My Creationism vs Intelligent Design Challenge

[Belk]

From the OP:

Ah, fair enough. Still no since it is a new wrinkle trying to put a pseudo scientific face on creationism where classic creationism stood opposed to science.

 

[AV1611VET]

Ah, fair enough. Still no since it is a new wrinkle trying to put a pseudo scientific face on creationism where classic creationism stood opposed to science.

Creationism + Science = Intelligent Design

- put another way -

Creationism - Faith = Intelligent Design

 

[Belk]

Creationism + Science = Intelligent Design

- put another way -

Creationism - Faith = Intelligent Design

I would say pseudo science but other then that I agree.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I have the test,it just takes a long time to complete

So you do not have a test. One of the requirements was that it was reasonable.

Not positive but that could be why they are called creationists?
I'm a Theistic Evolutionist, isn't that a little different?

No, if a rock falls there is no need to invoke a god. What a creationist needs to find is something that could not have happened without a god.

 

[AV1611VET]

What a creationist needs to find is something that could not have happened without a god.

We creationists have already found something.

Else we wouldn't be creationists.

 

[Subduction Zone]

We creationists have already found something.

Else we wouldn't be creationists.

What you "found" never happened. You actually harm Christianity by insisting that the parts of the Bible that are morality tales at best are true. There really is no difference between creationists and Flat Earthers.

 

[AV1611VET]

You actually harm Christianity by insisting that the parts of the Bible that are morality tales at best are true.

Cain kills Abel and that's a 'morality tale' to you?

Then was Ted Bundy executed for teaching us that women shouldn't accept rides from strangers?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Cain kills Abel and that's a 'morality tale' to you?

Then was Ted Bundy executed for teaching us that women shouldn't accept rides from strangers?

I am sorry that your morals are undeveloped. The morals were in what was done with him.
And why do you keep conflating reality with fantasy?

 

[MissRowy]

You might want to find a different example AV. I can sort of see where you are coming from but others might not. I don't mean any offense to anyone saying that btw

 

[AV1611VET]

You might want to find a different example AV. I can sort of see where you are coming from but others might not. I don't mean any offense to anyone saying that btw

Thank you, Miss Rowy, but this poll closes after seven days and I'm genuinely interested in its final outcome.

After that, I'll probably petition to have it closed down due to the usual descending into a maelstrom.

 

[MissRowy]

Good point!

 

[Kylie]

Is Creationism the same thing as Intelligent Design?

Please note, I am asking if Creationism is the same thing as Intelligent Design.

I am not asking if Intelligent Design is the same thing as Creationism.

Some people think Creationism gave rise to Intelligent Design.

I don't, and I'm asking if Creationism is the same thing as Intelligent Design.

As far as the definitions of the two terms are concerned, use your own understanding.

I would define "Intelligent Design" as the idea that some intelligent entity designed the universe in such a way as to have its current configuration. It may include the idea that the intelligent entity designed the universe for the habitation of Humans, but it may not. It may also include the idea that the intelligent entity did not design the entire universe, but only parts of it - setting the Earth at the correct distance from the sun for water to exist in all three states, for example.

I would define creationism as the idea that a God created the universe. Since all religions tend to be human-centric, I would say that all ideas of creationism center on the point that this god created the universe for humanity. Creationism may include the idea that the particular god involved created the universe literally as described in the Bible or other holy text, but it can also take the idea that the god created the world as described by science.

Using these definitions, creationism would seem to be in the set of intelligent design, but there could be other interpretations of intelligent design that would not be interpreted as creationism.

(As to whether creationism gave rise to intelligent design, I think it is quite likely that creationists could have made their ideas more open so they did not refer to a particular theological stance, probably as an attempt to get ID taught as a valid idea. This could result in people becoming more open to the idea of creationism. A foot in the door, as it were. I know you didn't ask, but I feel it is relevant, as I have not really found any ID proponents who do not also believe in some kind of creationism.)

 

[TLK Valentine]

I voted no. Creationism doesn't have nearly as much legalese trickery or doubletalk to pass it off as "science" as ID does...

...noting, of course, that for all ID does have, it doesn't work.

 

[AV1611VET]

Creationism doesn't have nearly as much legalese trickery or doubletalk to pass it off as "science" as ID does...

Creationism + Science = Intelligent Design

Pwn the science, and you pwn Intelligent Design.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Creationism + Science = Intelligent Design

Pwn the science, and you pwn Intelligent Design.

.....What 'Science'??

 

[Subduction Zone]

.....What 'Science'??

He seems to have confalted "Sciency" with "Science":

 

[Loudmouth]

A cloud formation, something is there.....moisture

For the entire history of the universe there has been energy and/or matter.

God did it every time we just didn't know how ha ha. I'm not saying God did there is no other answer. That would be closed minded. I feel like to say God never did anything is also closed minded Of you can't say how it was done, you can't rule it out. I think people get hung upon the deity of God. I see it as "Good Orderly Direction" a creative force with no body.

Where is there any evidence that God did anything?

 

[rturner76]

For the entire history of the universe there has been energy and/or matter.



Where is there any evidence that God did anything?

I guess the evidence is found through either deductive reason or the law of cause and effect. In order for something to be built, there must be a builder right?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Creationism + Science = Intelligent Design

Wrong as always, AV. Where's the science?

Pwn the science, and you pwn Intelligent Design.

Denial =/= pwnage.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I guess the evidence is found through either deductive reason or the law of cause and effect. In order for something to be built, there must be a builder right?

Bad analogy. It appears that you are trying to claim that the universe was "built".