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"Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee;"
~Genesis 3:18a~
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"Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee;""The rose’s rarest essence lives in the thorn".
~Jalaluddin Rumi~
In the spiritual path I follow the rose is an image often used. The image goes something like this: Human Beings start out as a tiny rose bud with thorns. The flower of the rose is pictured as our soul. And our soul in the spiritual path I follow is experienced as an activity of God. The thorns are pictured as our ego self. As the rose unfolds our soul (God) begins to shine and we become more beautiful. Yes the thorns are still there, but the flower (our soul) as it unfolds becomes what we see and the thorns become almost invisible in the beauty of what we see and smell because of the light shining from the flowering rose.
What I'm finding interesting is that your looking at the thorns. But if we want to see God in people we need to be looking at the flower of their being.
Jesus is affectionately referred to as "the Rose of Sharon."Let's also not forget the Luther Rose, a prominent Protestant symbol.
Jesus is affectionately referred to as "the Rose of Sharon."
Song 2:1 I am the rose of Sharon, and the lily of the valleys.
Methinks someone needs a course in typology.You think Jesus is the woman in the Song of Songs? And that it was always meant to describe him?
I know there's a long ecclesiastical tradition of re-interpreting this highly erotic love poetry as an allegory for the relationship between Christ and the Church, buuut that one usually puts the Church in the Woman's position and Jesus in the role of the groom.
Methinks someone needs a course in typology.
Did you know that the Tabernacle in the Wilderness is a three-dimensional representation of Jesus Christ?
Everything about that Tabernacle depicts some aspect of Him.
For example, the acacia boards overlaid with gold speak of Jesus as "a root out of a dry ground" (acacia wood); and the gold represents His deity.
Even the fence surrounding it was held up with sixty fence posts, each with silver blocks, procured from half-shekel offerings (or tax, I can't remember which).
Thus sixty half-shekels: a reference to the thirty pieces of silver Jesus was betrayed for.
Hi Robban.Just one side.
Hi Robban.
I have a question that isn't at all related to this thread, but I see you here and thought I'd ask. I'm reading Matthew Fox's "Meister Eckhart: A Mystic-Warrior for Our Times". He mentions the "Shekinah" of the Jewish tradition. Fox writes that it "depicts the presence of God and the presence of Divine glory, localizing it and making it real."
Are you able to provide more insight into "Shekinah" than the brief couple of sentences that Fox wrote that I quoted above?
Thanks.
I thank you for the reference.Hi dlamberth,
A good article I would say is by Rabbieinu Yaakov Abuchatzeira.
"Rectifying the Divine Presence"
"Be strong and courageous and use all of your efforts to restore the "Shechina".
It can be thought that it was not so much Adam and Eve
was thrown out of the garden but,
that the Divine presence withdrew,
and was gradually drawn down with a manifestation on
Mt Sinai.
There is an whole ocean of info to be had.
I thank you for the reference.
I have the article up on my computer.
Because eternal life is the major end-goal of Christianity, and showing that one's own lifespan has increased is evidence that the end-goal is likely achievable.
Peace. Much greater peace than before I undertook the Path.
It is plainly evident that cConscious intention drives our every action.
The power of your own conscious intention is one alternative.
My end-goal is not to become nothing, but the cessation of suffering. Why do you pursue the end of suffering?
Their own realm.
I am agnostic on the subject. I cannot know the answer, and pursuit of guesses only adds to suffering.
Yes, if not expressed through wise example.
You gave that example yourself: "I think i already mentioned this. When God speaks to me it is in the form of the Holy Spirit. This experience is not audible in my heart by rather like a spiritual intuition , in my heart."
That is for a Christian to answer.
Attachments to the human state, human organs of perception, delusion, aversions, moderate degrees of virtue, etc.
Because attachments to guesses about who created the earth is suffering.
I just know that the Law of Kamma is in effect. I don't know "who" might have created it.
The flame unbinds from its fuel, and its constituent elements dissipates.
I'm not sure how its a no true scotsman, though I think many cultures were more humane than the Israelites. That doesn't generally refer to their contemporaries, though.
You can believe what you want. I believe the Bible is a human text.
I've referenced it twice, I guess that makes it the majority. In this case its a particularly good example of the petty and arbitrary nature of "God's justice" as described. My morality is derived mostly from the principles of Western liberalism and Secular Humanism.
Please refer to my original post listening some example scriptures. I can add more if needed.
You're going to have be more clear where I did this, as I do not believe I did.
Though Christianity and Islam are both Abrahamic faiths, they do share much in common. The violence in Christianity and Islam are quite different and the commands to kill are definitely differing. There's no one-to-one comparison that fits will.
No conflation needed.
As I recall you originally made queries to me asking me to offer my beliefs and back them up, which I have done. You can reject them all you like, though I hope you understand why I feel the way that I do.
Yes; suffering can potentially build character and give strength to an observantly wise individual. However, we understand that character and strength are not end-goals in and of themselves; we understand that the end-goal of such improvements is ultimately to overcome suffering.Hey hey ananda
Thank you for all your replies. Im starting to understand your position a lot more.
Lets concentrate on one area; suffering.
Do you believe moderate suffering and at the right time - and not all the time - can build character and strengthen the individual?
Cheers
It sure does, doesn't it?Such also describes the Buddhist Eightfold Path; enduring its progressive practice builds character ...
There was no indication that his wife was bossy or his child whiny. He went to search for and to attain the most supreme prize possible - surpassing all other things in the world - and returned to share that prize with his wife and child. I see no problem with that.It sure does, doesn't it?
Especially the second path, which justtifies a father leaving his wife and son behind.
In a bad marriage? wife bossy and kids whiny?
No problem.
Become a Buddhist and follow the Eightfold Path to enlightenment.
Yes, sir ... it builds character alright.
Yes, there is a possibility that he was only following Jesus' admonition to hate his wife and children (Luke 14:26). Are you suggesting that he should be jailed because he didn't do enough - that he should have instead taken his child to dash him against a rock (Psalms 137:9) before leaving with hatred?A character that needs to go to jail.
How about we just consider them a mission field and not get so drastic?All people who believe Jesus never existed are enemies to christianity and should be treated as such
All people who believe Jesus never existed are enemies to christianity and should be treated as such
It's how you define enemy butt not all ideologies wish to kill there foes...but let's be honest you wish to consign Jesus to the fictional category of the liberar with superman so the gloves are off so to speakAnd how would you treat me or encourage others to treat me, specifically?
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