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The Christmas tree (originating in 16th century Germany) is not an idol, which is being spoken of here. It is not worshipped, ... nor used in any worship of God.
Doesn't matter. Inventing worship is inherently problematical.
You shall not offer any strange incense on this altar, or burnt offering or meal offering; and you shall not pour out a drink offering on it. -- Exodus 30
There are multiple references to God taking a dim view of worship practices He did not explicitly ordain.
There are no references to God explicitly approving a practice that men ordained.
They do not respond to me either...assuming they don't want to take time to think through their ill-conceived interpretations and re-interpretations. (Don't want to let Scripture get in the way...so to speak!) They are going down a slippery slope, on a frenzy and carried away by their own desires. They do best to heed James...Here, I'll make it easy and clear what I think the law written on gentiles hearts means: to love your neighbor as yourself, as this is the fulfillment of the law.
I do not believe it means any of the other regulations (food restrictions, temple instructions, circumcision, etc...) were written on the gentiles heart.
This means i do believe there WAS a change in the law. It also appears that the author of Hebrews believes that there was a change In the law
Hebrews 7:12 For when there is a change in the priesthood, there is necessarily a change in the law as well.
However, you originally stated the law was not done away with (this would mean unchanged), so i am still trying to understand what you mean by that. But for some reason, you are still not wanting to explain why you believe that.
Origin of Christmas | The history of Christmas and how it beganThe Christmas tree (originating in 16th century Germany) is not an idol, which is being spoken of here. It is not worshipped, ... nor used in any worship of God.
I'm sorry, I must've been missing your statements. What is your stance on all of this? I went back to look, but I couldn't find them v.vThey do not respond to me either...assuming they don't want to take time to think through their ill-conceived interpretations and re-interpretations. (Don't want to let Scripture get in the way...so to speak!) They are going down a slippery slope, on a frenzy and carried away by their own desires. They do best to heed James...
James 1:19:
My dear brothers and sisters, take note of this: Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak...
Here, I'll make it easy and clear what I think the law written on gentiles hearts means: to love your neighbor as yourself, as this is the fulfillment of the law.
I do not believe it means any of the other regulations (food restrictions, temple instructions, circumcision, etc...) were written on the gentiles heart.
This means i do believe there WAS a change in the law. It also appears that the author of Hebrews believes that there was a change In the law
Hebrews 7:12 For when there is a change in the priesthood, there is necessarily a change in the law as well.
However, you originally stated the law was not done away with (this would mean unchanged), so i am still trying to understand what you mean by that. But for some reason, you are still not wanting to explain why you believe that.
Origin of Christmas | The history of Christmas and how it began
Here's a website that goes into the origins of christmas, which was in fact the feast of saturnalia. Research into the history of saturnalia, the christmas tree came from pagan customs in which they worship trees, it is something that has gone on for thousands of years. He literally says
"for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
4They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not."
Pagans, for thousands of years have worshipped trees. That website goes into detail on this, is a tree not made of wood? If you don't believe that website, look into the feast of saturnalia, there's tons of history on it, I'm not making it up, it's just what used to be. Then the roman church decided to merge with them, I know it's not pleasant to hear, but it's true. I'm not saying that YOU should stop observing Christmas, but just because you still want to observe it, doesn't make it's origins any less ungodly.
Not only that, but to an extent, I don't think intent matters. Look at what happened to Aarons sons, the second he took over the priesthood in Leviticus 10, his sons, with good intentions (I'd imagine, I can't discern their hearts) offered an unauthorized incense offering to our Father, and instantly they were killed, because He had not commanded them to worship Him in that way. They worshipped Him in a way that the pagans did at that time, even though they meant for it to be worshipping God, instantly they were killed.
Leviticus 10:1-2 -
1And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the LORD, which he commanded them not. 2And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD.
3Then Moses said unto Aaron, This is it that the LORD spake, saying, I will be sanctified in them that come nigh me, and before all the people I will be glorified. And Aaron held his peace.
In verse 3, sanctified, means set apart. His people will be set apart. But how? Apparently not in ways that WE as people decide, because He didn't command it and approve of it, and anything that we work to give praise to Him, unless He's approved of it, is strange to Him. We are set apart, by Him, and His commands. Literally just by walking in His ways, you are in stark contrast to the world, and you completely oppose the world. Not out of hatred, but love, love for the Father, and not yourself, or the world. The sons of Aaron here, showed love of themselves and the customs of the world, more than they showed love for the Father. It's not that they were evil, they were just misled, as I felt I was, and have since felt convicted that I don't observe the "holidays" invented by man, and instead observe the "Holy Days" given by God Himself. All of which by the way, are about Jesus, 4 out of 7 of which, He's fulfilled in His first coming, and the last 3, deal with His return (Feast of Trumpets), His judgement (Feast of Atonement) and us being reunited with Him, and Him making His home here, on earth with us (Feast of Tabernacles). The spring feasts Jesus already fulfilled when He came the first time, now, next, the fall feasts He will come again to fulfill. But these feasts are ONLY for Israel, and the gentiles that wish to observe them, must become part of Israel, by being sanctified by God. How do we become sanctified? By observing His Torah (or more accurately, His Instructions.)
Origin of Christmas | The history of Christmas and how it began
Here's a website that goes into the origins of christmas, which was in fact the feast of saturnalia. Research into the history of saturnalia, the christmas tree came from pagan customs in which they worship trees, it is something that has gone on for thousands of years. He literally says
"for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
4They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not."
.No Christians worship trees ... nor use them in their worship.
I looked up information on Saturnalia ... and the mythological good Saturn. There was no mention of any tree worship/symbolism in any of the information I looked up.
Also, this is not my first go-round on this subject. I did an objective study on the subject some thirty years ago or so. I concluded that there was no connection between what the prophet was speaking of in Jeremiah and Christmas trees.
I discovered years ago that trees were not even used as decor at Christmas ... until the 16th century, long after Christianity became the predominant religion in Europe.
I am not married to the idea of using trees as decor during the holiday season, but I have not been led by the Spirit to consider it a problem either.
Of course, I am a follower of the Spirit, rather than a law-keeper, so I also participate in celebrations on Resurrection Sunday, Labor Day, Veterans Day, Memorial Day, Independence Day, Thanksgiving, etc.
Jesus said that all men would know that we are his followers by our LOVE for one another.
That is our distinction ...
Either that, or they do a lot of legalistic harm to their children which confuses kids who often then end up turning away from God..
I have noticed, those who are so stringent about observances related to Christmas, Easter, Halloween, seem to abdicate their position, once they have children of their own.
Do you have money in your wallet? Do you spend it and buy things with it? U.S currency has occult, pagan symbols on it. Do you call the days of the week by their names: Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, etc.? These are named after Roman gods. That passage in Jeremiah is about the people cutting trees and carved them into idols and worshiping them as gods. It is totally inappropriate and blatant scripture twisting to use that passage as if it applies to Christmas trees! God is the Creator of trees and certainly Christians are free to enjoy their beauty and use them as beautiful decorations, no different than flowers or autumn leaves. I've never heard of a Christian bowing down, worshiping Christmas trees, or believing they are gods! I am sure you never have either.
We live in a fallen world and EVERYTHING is tainted by pagan influences. That is no reason for the Christian to avoid celebrating the gift of Christ coming to this earth as the Savior or to use all things for God's glory and point to Christ. I truly feel sorry for the bondage you are placing upon yourself, rather than living in the truth, victory, and freedom of Jesus Christ.
Should Christians Celebrate Christmas?
4 Misconceptions About Christmas
A fact you say. Where is this alleged fact documented? Romans didn't decorate trees for their revelries in December.The Tree, was in fact used to represent their God. That's not an assumption, that's not misinformation, that is a fact.
No Christians worship trees ... nor use them in their worship.
I looked up information on Saturnalia ... and the mythological good Saturn. There was no mention of any tree worship/symbolism in any of the information I looked up.
Also, this is not my first go-round on this subject. I did an objective study on the subject some thirty years ago or so. I concluded that there was no connection between what the prophet was speaking of in Jeremiah and Christmas trees.
I discovered years ago that trees were not even used as decor at Christmas ... until the 16th century, long after Christianity became the predominant religion in Europe.
I am not married to the idea of using trees as decor during the holiday season, but I have not been led by the Spirit to consider it a problem either.
Of course, I am a follower of the Spirit, rather than a law-keeper, so I also participate in celebrations on Resurrection Sunday, Labor Day, Veterans Day, Memorial Day, Independence Day, Thanksgiving, etc.
Jesus said that all men would know that we are his followers by our LOVE for one another.
That is our distinction ...
The truth, can only be seen when you look at the historical facts regarding what they did regarding Saturnalia. The Tree, was in fact used to represent their God. That's not an assumption, that's not misinformation, that is a fact. I'm not going to argue this, because it's something that can easily be proven, all you have to do, is look up it's role in the feast of saturnalia.
.
I have noticed, those who are so stringent about observances related to Christmas, Easter, Halloween, seem to abdicate their position, once they have children of their own.
People who invent sins usually do so by inventing religious rules and laws or interpreting existing (and probably abrogated) laws in new and novel ways. The fact remains - regardless of one's opinion of Christmas trees and Easter eggs - that if somebody wants to proclaim the Law given through Moses as eternal then they will need priests descended from Aaron, a temple in Jerusalem, and animal sacrifices offered on the altar in Jerusalem to do it otherwise they will not be keeping the "eternal law" they will just be pretending to keep it. Their observances will be a sham. They cannot expect God's approval or blessing for sham worship like that.
For the sake of completeness, I have searched several objective sources (i.e encyclopedias) of information on the festival of Saturnalia and the mythological god Saturn, ... and have found not one mention of the use of trees as symbols or representations.
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