philosophical concept, but i am looking for a hebraic slant).
hope someone can help me....
check this out
Jesus said no one has seen the Father or heard his voice
Jn 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.
we must ask ourselves who did Moses and the 70 elders see?
we must ask ourselves who did the Israelites hear on the mount?
1: And he said unto Moses, Come up unto the LORD, thou, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel; and worship ye afar off.
2: And Moses alone shall come near the LORD: but they shall not come nigh; neither shall the people go up with him.
3: And Moses came and told the people all the words of the LORD, and all the judgments: and all the people answered with one voice, and said, All the words which the LORD hath said will we do.
4: And Moses wrote all the words of the LORD, and rose up early in the morning, and builded an altar under the hill, and twelve pillars, according to the twelve tribes of Israel.
5: And he sent young men of the children of Israel, which offered burnt offerings, and sacrificed peace offerings of oxen unto the LORD.
6: And Moses took half of the blood, and put it in basons; and half of the blood he sprinkled on the altar.
7: And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient.
8: And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
9: Then went up Moses, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel:
10: And they saw the God of Israel
: and there was under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in his clearness.
11: And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God, and did eat and drink.
1: Now therefore hearken, O Israel, unto the statutes and unto the judgments, which I teach you, for to do them, that ye may live, and go in and possess the land which the LORD God of your fathers giveth you.
2: Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.
8: And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?
10: Specially the day that thou stoodest before the LORD thy God in Horeb, when the LORD said unto me, Gather me the people together, and I will make them hear my words, that they may learn to fear me all the days that they shall live upon the earth, and that they may teach their children.
11: And ye came near and stood under the mountain; and the mountain burned with fire unto the midst of heaven, with darkness, clouds, and thick darkness.
12: And the LORD spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only ye heard a voice.
13: And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments;
and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
according to Jesus they did not hear the Father's voice
so it must be Jesus voice that Israel heard.
it's Jesus words that man has heard and read.