Morals

[raven1]

I just want to know if it is not OCD I am still forgiven.

 

[steve_bakr]

I just want to know if it is not OCD I am still forgiven.

The one word answer would be, Yes!

 

[steve_bakr]

Raven1,

It might be good for you to read the Psalms. The Psalmist displays many human emotions toward God, including doubt.

 

[raven1]

I just don't ever feel like I am not going to hell. I feel like I only try to have a little faith because it's the safer bet.

 

[steve_bakr]

I just don't ever feel like I am not going to hell.

Try this. Just do the best you can to worship the Lord, even if you think you are damned. Submit your eternal destiny to the will of God. Say to God, "I will do my best to praise you in this life. After that, do with me as you please." From then on, consider it none of your business what the Lord will do with you when you die. Your only business is to worship the Lord in this life. What do you think?

 

[raven1]

Um how do I not be scared of hell. I can't just not be afraid of going to hell and it all started because i was scared to trust heaven was there. Now the doubts won't stop.The reason I fear Calvanism may be right is because it says in the bible no one can be excused of doubt. Some people have trouble with doubt but the original doubt the core of the doubt cannot be OCD.

 

[dabro]

Raven pls seek CBT or FRP for your illness. Also take your meds or change them up. Also I think a Benzo would greatly help you. I clearly see you suffering but it takes time to heal. I'm going on 4 yr's of pure o with bout of relapse but I think you'll get thru it. I know you will.

 

[raven1]

U doubt God exists dabro? Everyone says that but like I said OCD does not make u doubt God exists.

 

[dabro]

It can fixate that I'm thinking santa's real and angry. It can latch unto your worst fears. See the problem is you ask a ? then I give you an answer. Then another ? pop's up and then you see the vicous cycle of OCD. You sure want to believe cos you doing a pretty good job at trying to have faith. I comend you.

 

[flowerforever7]

Um how do I not be scared of hell. I can't just not be afraid of going to hell and it all started because i was scared to trust heaven was there. Now the doubts won't stop.The reason I fear Calvanism may be right is because it says in the bible no one can be excused of doubt. Some people have trouble with doubt but the original doubt the core of the doubt cannot be OCD.

Raven1, where in the Bible does it say no one can be excused of doubt? There is no such Scripture. If no one can be excused of doubt than a whole lot of heros of the faith that the Bible commends aren't going to Heaven. As a matter of fact, if no one can be excused of doubt then all human beings most likely won't be making it to Heaven. I don't know who has taught you these type of religious ideas; but that is not what the Bible teaches at all. Again, I encourage you to be a student of what the Bible teaches, not what someone has taught you to believe religiously. By the way, if you try to find a Scripture on Calvanism in the Bible, you can't because Calvinism is not in the Bible. It was a term to refer to those who follow after John Calvin's religious mindset. I'm not saying John Calvin was not of any religious conviction. However, your goal on this earth is not to follow John Calvin or what he teaches, but Jesus Christ, and what the Scriptures teach in the Bible. Let that be your guide. I truly think it's truth will straighten out at least some of the fears you have. The Word of God is complete and enough within itself, you don't need to follow after Calvinism or any other ism additionally to understand the will of God.

Dabro is right about your pattern, your excessive questioning is a symptom of OCD pathology. I highly suggest getting treatment also, or at least reading about and applying CBT techniques yourself to help you better deal with this. I want to suggest that you take a look at some of the links I left in a previous response which have information on that. OCD does attack what you fear most, or what you value most. That is a hallmark well known symptom of OCD. Obviously you value not going to Hell a whole lot otherwise your OCD wouldn't be attacking it. OCD CAN make you doubt anything; it's called the doubting disease. It takes what you value most and doubts can flood your mind about it, and then you obsess over the doubts, then you get more doubts, obsess... see the cycle? I want to encourage you for seeking help here; we all suffer with OCD and know what it's like. Look into getting treatment though also; it can help you feel better as you work toward getting it to become more manageable.

God bless you & praying for you.

________________
Acts 2:38 "Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, everyone of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

 

[raven1]

Thanks guys u have been so sweet. I know I need therapy. I just don't want to waste this year before 2012 missing time with my daughter going to therapy. I asked a girl at work about her doubting God. She said yeah I doubt but I just replace that with how wondeful heave will be? My husband says he believes in heaven but when he has been close to death he has doubting. I don't get it. I just feel like if God wantd me saved I woulr believe like I used to. how can God forgive me when I have thoughts from doubt that the bible is fake, athiests are smarter etc. then I have the side that freaks and says your going to hell God could be real. See other people on here say they know OCD is lying to them I really doubt. Maybe I don't have OCD and are forgivable.

 

[raven1]

Y am I thinking atheist are smarter etc.

 

[steve_bakr]

Y am I thinking atheist are smarter etc.

Why would someone closed to the reality of God be smarter?

 

[raven1]

My doubt side that God doesn't exist says that. When I had pedophilia OCD my mind was divided maybe I was one maybe not. This is the same divided mind but not OCD. I don't think doubt God exists can be OCD.

 

[steve_bakr]

My doubt side that God doesn't exist says that. When I had pedophilia OCD my mind was divided maybe I was one maybe not. This is the same divided mind but not OCD. I don't think doubt God exists can be OCD.

If you have pedophilia, you had better give yourself over completely to a religious life, see a psychiatrist, and take medication for OCD.

 

[raven1]

Why would I need OCD meds for pedophilia? and y are u saying it like that. That I better live a religious life. That is another thing I dont understand God gives mental illness like pedophilia, serial killers etc. and then does he punish them.

 

[raven1]

Oh and the power to believe in him and then will he punish for that. It doesn't seem fair.

 

[gracealone]

See other people on here say they know OCD is lying to them I really doubt. Maybe I don't have OCD and are forgivable.[/quote]
Actually...... Raven,
When I had my OCD themes on: whether or not God was real, or me becoming an athiest, or me not truly believing or having real faith etc., ( I mean really how could I really tell?), I, in no way felt reassured or certain that it was OCD just lying to me. It all felt horribly real, valid and made me an absolute wreck. When I chose to go ahead and run the risk that those things might in the end be true of me after all but to treat them like OCD I didn't feel at all convinced or assured that doing so would help me. That's just how it has to be. We don't need ERP therapy if we really know or feel that it's just OCD. We only need the therapy if those thoughts, doubts and fears are making us miserable and invading our every waking moment with dread and terror. We need therapy if we cannot stop ruminating or seeking reassurance about them in a relentless/ driving compulsive manner.
Will therapy help you too? You won't know unless you give it a try.
What I did discover about my own doubts was that the more I tried to get over them the worse they got. That's how the disorder operates and that's how it makes us it's slave.
And by the way... yes... having doubts about whether or not God is real, or whether or not heaven is real or hell is real can be OCD obsessions. If they were not then every single one of us who have struggled and strived with this kind of religious OCD are only fooling ourselves and by your judgments are not now or never will be saved. Do you think that of me, or OCD = Owie, or any of the other people here who have experienced these doubts?
You know me... I refuse to reassure you, not because I'm callous to your pain, but because I don't want to make you worse. If I was to answer any one of your questions with a verse of reassurance or a logical explanation as to why your salvation isn't threatend I would actually be helping you with your compulsions by helping you attend to the obsessions. Whenever those of us with OCD engage in the compulsive side of the disorder we make the obsession bigger and it gets more and more stuck in our brain and we find it nearly impossible to ignore. Do you understand that this is why you are so locked into this never ending pattern? Time to throw a wrench into the gears and stop the OCD machine. I'm glad I did even though at the time I had no reassurance that the meds. and therapy would help me. But they did and I'm so thankful to God for showing me a path that could help me manage my disorder.
Haven't stopped praying for you.... bet you thought I had.
Hugs!
Mitzi

 

[gracealone]

Raven isn't a pedophile. She has experienced a long and painful bout of OCD on the fearful theme that she might become a pedophile and hurt a child. It's common for people with OCD to have thoughts that suggest that they might cause harm to someone. Or to have intrusive thoughts that they might lose control and engage in a sinful behavior that God hates.
Just thought I should clarify that. Raven wants very badly to please God and to believe in Him in a way that brings her peace but her OCD has brought her severe and excruciating doubts as to whether or not she really believes. With OCD having the doubts isn't tantamount to acting upon them nor does having them mean that you actually want to have them - it's the exact opposite.
Mitzi

If you have pedophilia, you had better give yourself over completely to a religious life, see a psychiatrist, and take medication for OCD.

 

[steve_bakr]

Raven isn't a pedophile. She has experienced a long and painful bout of OCD on the fearful theme that she might become a pedophile and hurt a child. It's common for people with OCD to have thoughts that suggest that they might cause harm to someone. Or to have intrusive thoughts that they might lose control and engage in a sinful behavior that God hates.
Just thought I should clarify that. Raven wants very badly to please God and to believe in Him in a way that brings her peace but her OCD has brought her severe and excruciating doubts as to whether or not she really believes. With OCD having the doubts isn't tantamount to acting upon them nor does having them mean that you actually want to have them - it's the exact opposite.
Mitzi

Thank you for clarifying that. It makes sense in terms of how OCD works.