Main arguments against Angels (Gen 6)

[Philpy1976]

I was quite surprised to find that almost nobody at my church agreed with me when I spoke about the fallen angels in Genesis 6.
They refused to even give consideration to the "sons of God" being anything other than humans.

The translators of the NIV and Good news clearly agree that we are not talking about humans in this passage, so what are the main arguments against what is so obviously written?

I should also point out that if the main objection is what Jesus said to the Sadducees regarding the widow of seven husbands, it is, not only a very weak argument, but in fact adds credence to the fallen angel account.
(If you could marry in heaven, there would be no need for them to fall)

Also, if we can compile a serious scriptural based argument against Gen 6 talking about angels, who are the angels that were punished for sinning and what was their sin (if not breeding with human women), here I refer to 2 Peter:4-5 and Jude 1:6.

 

[Stryder06]

Sons of God - Sons of the righteous.

Daughters of men - Daughters of the wicked.

It should be noted that in scripture, the angels are called "stars of heaven" not "sons of God."

 

[Philpy1976]

Sons of God - Sons of the righteous.

Daughters of men - Daughters of the wicked.

It should be noted that in scripture, the angels are called "stars of heaven" not "sons of God."

Hmmm.
So bene ha ‘elohim (Sons of God) means the sons of the righteous?

So, in Job why does it say that bene ha ‘elohim (The sons of God) existed before creation?
Why does it say that God calls them to gather before him and that Satan joins them too, if we are talking about humans?

No scripture used either, which means this opinion is unsupported.

 

[Stryder06]

Hmmm.
So bene ha ‘elohim (Sons of God) means the sons of the righteous?

So, in Job why does it say that bene ha ‘elohim (The sons of God) existed before creation?
Why does it say that God calls them to gather before him and that Satan joins them too, if we are talking about humans?

No scripture used either, which means this opinion is unsupported.

We're not God's only "sons" so to speak. In this case however, when it talks about the Son's of God looking upon the daughter's of men, it's talking about the righteous falling for the wicked. Remember that Adam is called the the Son of God in Luke 3:38

And again, the angels aren't called son's of God. They're called the stars of heaven. The son's of God in Job are speaking about other created beings not of this world.

 

[Philpy1976]

We're not God's only "sons" so to speak. In this case however, when it talks about the Son's of God looking upon the daughter's of men, it's talking about the righteous falling for the wicked. Remember that Adam is called the the Son of God in Luke 3:38

And again, the angels aren't called son's of God. They're called the stars of heaven. The son's of God in Job are speaking about other created beings not of this world.

So Sons of god means different things at different times just so long as it suits your opinion, Ok. Again, no scripture to back this idea up.
But let's push forward...

Who then, were the angels that sinned and what was their sin? (if not Gen 6)

 

[Stryder06]

So Sons of god means different things at different times just so long as it suits your opinion, Ok. Again, no scripture to back this idea up.
But let's push forward...

Who then, were the angels that sinned and what was their sin? (if not Gen 6)

I provided you with scripture that shows that men are called the son's of God, unless of course you don't think Adam was a man. And again I pointed out that scripture calls the angels "stars of heaven" not "son's of God".

And what sin in Gen 6? Gen 6 is about man, not angels, falling into wickedness

 

[Lion King]

Sons of God - Sons of the righteous.

Daughters of men - Daughters of the wicked.

It should be noted that in scripture, the angels are called "stars of heaven" not "sons of God."

This is a first.

Angels are referred to as sons of God in the Scriptures:

To what were its foundations fastened?
Or who laid its cornerstone,
When the morning stars sang together,
And all the sons of God shouted for joy? - Job 38:6-7

 

[Lion King]

We're not God's only "sons" so to speak. In this case however, when it talks about the Son's of God looking upon the daughter's of men, it's talking about the righteous falling for the wicked. Remember that Adam is called the the Son of God in Luke 3:38

And again, the angels aren't called son's of God. They're called the stars of heaven. The son's of God in Job are speaking about other created beings not of this world.

You just lost the little credibility you had with that reply.

Who gave you this doctrine? Was it Ellen white?

 

[Philpy1976]

I provided you with scripture that shows that men are called the son's of God, unless of course you don't think Adam was a man. And again I pointed out that scripture calls the angels "stars of heaven" not "son's of God".

And what sin in Gen 6? Gen 6 is about man, not angels, falling into wickedness

You still don't answer my question.

Peter's 2nd epistle and Jude both talk about the punishment given to the angels that sinned, so I am asking, what was their sin?

 

[Stryder06]

This is a first.

Angels are referred to as sons of God in the Scriptures:

To what were its foundations fastened?
Or who laid its cornerstone,
When the morning stars sang together,
And all the sons of God shouted for joy? - Job 38:6-7

Notice there are two entities here "the morning stars" which sang and the "son's of God" who clapped their hands.

Now think of this - And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth...

 

[Stryder06]

You just lost the little credibility you had with that reply.

Who gave you this doctrine? Was it Ellen white?

If you think angels who are spiritual beings, were having sex with women, I'm not the one with the credibility issue.

 

[Stryder06]

You still don't answer my question.

Peter's 2nd epistle and Jude both talk about the punishment given to the angels that sinned, so I am asking, what was their sin?

Their sin was rebelling against God.

 

[Lion King]

If you think angels who are spiritual beings, were having sex with women, I'm not the one with the credibility issue.

Dude, you believe in aliens! Based on what?

Also, how do you explain the existence of the Nephilim in the time of Noah?

 

[Stryder06]

Dude, you believe in aliens! Based on what?

Based on the text provided in job. What makes you think that we're the only beings besides angels, that God would have created?

And yeah, "aliens" is more plausible than angelic beings taking wives. Notice that is what the scripture says happened. Who did God establish the marriage covenant between? Wasn't it man and woman? Angels can't take wives or produce offspring.

 

[Philpy1976]

If you think angels who are spiritual beings, were having sex with women, I'm not the one with the credibility issue.

Angels were able to eat with Abraham, how do spiritual beings eat?
The men in Sodom wanted to have sex with the angels.

Both of these things suggest that Angles manifest in physical form.

 

[SwordFall]

We're not God's only "sons" so to speak. In this case however, when it talks about the Son's of God looking upon the daughter's of men, it's talking about the righteous falling for the wicked. Remember that Adam is called the the Son of God in Luke 3:38

And again, the angels aren't called son's of God. They're called the stars of heaven. The son's of God in Job are speaking about other created beings not of this world.

They can be called either or, primarily because angels are masculine- interestingly, there is not one feminine angel in the entire pantheon of angelology.
(the irony I suppose is the feminine bias they are sketched with among people lol)

To say they are 'sons of God' is to beatifically illustrate their being.

 

[Stryder06]

Angels were able to eat with Abraham, how do spiritual beings eat?
The men in Sodom wanted to have sex with the angels.

Both of these things suggest that Angles manifest in physical form.

I didn't say angel's couldn't manifest in a physical form. But being able to eat, and having sexual organs, are two different things. And the men in Sodom were wicked. They wanted to have sex with two men. They didn't know they were angels.

 

[Stryder06]

They can be called either or, primarily because angels are masculine- interestingly, there is not one feminine angel in the entire pantheon of angelology.

To say they are 'sons of God' is to beatifically illustrate their being.

This isn't about masculinity or femininity. The text says the son's of God clapped their hands, and the stars sang. That shows two different groups of witnesses.

 

[Lion King]

Notice there are two entities here "the morning stars" which sang and the "son's of God" who clapped their hands.

Now think of this - And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth...

Notice, there are angels, principalities and powers?

For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Romans 8:38

Does this mean angels are not principalities and powers?

 

[Lion King]

Based on the text provided in job. What makes you think that we're the only beings besides angels, that God would have created?

And yeah, "aliens" is more plausible than angelic beings taking wives. Notice that is what the scripture says happened. Who did God establish the marriage covenant between? Wasn't it man and woman? Angels can't take wives or produce offspring.

How do you explain the existence of Nephilim in the time of Noah?