Millenial reign question...

[B1inHim]

Rev. 20:4 (KJV)
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Only those listed here will reign during the thousand years.

"them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands"

There are OTHER nations to rule over when this is all over and dung with.

Rev. 21:26 (KJV)
And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

Rev. 22:2 (KJV)
In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

BUT, only those who are written in the Word are there during the 1,000 years.

To say otherwise is to add to Revelation and we know what happens to those who do that.

Love,
His servant

 

[LastSeven]

Zechariah 14


1Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
2For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
3Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
4And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
6And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:
7But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.
8And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.
9And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

Zechariah 14 indeed tells us that Jesus will reign on earth.

However, if you'll notice the parts that I highlighted in bright red, verse 6 and 7 tell us that at that time there will be no night time nor day. There will always be light, because God will be the light. This phenomena is also described in Rev 22:5

Then verse 8 says that the living waters shall go out from Jerusalem, half to the dead sea and half to the Mediterranean. This is described in Rev 22:1-2. The only time these things happen will be in the New Jerusalem on the New Earth.

Ezekiel 47 also describes this river of life in the new Jerusalem.

The entire passage above refers to the time after the millennium. The battle described in verses 2 and 3 refer to the short time that Satan is released from his prison and deceives the nations once again to surround the camp of God's people. This is the time of great tribulation that Jesus warns us about.

Then from verse 6 forward this passage refers to the time of the new Jerusalem on the new Earth. All of this after the millennium.

 

[ivebeenshown]

BUT, only those who are written in the Word are there during the 1,000 years.

To say otherwise is to add to Revelation and we know what happens to those who do that.

Love,
His servant

Be wary of your own warnings about adding, because nowhere in Rev.20 does it say that only the saints live during the thousand years.

 

[B1inHim]

Be wary of your own warnings about adding, because nowhere in Rev.20 does it say that only the saints live during the thousand years.

Selective reading I see...

Yes it does say who is reigning with Lord Jesus,
Rev. 20:4 (KJV)
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Only those listed here will reign during the thousand years.

"them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands"

The above that are listed are the only ones names as reigning with Lord Jesus during this particular time.
For 1,000 years.

By the way that you have reacted to the post that you answered, you are misunderstanding what is being said.

We are NOT talking about who is there during the 1,000 years, only who is reigning during that time.

His servant

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

We are NOT talking about who is there during the 1,000 years, only who is reigning during that time.

His servant

So who are they reigning over, themselves

 

[B1inHim]

So who are they reigning over, themselves

ROFL...you KNOW this answer.

Ok, ok, I'll tell you.

They are reigning over anyone who is alive that didn't know about the mark, that wasn't knowledgeable of GOD.
Armageddon survivors!


Those who were not killed from all the disasters, who lived in tepees and huts...(lol) people with no contact with the outside world.
AND it is very possible that they are also reigning over the ones who came back with Lord Jesus in the war that took place just prior to the 1,000 years.

God is all about structure.

So, this is off topic, the question that you asked, but who do you believe they are reigning over?

Thanks for asking.
I look forward to your answer.

God Bless,
Brother Jerry

 

[zeke37]

Zechariah 14 indeed tells us that Jesus will reign on earth.

However, if you'll notice the parts that I highlighted in bright red, verse 6 and 7 tell us that at that time there will be no night time nor day. There will always be light, because God will be the light. This phenomena is also described in Rev 22:5

Yes, and it is important to realize that it will eventually become that way...it will come to pass...

that day, IMO, lasts 1000 years.

Then verse 8 says that the living waters shall go out from Jerusalem, half to the dead sea and half to the Mediterranean. This is described in Rev 22:1-2. The only time these things happen will be in the New Jerusalem on the New Earth.

indeed! however, some might argue that those living waters are available today,
and throughout the 1000 years

Ezekiel 47 also describes this river of life in the new Jerusalem.

Ezekiel 40-48 is ALL MILLENNIAL, and ends with the Father DWELLING here in 48

The entire passage above refers to the time after the millennium. The battle described in verses 2 and 3 refer to the short time that Satan is released from his prison and deceives the nations once again to surround the camp of God's people. This is the time of great tribulation that Jesus warns us about.

I disagree...Jesus gave us the signs, and those signs are here today...
the birthpains are growing in intensity.


in your scenario the camp of the Saints is surrounded, right?

yet in this scripture, the Saints Come with Him as He descends,
just like in 1Thes4/Mar13.

this is His Coming in Rev19, which begins the Millennium

 

[ivebeenshown]

We are NOT talking about who is there during the 1,000 years, only who is reigning during that time.

His servant

BUT, only those who are written in the Word are there during the 1,000 years.

Sorry, just pointing it out. We reign with Christ already.

 

[B1inHim]

Removed

 

[B1inHim]

Sorry, just pointing it out. We reign with Christ already.

Ummm, we are not talking about now, we are talking about the Millennial Sabbath Reign and who will be doing the reigning, during THAT particular time.

His servant

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Ummm, we are not talking about now, we are talking about the Millennial Sabbath Reign and who will be doing the reigning, during THAT particular time.

His servant

I have a rather "unique" view [of course] of that particular period being a type of Daniel's time,times,half a times, as I view Armegeddon/Gog-Magog as one and the same event.
Anywho, I have a thread over here if any are interested

http://www.christianforums.com/t7135180-2/
Revelation 20:2 question

 

[ivebeenshown]

Ummm, we are not talking about now, we are talking about the Millennial Sabbath Reign and who will be doing the reigning, during THAT particular time.

His servant

You mean the 'thousand years' where 'the LORD is not slow in keeping his promise?'

Revelation 20
7And when the thousand years are ***expired,*** Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Zephaniah 3:8
5The just LORD is in the midst thereof; he will not do iniquity: every morning doth he bring his judgment to light, he faileth not; but the unjust knoweth no shame.
8Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy.

2 Peter 3
8But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10But the day of the Lordwill come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

 

[LastSeven]

Yes, and it is important to realize that it will eventually become that way...it will come to pass...

It shall come to pass "in that day". You say "that day" lasts a thousand years, yet this description of the New Jerusalem is a description of the time after the thousand years, and your scenario would have Jesus returning before the thousand years. So altogether that is a span of greater than a thousand years. In other words, in your scenario those two events don't even occur on the same "day", even if you define a day as a thousand years.

indeed! however, some might argue that those living waters are available today,
and throughout the 1000 years

I believe the description of the new Jerusalem, including the living waters, is a literal description. If I'm wrong about that, then all bets are off, but I'm pretty confident that I'm right, and that it is a literal description, which means the river of living waters is not yet here.

I disagree...Jesus gave us the signs, and those signs are here today...
the birthpains are growing in intensity.

We have always been taught that the "last days" are those days just before the millennium. I used to believe that too, but it doesn't really make sense, does it? "The last days" should be referring to the actual last days. Those days come after the millennium. Those are truly the last days. I know it's exciting to think that we are now living in the last days, but thankfully we're not.

Life will go on through the millennium. It is nothing more than a period of rest without Satan. Our seventh millennium will be a Sabbath millennium. That's all it is. There is no eternal life, there is no Jesus on earth, there is no new Jerusalem. All that stuff doesn't happen until the time of the end, when Satan is finally defeated.

When Jesus talked about the last days in Matthew 24 it was in response to a question regarding "the time of the end". The years leading up to the Sabbath millennium are not the time of the end.

Think of it this way. Which time period would be more important in God's eyes? Which time period would more prophecies be concerned with? The time just before Satan goes to prison for the Sabbath millennium, or the time of the end, when Satan is finally defeated, Jesus begins to rule, death is thrown into the lake of fire and all things are renewed?

If you ask me, I would say the time of the end would be the most important time in our history and the time that Jesus would want to tell us about.

in your scenario the camp of the Saints is surrounded, right?

yet in this scripture, the Saints Come with Him as He descends,
just like in 1Thes4/Mar13.

this is His Coming in Rev19, which begins the Millennium

In my scenario the camp of God's people is surrounded, yes. The saints who come with him could be either those who reigned with him in heaven for a thousand years, or perhaps it refers to the second resurrection, just before the rapture. Not sure about that part, but regardless, it clearly describes the new Jerusalem existing shortly after the time that Jesus returns. There is no doubt about that.

As for Revelation, I have come to the conclusion that it can not be chronological. If it were it would contradict a lot of other scripture.

 

[ivebeenshown]

indeed! however, some might argue that those living waters are available today,
and throughout the 1000 years

Ezekiel 40-48 is ALL MILLENNIAL, and ends with the Father DWELLING here in 48

Did you ever consider a possibility that the Ezekiel temple is there for the false Messiah to come to and claim to be the Messiah?

The temple MUST be rebuilt!
http://www.christianforums.com/t7488184-9/#post56037596

Malachi 3:1
Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the LORD, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.

John 5:43
I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

 

[zeke37]

It shall come to pass "in that day". You say "that day" lasts a thousand years, yet this description of the New Jerusalem is a description of the time after the thousand years, and your scenario would have Jesus returning before the thousand years. So altogether that is a span of greater than a thousand years. In other words, in your scenario those two events don't even occur on the same "day", even if you define a day as a thousand years.

semantics...
the fact is, that the saints come with Him in Zec14.
They are not already here and surrounded...

I believe the description of the new Jerusalem, including the living waters, is a literal description. If I'm wrong about that, then all bets are off, but I'm pretty confident that I'm right, and that it is a literal description, which means the river of living waters is not yet here.

i do not think it is literal....

We have always been taught that the "last days" are those days just before the millennium. I used to believe that too, but it doesn't really make sense, does it? "The last days" should be referring to the actual last days. Those days come after the millennium. Those are truly the last days. I know it's exciting to think that we are now living in the last days, but thankfully we're not.

I disagree.

Life will go on through the millennium. It is nothing more than a period of rest without Satan. Our seventh millennium will be a Sabbath millennium. That's all it is. There is no eternal life, there is no Jesus on earth, there is no new Jerusalem. All that stuff doesn't happen until the time of the end, when Satan is finally defeated.

again, I disagree.

When Jesus talked about the last days in Matthew 24 it was in response to a question regarding "the time of the end". The years leading up to the Sabbath millennium are not the time of the end.

I disagree...

Think of it this way. Which time period would be more important in God's eyes? Which time period would more prophecies be concerned with? The time just before Satan goes to prison for the Sabbath millennium, or the time of the end, when Satan is finally defeated, Jesus begins to rule, death is thrown into the lake of fire and all things are renewed?

Jesus rules during the Millennium

If you ask me, I would say the time of the end would be the most important time in our history and the time that Jesus would want to tell us about.

He did...
and He taught us about His return at the beginning of the Millennium aswell.

In my scenario the camp of God's people is surrounded, yes. The saints who come with him could be either those who reigned with him in heaven for a thousand years, or perhaps it refers to the second resurrection, just before the rapture. Not sure about that part, but regardless, it clearly describes the new Jerusalem existing shortly after the time that Jesus returns. There is no doubt about that.

shortly to you and I, is not the same to God...a day is as a 1000 years...

the dead believers in heaven come with Him, to reign here for the 1000 years,
or IOW that Day

As for Revelation, I have come to the conclusion that it can not be chronological. If it were it would contradict a lot of other scripture.

Rev shows us the end days (as I understand them) from more than one angle.

If we are building a timeline, proof of Christ's landing or Coming are seen through-out...

Rev5, Rev7, Rev11, Rev14, Rev16, Rev19 to name a few...

 

[LastSeven]

Let's simplify the argument a bit. We know that before the end of this world there will be one more millennium. As we call it "the millennium" or "the millennial reign". We also know that since Adam there have been approximately 6,000 years, so with the last millennium tacked onto the end that will make 7,000 years.

The last thousand years will be slightly different due to Satan being locked up, but nevertheless those thousand years still have to come and go. We can't just skip them or ignore them. People will live and die and new babies will be born during this time. There is no reason to think otherwise.

So, given a 7,000 year span, when would you say is the time of the end? After 6,000 years, or after 7,000? Sounds like a silly question to me, but I can't figure out why it's not obvious to everybody else.

 

[ivebeenshown]

Let's simplify the argument a bit. We know that before the end of this world there will be one more millennium. As we call it "the millennium" or "the millennial reign". We also know that since Adam there have been approximately 6,000 years, so with the last millennium tacked onto the end that will make 7,000 years.

The last thousand years will be slightly different due to Satan being locked up, but nevertheless those thousand years still have to come and go. We can't just skip them or ignore them. People will live and die and new babies will be born during this time. There is no reason to think otherwise.

Sure there is.

 

[LastSeven]

Show me.

 

[NightHawkeye]

So, given a 7,000 year span, when would you say is the time of the end? After 6,000 years, or after 7,000? Sounds like a silly question to me, but I can't figure out why it's not obvious to everybody else.

Do you mean end-times before the first resurrection?

Or, do you mean end-times before the second resurrection?





.

 

[ivebeenshown]

Show me.

http://www.christianforums.com/t7429462-16/#post56038011