Moving to Mac

[PennylessZ28]

Yeah, so I've been die hard build your own PC forever. Running windows XP Pro and all.

Anyhow, I do a lot of graphics developement, web developement & programing, along with video.

After some research it seems like MAC is the way to go. Specially the new G5 Power MAC.

But gosh darn, they are so expensive. WHY!!!!

Of course they are using great parts.

Now I know reasons why to switch I know the pro's but hereing about the cons is harder.

Just wanted to hear from anyone who uses both a MAC and PC together on a regular basis.

My home network is about 5 PC's if I put a MAC on it, it will be 4. My Laptop is also windows/linux based so I want it to communicate with it as well.

 

[Livinloud316]

this doesn't help your question in any way but I had to say this

NNOOOO!!!!!! DOn't go to the DARK SIDE!!!!!!

It's been proven that Macs are a tool of the Devil

 

[Dracil]

You have my sympathies, PennylessZ28.

But seriously, for what you're gonna do though, Macs are the way to go. The only problem with Apple products is that they're always overpriced, which you've noticed yourself.

Common complaints by Mac users I've heard though are lack of software, generally later releases if the software is cross-platform, and also more incompatibilities.

And if you've ever seen the Drunkgamer switch paraody, you know that upgrading Macs are easy. You just toss the old one in the trash, and buy a new one.

 

[seebs]

My primary desktop platform is NetBSD. I have a laptop which dual-boots NetBSD and Windows XP. I have a Mac, and I have a machine which dual-boots Linux and Windows 98. 90% of the real work is done in NetBSD. 9% on Mac, 1% on Windows.

What kinds of questions do you have?

And yeah, macs are pricey. My advice: Buy the machine as stripped-down as you can, buy larger hard drive and memory elsewhere. I like Small Dog Electronics:

http://www.smalldog.com/

 

[stray bullet]

Well, I use all sorts of platforms constantly. Seems a lot of people have strong feelings about one over another. I don't. I'm not that fond of Apple or Microsoft, nor their products a lot of hte time. I used to work at a store that delt only with macs. Did just about everything there. At home I use just about everything.

I do think that a lot of people's view of Macs is based on rumor, poor experience or misunderstanding. If I never used a Windows-based PC, I'd probably think they were total piece of garbage.

Anyways, the "their expensive line" really isn't true. Some of their consumer oriented products, like their iBooks, are very competitive if not cheaper than their PC counterparts. They seem expensive because they sharply defined their product line since they reorganized their company in 1997 because their disorganization and branching nearly killed their company. There are "consumer" and "professional" models and "portable" and "desktop" categories within them.

Apple doesn't offer a $699 tower for browsing the internet and using Office like Dell and others. Their desktop towers are only for heavy duty work. It is not that their products are more expensive, they just don't bother making low end desktop towers. They want home users buying iMacs and iBooks, which I think this is a really stupid and arrogant business model, but whatever.

I really don't think you'll have any problems with one. Like all things, there will be differences that make you happy and tick you off. As far as networking, OS X Macs integrate into PC networks.

 

[PennylessZ28]

Well, I use all sorts of platforms constantly. Seems a lot of people have strong feelings about one over another. I don't. I'm not that fond of Apple or Microsoft, nor their products a lot of hte time. I used to work at a store that delt only with macs. Did just about everything there. At home I use just about everything.

I do think that a lot of people's view of Macs is based on rumor, poor experience or misunderstanding. If I never used a Windows-based PC, I'd probably think they were total piece of garbage.

Anyways, the "their expensive line" really isn't true. Some of their consumer oriented products, like their iBooks, are very competitive if not cheaper than their PC counterparts. They seem expensive because they sharply defined their product line since they reorganized their company in 1997 because their disorganization and branching nearly killed their company. There are "consumer" and "professional" models and "portable" and "desktop" categories within them.

Apple doesn't offer a $699 tower for browsing the internet and using Office like Dell and others. Their desktop towers are only for heavy duty work. It is not that their products are more expensive, they just don't bother making low end desktop towers. They want home users buying iMacs and iBooks, which I think this is a really stupid and arrogant business model, but whatever.

I really don't think you'll have any problems with one. Like all things, there will be differences that make you happy and tick you off. As far as networking, OS X Macs integrate into PC networks.

This is very true, their current G5 Powermacs are decked out alot way more than most Dell's.

As fair as people saying there isn't a lot of software, well this isn't true. There is a lot of software avliable for them now adays.

I asked a friend to tell me about why he likes Mac and this is his reply

Yes, the G5 with a bunch of RAM has enough power for just about anything you could want to do, and will support the apps to do it. It will let you surf, chat (incl. video chat), listen to MP3's without a problem. It's also a spectacular platform for video editing if that's your thing.

As a web developer, I prefer the Mac because....

Well, a lot of reasons that aren't specific to web development, but:

- The machine came installed with Apache, PHP, MySQL, and Perl, and all I had to do to get them working was click a button. This makes it super-easy to test web apps locally. I can also turn the server on and off, or restart it, without rebooting the whole OS.
- Being on a minority platform encourages me to build to standards rather than to what IE manages to render correctly, which results in more elegant, maintainable code.
- BBEdit (the single best app out there for any sort of coding, from HTML to PHP to Java to Objective-C to.... you get the point). Simply an amazing app, and I'm not sure how to describe it in words. ( http://www.barebones.com )
- Color management is easy easy easy.

The only thing to keep in mind is that you'll probably want Virtual PC on your Mac or a token Windows box somewhere handy to test rendering in IE for Windows (most of the Mac browsers support nifty standards-based features like near-complete CSS 2 support and some CSS 3, or partial transparency for .PNG images, that MS has been lagging in, and if you're testing on Mac, occasionally you'll come up with something IE doesn't yet have).



The fact is, web development is pretty similar on either platform. I just prefer the Mac because I find it more efficient and pleasant to work on in general.

More general reasons I prefer Mac:

- The workflow is smoother, for a lot of reasons. For example, I can have a dozen apps open without having to continually sort out which app or window I'm selecting from the taskbar.
- This means I spend more time working and less time fighting the OS.
- Oh, and the BIG ONE: less time spent rebooting and worrying about viruses, worms, and spyware.
- I could go on and on. Never mind me.


As for the tools on OS X:

- Photoshop is spectacular. Ditto for Illustrator, and Macromedia Freehand and Flash. BTW, if you have a registered copy for Windows, you can write to Adobe, and if you pledge to destroy the Windows disk, they'll send you a Mac disk for the same version of the app for just a shipping and handling fee. Or you can upgrade from an older PS (or Illustrator or whatever) for Windows to the latest Mac version for the same price as the upgrade to a Windows version.

- Dreamweaver MX moves like molasses (granted, my machine is nowhere near the same league as a decked-out G5), but Dreamweaver 2004 is supposed to be better. If a graphical DW-type web development app is important to you, I believe there are a few substitutes out there.

- You probably don't need antivirus, although it generally doesn't hurt.


Anyhow, you're absolutely right, it takes a little bit of getting used to, but for someone like you seem to be who is very comfortable with computers, you'll be able to use it within the first few minutes - you may just spend a few days wondering where X, Y, and Z are (I once heard the advice that the best way to get accustomed to using a Mac after Windows is to "stop trying to figure out how the computer would do it, and ask yourself how you'd do it").

You might find it worth your while to drop by an Apple Store if there's one in your area and just spend a little while futzing around with the machines. You could also try a CompUSA, but they sometimes take very poor care of their Macs (f'rinstance don't turn them on).

OK, enough rambling. Hope that answered some of your questions.

 

[rmills]

PennylessZ28, sounds like you have discovered why macs are so expensive. I use both on a daily basis, both serve their purposes well. Mac builds a better machine for audio and video. I run three casinos on macs for all digital video, and one recording studio on macs for huge digital audio interfaces. I stated this before in another thread, if you use a G-5 for video, max out the RAM immediatly and get a real video card, preferably multi monitor support starting at 256mb of DDR. You will be the industry standard for video with this setup. I have a Canon XL1S that I got for video work on my personal G-5s and I love the set up. Huge video creations with this stuff!

The truth is that a PC home build can be just as effective with Linux as a typical mac but the lack of software is disapointing. Keep the old P-4 home builds around, but you will fall deep in love with mac very fast.

 

[PennylessZ28]

PennylessZ28, sounds like you have discovered why macs are so expensive. I use both on a daily basis, both serve their purposes well. Mac builds a better machine for audio and video. I run three casinos on macs for all digital video, and one recording studio on macs for huge digital audio interfaces. I stated this before in another thread, if you use a G-5 for video, max out the RAM immediatly and get a real video card, preferably multi monitor support starting at 256mb of DDR. You will be the industry standard for video with this setup. I have a Canon XL1S that I got for video work on my personal G-5s and I love the set up. Huge video creations with this stuff!

The truth is that a PC home build can be just as effective with Linux as a typical mac but the lack of software is disapointing. Keep the old P-4 home builds around, but you will fall deep in love with mac very fast.

I have a very reliable brand new P4 HP laptop I bought that makes me very happy for mobility. It's dual boot, XP and Linux.

My home built P4 box although I just rebuilt and upgraded last month just isn't cutting it anymore.

I've been researching Mac and frankly... it's the way to go.

 

[PennylessZ28]

The reasons why I am moving to a Mac are simple:

- Unix. Command line on Windows is a joke. I want a computer that can easily run Apache, MySQL, and Perl in the environment for which they were originally programmed. Windows can run all that stuff, but why bother when you can go with BSD?

- Professional GUI to go with the Unix. Linux will never be big on the desktop until they have a professionally designed GUI to go with it. I don't care how much power the OS has under the hood if the UI is clunky. I want the command line, but I also need to use the latest desktop applications like Photoshop (and spare me your GIMP recommendations. As if.).

- Power. 95% of my time on the computer is spent writing email, browsing the Web, listening to MP3s, coding HTML/Php/Mysql, and a lot of Photoshop with some video editing here and there. Frankly I see the G5 as the last computer I'll need to upgrade in a long time. I upgrade my PC compents like every couple of months to stay ahead of the pack, but this Power Mac looks like it will remian ahead of the game for years. Plus it's the worlds fastest.


- Happy customers. I know lots of people who know things about stuff. You know the type...they have the answers to all of your technical questions. I trust the opinions of these people about computers and personal technology. They all have iBooks and TiBooks or a G4 ...and they love them.

- The Apple benevolent dictatorship. Apple closely controls both the hardware and the software associated with the Mac. I used to think this was a bad thing...a de facto dictatorship that drove prices up on the hardware and discouraged innovation on the software side. At this point, after wrestling with hardware incompatibilities on Windows for years (No Win2000 driver for some weirdo graphics card in your laptop? Too bad...you can't upgrade, sorry.), I still think Apple has that dictatorial power over their system, but I'm willing to embrace that. I just want my computer to work for the things I want to do with it, and if I have to pay a little more for it or not have access to all the latest software, so be it. Sometimes a benevolent dictatorship is better than a system with no accountability (Dell tech support: "Must be a software problem. Did you call Microsoft?" Microsoft tech support: "Oh, that's a hardware problem. You need to call Dell." Intel tech support: "Did you call Microsoft? That's a software problem for sure.")

 

[keithylishus]

and spare me your GIMP recommendations. As if.

!!!

I am shocked! Poor GIMP I like GIMP. It's the only graphics editor I enjoy using.

As for the desktop.... I enjoy using KDE. Nice themes, easy to use etc. It does rule.

 

[PennylessZ28]

Sorry I'll stick to industry leading a software that has some real power.

KDE is all fine and dandy, and even with all the crappy themes made by other users it still looks like a blob of poop.

 

[enslow]

I've been a PC user for years. Then two years ago my school was all MAC, so I bought a MAC laptop so that I could be compatible with their system. As a result I created a huge compatibility issue between my PC and my MAC. I have a lot of WordPerfect files that wouldn't translate well into MS Word. In short it was a real pain.

My particular iBook crashed a LOT more than my PC. When my PC crashes, it's usually because of a program, and with Win2k it's easy to close down the one program that's crashed. With the iBook, I would have to restart the thing once every few days. Last June it finally died. I was able to resurrect it long enough to upload all my data. From that point, it's been a useless piece of plastic and silicon since then. To have it fixed would cost me more than it's worth.

I know I'm biased here, but I did have a poor introduction to MAC. OSX was a great OS, but I'd have to buy a complete set of software that would cost thousands just to be able to do my work again. OS9 was cumbersome, and I hated it. Win2k is much easier to use, imo.

It may work for you, but my $2000Cdn investment into a MAC laptop lasted just over a year.

Enslow

 

[Kelly]

After some research it seems like MAC is the way to go. Specially the new G5 Power MAC.

NNNOOOOOOOOooooooooo!!!!!! ---- umm...ok....

I will eventually have to get a Mac since every stoopid job offer in the graphics field demands Mac experience.

 

[Felron]

well for real seriouse work stuff a mac is a must...but i will own both...mac for work, pc for play.

 

[Heathen Dawn]

I can’t believe the Macintosh is still alive after all those years!!! Sinclair’s gone, Atari’s gone, Commodore’s gone, Tandy’s gone, all the propietary computer vendors are gone, only Mac is still here. It’s a miracle!

I don’t like Macs. I used a Mac when I was in the army, and I didn’t like it one little bit. It’s all foreign to me. I use Windows XP, because of its extensive support for Unicode (multilingual computing). Linux is also fine. Macs suck.

 

[HiredGoon]

Hey without Apple leading the computer industry, Bill Gates and the other PC companies would have nothing to steal and make billions off of selling to you poor PC saps.

 

[filosofer]

I have been using Macs since 1990. I use Beige G3 Tower (4 1/2 years old). Yes, I'm still on OS 9.2.2, but it is rock solid. I don't even remember the last time it crashed - except when using MS Word 2001 or PowerPoint 2001. And it still does everything I need it to (FrameMaker, Nisus Writer, PageMaker, Office 2001, etc.).

At work I have been using Windows 2000 with Office 2002, even considered the "expert" in Excel. In my experiences with both sides, Windows does okay; I work for a fortune 500 company as an analyst, and I have to teach most of the people how to use the MS Office products, as well how to handle Windows problems. Of course, we always have the reliable "Help Desk", too.

If you want to see the strides that Mac has made with the G5 and Panther in the enterprise environment as both server and desktop, read some of the latest reviews at InfoWorld and eWeek, etc. The most recent one in Info World has a review where he compared Macs in networks and usability in real-world experiences, and found the Mac better than the Xeon 3 Ghz from Intel. His conclusion of moving to Macs: it is a smart business decision, and the Macs have more usable power and better interface than either Windows or Linux, and it is easier to integrate Macs into networks.

I don’t like Macs. I used a Mac when I was in the army, and I didn’t like it one little bit. It’s all foreign to me. I use Windows XP, because of its extensive support for Unicode (multilingual computing). Linux is also fine. Macs suck.

Not sure how long ago your experience is with Macs, but since OS X, it is a whole different world.

 

[Stryper]

Macs RULE!

good decision man. i think i kind of changed my mind about pc's the same time you did. maybe its just cause of our hp laptops that we both own.

 

[PennylessZ28]

Macs RULE!

good decision man. i think i kind of changed my mind about pc's the same time you did. maybe its just cause of our hp laptops that we both own.

No my hp laptop works fine and I'll be keeping it as my main PC platform, but my dsktop that I custom built just always ****es me off. I'm always upgrading and etc. Never seems fast enough, never seems stable enough. I don't even seem to productive on it. I'm always tweaking it or something.