MATHEMATICS IN NATURE PROVES INTELLIGENT DESIGN

[TagliatelliMonster]

I think that having two rocks and subtracting one would = 1 rock.

"2", "1" and "subtracting" are human made concepts.

This should work out the same way for squirrels, fish, or mathematicians.

What about atoms? 1 atom +1 atom +1 atom = 1 molecule.

If you collect 2 acorns a day for 5 days, you'd end up with 10 acorns.

Yes. And "2", "5" and "10" are human made concepts to describe things in reality.

 

[SkyWriting]

"2", "1" and "subtracting" are human made concepts.
What about atoms? 1 atom +1 atom +1 atom = 1 molecule.
Yes. And "2", "5" and "10" are human made concepts to describe things in reality.

Wrong on all accounts. The particular words may be human,
but the items themselves still follow the same mathematical rules
in any language and for squirrels.

In other words, math can be taught just using rocks or acorns and no words.
Many animals keep track of numbers of objects.

This is why there can be proof in Math.

 

[SkyWriting]

Which of those two rocks did you find "math" under?

Birds looking for bugs can count the bugs under rocks.
Math is a universal language.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Wrong on all accounts. The particular words may be human, but the items themselves still follow the same mathematical rules in any language and for squirrels.

Dude.... the math is descriptive of the actual stuff. The math is not prescriptive of the actual stuff.

In other words, math can be taught just using rocks or acorns and no words.

Really? Okay.
Let's try another one.

Instead of 5+5 = 10...
How about....
(-0.25)*(-0.25) = 0.0625

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

I think that having two rocks and subtracting one would = 1 rock.
This should work out the same way for squirrels, fish, or mathematicians.
If you collect 2 acorns a day for 5 days, you'd end up with 10 acorns.

Try it with lumps of mud:
1 lump of mud + 1 lump of mud = 1 lump of mud.

Pulling it apart:
1 lump of mud - 1 lump of mud = 2 lumps of mud.
1 lump of mud - 2 lumps of mud = 3 lumps of mud.

Mathematics is a description of certain kinds of relationships in the world.

 

[SkyWriting]

Try it with lumps of mud:
1 lump of mud + 1 lump of mud = 1 lump of mud.

Pulling it apart:
1 lump of mud - 1 lump of mud = 2 lumps of mud.
1 lump of mud - 2 lumps of mud = 3 lumps of mud.

Mathematics is a description of certain kinds of relationships in the world.

Sure. Physical relationships.
The voyager spacecraft used symbolic connected dots 1 plus 1 to indicate hydrogen.
Not that there is any life out there, but just in case they wanted to play a very old
record album it gave instructions on how to do that as well. It was not a good
selling disk, so it shouldn't have been gold. Aliens will think it deceptive.
On the disk are a number of universal concepts, not linked to human concepts.

»
Calibration circle, Jon Lomberg

»
Solar location map, Frank Drake

»
Mathematical definitions, Frank Drake

»
Physical unit definitions, Frank Drake

»
Solar system parameters, Frank Drake

»
Solar system parameters, Frank Drake

»
The Sun, Hale observatories

»
Solar spectrum, National Astronomy and Ionosphere Center, Cornell University (NAIC)

»
Mercury, NASA

»
Mars, NASA

»
Jupiter, NASA

»
Earth, NASA

»
Egypt, Red Sea, Sinai Peninsula and the Nile, NASA

»
Chemical definitions, Frank Drake

»
DNA Structure, Jon Lomberg

»
DNA Structure magnified, light hit, Jon Lomberg

 

[Radrook]

Sure. Physical relationships.
The voyager spacecraft used symbolic connected dots 1 plus 1 to indicate hydrogen.
Not that there is any life out there, but just in case they wanted to play a very old
record album it gave instructions on how to do that as well. It was not a good
selling disk, so it shouldn't have been gold. Aliens will think it deceptive.
On the disk is a number of universal concepts, not linked to human concepts.

Aliens might perceive it as a toothpick and proceed to vigorously floss.

 

[SkyWriting]

Aliens might perceive it as a toothpick and proceed to vigorously floss.

Or taste it, or break it. Perhaps throw it back and forth.

 

[Loudmouth]

Birds looking for bugs can count the bugs under rocks.
Math is a universal language.

c=5 m/s

By using this math, have I slowed the speed of light to 5 m/s?

 

[SkyWriting]

c=5 m/s

By using this math, have I slowed the speed of light to 5 m/s?

Under rocks...yes.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

The voyager spacecraft used symbolic connected dots 1 plus 1 to indicate hydrogen.

Mathematical definitions, Frank Drake

Yes, notice how they show how to derive elementary mathematics from object instances (dots), via binary counting.

 

[Loudmouth]

Under rocks...yes.

Huh?

 

[SkyWriting]

Dude.... the math is descriptive of the actual stuff. The math is not prescriptive of the actual stuff.

Fraid so.

 

[Loudmouth]

Fraid so.

Do you think I can slow the speed of light by writing the following equation?

c = 5 m/s

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Fraid so.

Ow boy... all the refutations to this can be found in the fibonaci thread.

Also, you forgot to give me real life examples of:

(-0.25)*(-0.25) = 0.0625

 

[SkyWriting]

Ow boy... all the refutations to this can be found in the fibonaci thread.

Also, you forgot to give me real life examples of:

(-0.25)*(-0.25) = 0.0625

1/4 of 1/4 pizza equals 1/16 of a Pizza.
No matter what units you use
or what item you are dividing up.
Pizza, planets, star systems, anything
the results are the same.

 

[SkyWriting]

Ow boy... all the refutations to this can be found in the fibonaci thread.

Sure, by chat forum posters. You mean by scholars?
It hasn't even been attempted. These three have 300 citations
for you to go through.

The golden ratio predicted: Vision, cognition and locomotion as a single design in nature
A Bejan - International Journal of Design & Nature and …, 2009 - witpress.com
Abstract Shapes with length/height ratios (L/H) close to 3/2 are everywhere and give the
impression that they are being 'designed'to match the golden ratio (φ= 1.618). Here I show
that these shapes emerge as part of an evolutionary phenomenon that facilitates the flow of
Cited by 27

An optimal radial profile order based on the Golden Ratio for time-resolved MRI
S Winkelmann, T Schaeffter, T Koehler… - IEEE transactions on …, 2007 - ieeexplore.ieee.org
... The method acquires profiles spaced by a constant azimuthal increment of 111.25 . This angle is related to the Golden Ratio and causes radial lines to be very evenly spaced with time [15], [16]. A similar pattern can be found in nature: leaves of plants often grow in this particular ...
Cited by 249 - Related articles

Solid-state physics: Golden ratio seen in a magnet
I Affleck - Nature, 2010 - nature.com
According to Albert Einstein's formula E = mc 2 , when several particles form a collective bound state, the mass (m) of the system is reduced from the sum of the constituent masses by the binding energy (E) of the ensemble divided by the square of the speed of light (c). For the strong
Cited by 22 - Related articles

golden ratio in nature - Google Scholar

 

[durangodawood]

1/4 of 1/4 pizza equals 1/16 of a Pizza.
No matter what units you use

What about negative one fourth of a pizza?

Whats that?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Sure, by chat forum posters. You mean by scholars?
It hasn't even been attempted. These three have 300 citations
for you to go through.

The golden ratio predicted: Vision, cognition and locomotion as a single design in nature
A Bejan - International Journal of Design & Nature and …, 2009 - witpress.com
Abstract Shapes with length/height ratios (L/H) close to 3/2 are everywhere and give the
impression that they are being 'designed'to match the golden ratio (φ= 1.618). Here I show
that these shapes emerge as part of an evolutionary phenomenon that facilitates the flow of
Cited by 27

An optimal radial profile order based on the Golden Ratio for time-resolved MRI
S Winkelmann, T Schaeffter, T Koehler… - IEEE transactions on …, 2007 - ieeexplore.ieee.org
... The method acquires profiles spaced by a constant azimuthal increment of 111.25 . This angle is related to the Golden Ratio and causes radial lines to be very evenly spaced with time [15], [16]. A similar pattern can be found in nature: leaves of plants often grow in this particular ...
Cited by 249 - Related articles

Solid-state physics: Golden ratio seen in a magnet
I Affleck - Nature, 2010 - nature.com
According to Albert Einstein's formula E = mc 2 , when several particles form a collective bound state, the mass (m) of the system is reduced from the sum of the constituent masses by the binding energy (E) of the ensemble divided by the square of the speed of light (c). For the strong
Cited by 22 - Related articles

golden ratio in nature - Google Scholar

Nowhere does it state that the math is prescribing these shapes.
The math is our invention and the math describes nature.

And when we hit a wall, guess what we do?
We invent more math!

Just like Newton did when he invented calculus.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

1/4 of 1/4 pizza equals 1/16 of a Pizza.

You missed the negative part.

What is a "negative 1/4th" piece of pizza?