linking Dan 9 and the AoD with the O.D.

[RandyPNW]

There is strong evidence that a majority of early Church Fathers saw Dan 9 and its Abomination of Desolation (AoD) linked to the AoD of Jesus' Olivet Discourse. The Church Fathers, as a majority, saw the AoD in Dan 9 and in the Olivet Discourse as the same, identifying it as the 70 AD destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple. They indicated as such by referencing the time of the earthly ministry of Christ, followed by the Roman desolation of the Temple and Jerusalem in that general era. Here is the evidence. Exceptions to this time frame for the AoD are Irenaeus and Hippolytus, who saw the AoD as the Antichrist, though they still linked the AoD of Dan 9 with the AoD of the Olivet Discourse.

Here Africanus saw the 70 Weeks as completed in the time of Christ...

https://www.biblestudytools.com/hist...africanus.html

Sextes Julius Africanus (180-250)
The Extant Fragments of the Five Books of the Chronography of Julius Africanus.16

"It is by calculating from Artaxerxes, therefore, up to the time of Christ that the seventy weeks are made up, according to the numeration of the Jews."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here Tertullian refers to Daniel's prophecy of the 70 Weeks, which is followed by the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple in the time following the ministry of Christ. I would assume that Tertullian here is identifying the AoD of Dan 9 with the AoD of the Olivet Discourse?...

http://www.earlychristianwritings.co...tullian08.html
Tertullian (155-240)
AN ANSWER TO THE JEWS.
CHAP. VIII.--OF THE TIMES OF CHRIST'S BIRTH AND PASSION, AND OF JERUSALEM'S DESTRUCTION.

"Accordingly the times must be inquired into of the predicted and future nativity of the Christ, and of His passion, and of the extermination of the city of Jerusalem, that is, its devastation. For Daniel says, that "both the holy city and the holy place are exterminated together with the coming Leader, and that the pinnacle is destroyed unto ruin." And so the times of the coming Christ, the Leader, must be inquired into, which we shall trace in Daniel; and, after computing them, shall prove Him to be come, even on the ground of the times prescribed, and of competent signs and operations of His.
...Vespasian, in the first year of his empire, subdues the Jews in war; and there are made lii years, vi months. For he reigned xi years. And thus, in the day of their storming, the Jews fulfilled the lxx hebdomads predicted in Daniel."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here Origen also views the 70 Weeks of Dan 9 as being fulfiled in the time of Christ. That would seem to make the Olivet Discourse and its AoD a fulfillment of Dan 9?...

Origen (184-253)
DE PRINCIPIIS

"And according to Daniel, seventy weeks were fulfilled until (the coming of) Christ the Ruler."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Clement of Alexandria (150-215) also saw Daniel's 70th Week and the AoD as fulfilled in the destruction of Jerusalem in the time after Jesus' ministry. Again, this would identify the AoD of the Olivet Discourse with the Roman destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.

Clement of Alexandria, Stromata, book 1, chapter 21 http://www.earlychristianwritings.co...ata-book1.html
In those "sixty and two weeks," as the prophet said, and "in the one week," was He Lord. The half of the week Nero held sway, and in the holy city Jerusalem placed the abomination; and in the half of the week he was taken away, and Otho, and Galba, and Vitellius. And Vespasian rose to the supreme power, and destroyed Jerusalem, and desolated the holy place. And that such are the facts of the case, is clear to him that is able to understand, as the prophet said.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Irenaeus (180 AD) quotes Matthew 24.15 and discusses the Antichrist, and identifies him as the AoD of both Dan 9 and the Olivet Discourse. Irenaeus mentions both the "Week" of Dan 9 and the being "put to flight" of the Olivet Discourse, thus identifying Antichrist as the AoD in both passages. He does differ, however, from other Church Fathers in denying this is in the time of Christ's earthly ministry.

Against Heresies Book 5.25.4
And then he [Daniel] points out the time that his [Antichrist s] tyranny shall last, during which the saints shall be put to flight, they who offer a pure sacrifice unto God: And in the midst of the week, he says, the sacrifice and the libation shall be taken away, and the abomination of desolation [shall be brought] into the temple: even unto the consummation of the time shall the desolation be complete. Now three years and six months constitute the half-week.

 

[Douggg]

Randy, go here...

I think it would help....

in our discussions, if everyone would put in their forum member display information their eschatological view point - i.e. futurist, historicist, partial preterist, idealist. See my description of myself to the left - as being a futurist, for example. Jerryhuerta shows himself as a...

www.christianforums.com

and follow the how to instructions in post #9 - to describe your basic positions. It will help us all.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

There is strong evidence that a majority of early Church Fathers saw Dan 9 and its Abomination of Desolation (AoD) linked to the AoD of Jesus' Olivet Discourse. The Church Fathers, as a majority, saw the AoD in Dan 9 and in the Olivet Discourse as the same, identifying it as the 70 AD destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple. They indicated as such by referencing the time of the earthly ministry of Christ, followed by the Roman desolation of the Temple and Jerusalem in that general era. Here is the evidence. Exceptions to this time frame for the AoD are Irenaeus and Hippolytus, who saw the AoD as the Antichrist, though they still linked the AoD of Dan 9 with the AoD of the Olivet Discourse.

Here Africanus saw the 70 Weeks as completed in the time of Christ...

https://www.biblestudytools.com/hist...africanus.html

Sextes Julius Africanus (180-250)
The Extant Fragments of the Five Books of the Chronography of Julius Africanus.16

"It is by calculating from Artaxerxes, therefore, up to the time of Christ that the seventy weeks are made up, according to the numeration of the Jews."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here Tertullian refers to Daniel's prophecy of the 70 Weeks, which is followed by the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple in the time following the ministry of Christ. I would assume that Tertullian here is identifying the AoD of Dan 9 with the AoD of the Olivet Discourse?...

http://www.earlychristianwritings.co...tullian08.html
Tertullian (155-240)
AN ANSWER TO THE JEWS.
CHAP. VIII.--OF THE TIMES OF CHRIST'S BIRTH AND PASSION, AND OF JERUSALEM'S DESTRUCTION.

"Accordingly the times must be inquired into of the predicted and future nativity of the Christ, and of His passion, and of the extermination of the city of Jerusalem, that is, its devastation. For Daniel says, that "both the holy city and the holy place are exterminated together with the coming Leader, and that the pinnacle is destroyed unto ruin." And so the times of the coming Christ, the Leader, must be inquired into, which we shall trace in Daniel; and, after computing them, shall prove Him to be come, even on the ground of the times prescribed, and of competent signs and operations of His.
...Vespasian, in the first year of his empire, subdues the Jews in war; and there are made lii years, vi months. For he reigned xi years. And thus, in the day of their storming, the Jews fulfilled the lxx hebdomads predicted in Daniel."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here Origen also views the 70 Weeks of Dan 9 as being fulfiled in the time of Christ. That would seem to make the Olivet Discourse and its AoD a fulfillment of Dan 9?...

Origen (184-253)
DE PRINCIPIIS

"And according to Daniel, seventy weeks were fulfilled until (the coming of) Christ the Ruler."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Clement of Alexandria (150-215) also saw Daniel's 70th Week and the AoD as fulfilled in the destruction of Jerusalem in the time after Jesus' ministry. Again, this would identify the AoD of the Olivet Discourse with the Roman destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.

Clement of Alexandria, Stromata, book 1, chapter 21 http://www.earlychristianwritings.co...ata-book1.html
In those "sixty and two weeks," as the prophet said, and "in the one week," was He Lord. The half of the week Nero held sway, and in the holy city Jerusalem placed the abomination; and in the half of the week he was taken away, and Otho, and Galba, and Vitellius. And Vespasian rose to the supreme power, and destroyed Jerusalem, and desolated the holy place. And that such are the facts of the case, is clear to him that is able to understand, as the prophet said.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Irenaeus (180 AD) quotes Matthew 24.15 and discusses the Antichrist, and identifies him as the AoD of both Dan 9 and the Olivet Discourse. Irenaeus mentions both the "Week" of Dan 9 and the being "put to flight" of the Olivet Discourse, thus identifying Antichrist as the AoD in both passages. He does differ, however, from other Church Fathers in denying this is in the time of Christ's earthly ministry.

Against Heresies Book 5.25.4
And then he [Daniel] points out the time that his [Antichrist s] tyranny shall last, during which the saints shall be put to flight, they who offer a pure sacrifice unto God: And in the midst of the week, he says, the sacrifice and the libation shall be taken away, and the abomination of desolation [shall be brought] into the temple: even unto the consummation of the time shall the desolation be complete. Now three years and six months constitute the half-week.

It seems to me that it should be obvious that Jesus was referring to Daniel 9:26-27 because that clearly fits the context of part of what Jesus had been talking about prior to the Olivet Discourse.

He had just specifically said that the temple buildings would be destroyed just prior to starting the Olivet Discourse and the first question the disciples asked Him was related to when that would happen. He also had previously indicated that Jerusalem itself would be destroyed (see Luke 19:41-44). Since Daniel 9:26-27 specifically mentions the destruction of the city and the sanctuary and Jesus had already referenced the destruction of the city of Jerusalem and the temple, Daniel 9:26-27 would be the obvious prophecy of Daniel that people should think of when they see Jesus referencing the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet in the Olivet Discourse.

 

[RandyPNW]

It seems to me that it should be obvious that Jesus was referring to Daniel 9:26-27 because that clearly fits the context of part of what Jesus had been talking about prior to the Olivet Discourse.

He had just specifically said that the temple buildings would be destroyed just prior to starting the Olivet Discourse and the first question the disciples asked Him was related to when that would happen. He also had previously indicated that Jerusalem itself would be destroyed (see Luke 19:41-44). Since Daniel 9:26-27 specifically mentions the destruction of the city and the sanctuary and Jesus had already referenced the destruction of the city of Jerusalem and the temple, Daniel 9:26-27 would be the obvious prophecy of Daniel that people should think of when they see Jesus referencing the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet in the Olivet Discourse.

Yes, thank you. And yet a good number of people on the two forums I am presently on argue otherwise. I'm glad to hear sensibility on this. Thanks again!

 

[David Kent]

It seems to me that it should be obvious that Jesus was referring to Daniel 9:26-27 because that clearly fits the context of part of what Jesus had been talking about prior to the Olivet Discourse.

He had just specifically said that the temple buildings would be destroyed just prior to starting the Olivet Discourse and the first question the disciples asked Him was related to when that would happen. He also had previously indicated that Jerusalem itself would be destroyed (see Luke 19:41-44). Since Daniel 9:26-27 specifically mentions the destruction of the city and the sanctuary and Jesus had already referenced the destruction of the city of Jerusalem and the temple, Daniel 9:26-27 would be the obvious prophecy of Daniel that people should think of when they see Jesus referencing the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet in the Olivet Discourse.

Yes I agree thank you.