Marriage

[brinny]

Well for knowledge of the situation, I am currently renting a room from an older lady in our neighborhood and have been since Feb. I moved out in Feb, because my wife said she was going to leave. To keep her from leaving the home and the children, I decided to move out instead. She is against me moving back into the house at this time. She is in our home with our five younger children and continues to homeschool them. She is an awesome woman. I still interact with the children at our home.

I agree. That is very wise that you heed her request that you not move into the house.

Praying.

 

[jajejllc]

I would steer clear of asking your wife "who it was". It sounds, as you stated above, that she was severely wounded in many many ways from your abuse to her over 18+ years, before February, when you separated. I'm praying for your wife that she is able to get the counseling and support she needs to heal, and that get solid counseling as well, and separately. Praying that God's will is done in each of your lives.

Thank you much for your prayers. I certainly desire healing, restoration, and reconciliation for us both.

 

[brinny]

Thank you much for your prayers. I certainly desire healing, restoration, and reconciliation for us both.

And a key word here is respect. Which includes a recognition of all that your wife has done over those many years, and still does, as she homeschools five children.

Proverbs 31 comes to mind. The verse where the husband and all the children rise up and call her "bless-ed".

That, my brother, is a "standing ovation".

Continuing to pray.

 

[Monksailor]

Thank you for all the counsel. I will look into the resources mentioned. I am currently counseling with my Pastor that is also a licensed counselor with a doctorate degree related to this. My brothers and sisters have been very supportive. I want to operate in truth and not look on the circumstances.

As you probably could easily discern, I am NOT a professional counselor, hence the books offered by such. You have indicated that you have personally received Jesus as your Savior and Lord? Has your wife? Liking you to read the Bible to her or going to church do not make her a Christian. It is critical that BOTH of you are on the same page (aligned) if you two are to produce what God desires in your relationship. I heard this on Moody Radio last night and thought it might help you. http://familylifetoday.com/program/put-off-the-old-put-on-the-new/?autoPlay=y

 

[jajejllc]

As you probably could easily discern, I am NOT a professional counselor, hence the books offered by such. I try to counsel but I can only counsel from my own experiences and the limited amount of things which I have read and the Bible. In our situation, right or wrong, the Bible itself, did not adequately cover our situation. If we had been married in the Catholic church i could have had our marriage annulled by it due to all of the deception/lies and misrepresentation going into the marriage. I committed for life to one who did not exist but was only a fabrication which disappeared after the seal of the commitment. I lived and slept with a person I did not know and who did not want me to know her in ANY way. For almost the first 15 yrs I took my showers in prayer that if she not rush in with that huge Buck hunting knife and stabbed me to death through the shower curtain and if she did that the Lord would take me quickly. I allowed myself to endure this for so long because of an ignorant but well-meaning church staff member emphasizing verses like Ephes 5:25; "giving of myself as Christ gave of himself for the church." he could not conceive how deceptive and contemptuous my smiling and childlike wife at church really was at home behind closed doors. He did not realize that he was telling me that it was acceptable, even instructed, for me to surrender my life even physically to a totally insubordinate, contemptuous, and murderous woman. He said that it did not matter what she did or who she was but that I only focus upon me and doing what God wanted me to do. He NEVER once said that I should protect myself but rather to surrender myself/sacrifice myself as Christ did for us. When I told him what I eventually found out from her involutarily through one of her nightmares that her father started raping her at age three, it seemed like that all he could think of is helping that poor little 3 yr old through me. He knew the damaging childhood I had and what I was struggling with but the fatherly protective nature probably took took over and in ignorance of the actual complex and volatile situation he, in Christ, sadly perpetuated a situation which could have ended up in murder (my wife acknowledged two decades into marriage that my prayers in the shower probably saved my life.) tAFTER she went to the "Wounded Heart Seminar" about 18 yrs into our marriage she started to learn things that helped to reduce her transference of hate and contempt for her father to me. You have indicated that you have personally received Jesus as your Savior and Lord? Has your wife? Liking you to read the Bible to her or going to church do not make her a Christian. It is critical that BOTH of you are on the same page (aligned) if you two are to produce what God desires in your relationship. I heard this on Moody Radio last night and thought it might help you. http://familylifetoday.com/program/put-off-the-old-put-on-the-new/?autoPlay=y

As far as my relationship with the Lord, I know I belong to Him. He saved me in 1991 and He has been faithful to me. Since separation in Feb, I am experiencing His chastening, which is more evidence I belong to Him. I know that my past affected my relationship and responses to my wife and children. I suffered sexual, emotional, and verbal abuse as a child. I didn't realize how bad it was until after I got married. I have dealt with my past through counseling and have forgiven my abusers. But over the years of our marriage, my wife has been hurt much. I sincerely believe she has hurts from her past as well. I am praying that if I am right and that she does have hurts from the past, that the Lord will reveal this truth to her and heal her. I have given her enough to deal with through my foolishness. I have no reason to believe she is not a believer. She professes to know Jesus. But she has a lot of deep inner emotional pain. Again I believe a lot of it is rooted in her childhood upbringing. Don't not what else to say. I want to honor my Savior and want His best for my wife, children, and myself. I realize I have been purchased with a price and He can do with me as He pleases.

 

[Monksailor]

It sounds like you are on the way to something good. I'll be also praying for you all including the children. I can give you the Scripture everyone or your pastor already has relative to the marital relationship, specifically: the Ephes ch5 section, Col ch3 section, I Pt ch3 section, and I Cor 7 section and Gen ch 2-3, to some degree. Just remember that at the same time that Paul instructed the wife to allow the husband to have the final word (submit) he ALSO had just told them at the end of ch4 (vs 29-31) of Ephes to submit one to another and other very important things in relating to fellow Christians, esp applicable for one's spouse. As you seek advice and help it looks like you are doing a good job of "guarding your heart." I was lousy with this.

Never forget that our heavenly Father has adopted us out of our earthly family, good or bad. If it was bad as yours and mine, we must never forget that God is NOT like our earthly father in any way. He Loves us. He will always open His arms to receive us no matter what we have done and will give us the knowledge and strength we need to be victorious over any challenge or hurdle. He has a great plan for our lives and promises NEVER to leave nor forsake us. HE is God and Creator of the Universe and anything we Christians ask in His name, according to His will, we will receive. We "can do all things in Christ Jesus." Time must come to full measure in the working of God and we must endeavor to be patient and continue to grow as we wait on the Lord who only knows the perfect time for a miracle.

 

[EmmaCat]

Ouch. I'm sorry.

Praying for you!

 

[Monksailor]

May I call you jjj? As I understand it, the larger part of counseling is not forgiving those who who have abused you as a child, but rather realizing how it has affected you, not only the initial damage but all of the fallout damage. You cannot exercise a forgiveness of the whole offense until you realize all of the damage. For a Christian, anyone, healing cannot have its full work until forgiveness is found and wrought out by the abused but before that there may be years of working through very tough issues regarding problematic behavior developed as a result of the abuse. It is wonderful that you even want to forgive and have to at least some degree. Sexual abuse of a child (really any age but children are very impressionable and naive) by a parent/guardian can rip and tear not only on the victim physically but in a much, much worse way, psychologically. The damage if not very painfully dealt with can change a person's sexual orientation, ability to ever trust another person (or deity) of the same sex as the perpetrator, possess a fear complex of any unknown-needing to control and manipulate their environment), inability to ever be submissive (trusting), inability to have sexual or personal intimacy, a feeling that lying is an acceptable mode of operation, and on and on. One thing a lot of people including some counselors don't realize is that the adult victim of child sexual abuse may be actually carrying intense and destructive guilt for what was actually an assault upon them. If a young child is approached by the trusted and idolized and cherished perpetrator/parent before they know anything about sex and that monster cons the poor child into thinking that sex is a normal part of a healthy parent/child relationship they can be manipulated into willingly engaging into the perversion. It will become just as, if not even more pleasurable, to the child. After years of this pattern what do you think happens to the mind of a child when they realize they have been a willing and contributing member of a horrible, horrible act? Now remember we are still dealing with a child's mind trying to handle such an unimaginable load along with all of the other social loads of possible adolescence occurring.

 

[jajejllc]

May I call you jjj? As I understand it, the larger part of counseling is not forgiving those who who have abused you as a child, but rather realizing how it has affected you, not only the initial damage but all of the fallout damage. You cannot exercise a forgiveness of the whole offense until you realize all of the damage. For a Christian, anyone, healing cannot have its full work until forgiveness is found and wrought out by the abused but before that there may be years of working through very tough issues regarding problematic behavior developed as a result of the abuse. It is wonderful that you even want to forgive and have to at least some degree. Sexual abuse of a child (really any age but children are very impressionable and naive) by a parent/guardian can rip and tear not only on the victim physically but in a much, much worse way, psychologically. The damage if not very painfully dealt with can change a person's sexual orientation, ability to ever trust another person (or deity) of the same sex as the perpetrator, possess a fear complex of any unknown-needing to control and manipulate their environment), inability to ever be submissive (trusting), inability to have sexual or personal intimacy, a feeling that lying is an acceptable mode of operation, and on and on. One thing a lot of people including some counselors don't realize is that the adult victim of child sexual abuse may be actually carrying intense and destructive guilt for what was actually an assault upon them. If a young child is approached by the trusted and idolized and cherished perpetrator/parent before they know anything about sex and that monster cons the poor child into thinking that sex is a normal part of a healthy parent/child relationship they can be manipulated into willingly engaging into the perversion. It will become just as, if not even more pleasurable, to the child. After years of this pattern what do you think happens to the mind of a child when they realize they have been a willing and contributing member of a horrible, horrible act? Now remember we are still dealing with a child's mind trying to handle such an unimaginable load along with all of the other social loads of possible adolescence occurring.

Good post Monksailor. Appreciate all the counsel. I have dealt with my past for greater than 15 yrs with counseling, forgiveness, identification of truth in responsibility, and so on. My wife has been affected by this and I believe her past childhood hurts as well. I know I can't changer her. She wants a divorce. My heart hurts deeply now because of this. I want our marriage to work. I believe it can by God's grace. We have 5 minor children at home. I can and can't understand how, she as a believer, can become so callous regarding something so important to God, not to mention society.

 

[hypostatic]

Praying.

 

[Monksailor]

I am sorry that you have found yourself in such a painful situation. In past years I was into pornography and fantasy for a poor sex substitute for the sexual intimacy I wasn't having in my marriage. It was easy to blame her and if I wanted to I could get a whole auditorium of guys to sympathize with me. For me (and many others?) I think it was more out of a sense of inferiority, of a need to feel appreciated and desired. But what I came to understand is that however ill-equipped/inadequate that I believed I was (fallout from my own child abuse-wife/child beating but more psych abusive 3 college degreed alcoholic father-mother dead @ my age 12) I needed to take charge of our relationship with the power of our Father (forsake the adulterous porn-to even lust after another woman one has committed adultery themselves by Jesus own pronouncement), and determined and communicated to my wife in round about and new ways that all of my sexual fulfillment is going to come from her alone. I began to woo her all over again taking on a fresh mind of putting 1 Pt 3:7 and another which address building up your wife, making her shine radiantly in your eyes, and such. It takes time to change decades of patterns of behavior but it is working. The temptation for porn will never leave, probably. I have to deal with saying "No!" regularly but just keep in mind how really empty it is. Other than those brief moments of arousal through the artificial stimulus by fantasy and eventual fluid and endorphin release there is nothing but emptiness as God designed sex as an intimate expression of knowing and respecting one's spouse. And what just happened wasn't with your spouse, there was absolutely no real intimacy, and what Christian would respect one of the opposite sex who would expose their whole naked body to the whole world? It is a very clever trap of satan using what God made pleasurable and good and right and twisting it into something which will induce a destructive guilt and sense of powerlessness. Remember that it is satan steering us toward porn every time. "Get thee behind me satan!" "NO! I will not!"

***One more thing on this subject, anyone who thinks that through performing no or hiding downloads or going to sites from the "private" or "Incognito" or such browsers will enable one to hide their activity is terribly mistaken. The most important ONE knows, your ISP knows even if you can hide it all on your pc/smart phone, and I am sure that other third parties (governmental?) know. They have on record that you frequent Christian and porn sites. IF anyone in the future possessing or able to buy that info wanted to target Christians and destroy their testimony/credibility how hard do you think it would be?

 

[Monksailor]

I didn't get your last post till after my last one so:

• Committing adultery today is smiled upon or insignificant to the majority of the world's societies today,
• Adultery is much more pervasive IN the church than I think you realize, esp if you consider that ALL who even lust after another other than their spouse has committed adultery
• I would say that if we practice looking at porn then we have clearly committed adultery in Jesus' eyes
  
• Adultery is not the unforgivable sin by God or man/woman
• I think the Bible does allow for a divorce if forgiveness cannot be found for adultery; I think that is 'cause if you cannot forgive, you won't be able to trust and trust is essential in a marital relationship.
• Sexual sin is given more depth in God's Word because it hurts deeper. It hurts the intimate and private places deep inside.
  
• It sounds that you with the past childhood you have had are progressing in your Spiritual life with the Lord commendably.

 

[jajejllc]

All the replies and counsel is much appreciated. I accept that I will leave in God's hands. Who it is or was, I will leave to Him. I do desire reconciliation for my marriage and appreciate prayers to that end. With a forum as large as this, are there any others with words of wisdom or encouragement?

 

[Greg Merrill]

My wife and I have been married for 18+ years. We have been separated since Feb. I am wanting prayer for reconciliation. I registered for Christian Forums to ask a question and get counsel from other believers and for prayer for the following. My wife confessed to me in April that she committed adultery in March of this year. It was very painful. I have forgiven her from my heart. My issue that I deal with in a large part is jealousy. But I have been struggling with wanting to know who the other person was. It consumes me at times and comes into my mind without warning at times. Is it proper for me to want to know who the other person is? Should I even be concerned about it? How do I handle it in light of scriptural truth. The only thing that comes to mind immediately is that verse in Hebrews, "whoremongers and adulterers, God will judge. What should be my attitude towards all this?

This is not so much a request for prayer as for advice. As I would probably receive a warning from the staff for giving much advice on this prayer wall, I will simply pray. Father, I pray that You will lead in a way that will illuminate this one to the advice You would have them receive. I pray for the reconciliation of this couple, that the harm that has been done can be healed, and that they can somehow be even stronger going through this time in their lives. I pray that they both will seek to strengthen their marriage, and to guard it more closely in the future. May true repentance and forgiveness be what they both really want and strive after. To Your glory. Amen.

 

[hypostatic]

Praying for restoration.

 

[tturt]

Rather than pursing knowing who it was - I would vigorously ask Yahweh to help me forgive him.

Praying for you, your wife, and children.

 

[jajejllc]

Rather than pursing knowing who it was - I would vigorously ask Yahweh to help me forgive him.

Praying for you, your wife, and children.

Thank you. I will.

 

[jajejllc]

Thank you brothers and sisters for your words of encouragement, prayers, and counsel. It is a blessing to be able to draw from the wisdom and experiences of others. I intend to keep everyone updated on a periodic basis, if appropriate, as to how God is working. Please continue to pray for marriage restoration/reconciliation, for emotional/spiritual healing for my wife, and for my children. I have five minor children in the home and this is affecting them very negatively.

 

[Monksailor]

I will endeavor to keep you and your family in my prayers. Please remember that in spite of the secular society dominated child-rearing mentality we live in, where the parents are assumed the sole responsibility of a child's future personality/character, that God has endowed/created them (while yet in the mother's womb-He co-conceived them with your and your wife's raw materials) with their own unique personalities, that children from even "model" homes run away or go south the second they leave the nest, AND MOSTLY remember that even you and I having come the childhoods we did with such rotten parents can be redeemed and become new creations in Christ. Concerning your marriage, even though God hates divorce he does allow it in your case and i am sure that if that is His direction for you that He will bless the outcome. One thing I absolutely know for sure is that living with a spouse the other cannot trust and respect and honor is NOT conducive to good parenting either, even if you love and "think" you nurturing them while living in a bad marriage. Part of nurturing is LIVING a good marital relationship. Additionally, if your marital relationship is not good your parenting cannot be good because the two of you MUST function as one in harmony as parents cause your children will, without ANY doubt, know of the disharmony and they will play on it and work it to their advantage your disadvantage; you can't blame them as they are only children but know that it will happen and they will come to think that life is about manipulating their circumstances and not just doing what is right and honorable. They come to think that marital relationships friendship-wise and sexually and otherwise is at it is modeled. These perceptions can be changed with God's supernatural help later but it might be after a marriage goes bad or whatever. It could even certainly turn them from Christianity if all they see is pain and unhappiness and frustration and depression the majority of the time in a Christian home.

Ask yourself this question, "If I had to go in for surgery which would leave me totally incapacitated for two weeks at home and solely dependent upon her to care for me and keep me alive through a period in which if I died there would be little suspicion of it not being natural causes; could I trust her not to let me die if an opportunity came knowing that if I did she and whoever would be well-provided for?" This could happen to any of us today after being hit head-on by a nut with their face in their text gadget.

 

[jajejllc]

I just wanted to post an update. Not much change in our situation from my vantage point. Of course I don't know what the Lord is doing that I can't see. I spend time with the children on a periodic basis in my home while my wife is there. My wife and I I did spend some time together with a walk around the neighborhood. Not sure what else to say. I do covet your prayers. I also have a counseling session with my pastor tomorrow.