Lets keep it simple...

[Thekla]

That would be my Church.
It meets 24/7 365, anytime, anywhere.

Don't forget the part of the Church that is even outside of time

 

[maco]

The true church is not a denomination, but rather, a people who keeps the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus. The Devil hates them and is making war with them.

 

[sunlover1]

Every form of Christianity save one has changed God's law by caving to secular pressures and revising morality....talk about " the beast"...huh.

??
What do you mean by God's "law"?

 

[NorrinRadd]

The Church does correctly interpret scripture and has done consistently since Pentecost. It is not to individuals but to the body of Christ that the Holy Spirit is promised to guide into all truth.

OTOH, individuals are expected to be like the Bereans who did not automatically trust "the Church," but tested even the words of apostles against Scripture.

 

[Rick Otto]

Just as the Holy Spirit was poured out (at Pentecost) to those in assembly (as commanded), and the Church is - as body, per Paul - made up of various members operating as a whole, so the Church is not made up of individuals but is an aggregation of persons.

LOL! Might as well say,...
A whole bunch, made up of individual grapes growing together, so the bunch is not made of individual grapes but is a bunch of individual grapes.

Individuals are the persons who aggregate.

Rarely do I see such obvious self-contradiction,

 

[Rick Otto]

Don't forget the part of the Church that is even outside of time

Same one. We meet just in time.

 

[prodromos]

Individuals are the persons who aggregate.

Rarely do I see such obvious self-contradiction,

I don't at this moment have access to the book, but when I do I will quote what is said regarding thd distinction between "individuals" and "persons" from "Church Papacy and Schism" by Philip Sherrard.

 

[Thekla]

LOL! Might as well say,...
A whole bunch, made up of individual grapes growing together, so the bunch is not made of individual grapes but is a bunch of individual grapes.

Individuals are the persons who aggregate.

Rarely do I see such obvious self-contradiction,

The term individual has accreted cultural connotations which are askance the notion of wholeness/body iterated by Paul.

Consider, the Greek for "individual" is "idiotis" ...
(Paul uses the term in Corinthians to refer to the novices/those who are not full members of the ekklesia.)

Individual has the connotation - in English - of self sufficient. Yet we are not self-sufficient, but rely on God for our existence (whether we believe in Him or not ...).

 

[Cribstyl]

The true church is not a denomination, but rather, a people who keeps the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus. The Devil hates them and is making war with them.

I've looked into that statement deeply.

It is considered part of the 3 angel's messages.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[maco]

I've looked into that statement deeply.

It is considered part of the 3 angel's messages.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

Is that what you learned from your in depth Bible study or did you hear that from the SDA?

 

[maco]

So what have we learned so far:

1. Nowhere does the Bible say Sunday is the Lord's day.
2. Nowhere does the Bible say the early church gathered on Sunday.
3. Nowhere does the Bible say that the seventh day Sabbath was changed to the
first day.
4. Jesus gathered every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
5. Paul gathered every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
6. The early church gather every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
7. The seventh day was blessed and sanctified as part of creation itself.
8. God protected the seventh day with His Law.
9. The seventh day Sabbath is for all mankind, as well as, the animals.
10. The change to the seventh day Sabbath, from the seventh day to the first day,
came long after Jesus and the Apostles and is not supported by Scripture.
11. The Beast of Daniel and Revelation is the influencing force behind the change to
God's times and God's Law.
12. Those who love God and keep His commandments will be persecuted by the
dragon.
13. Jesus Himself said that He is Lord of the Sabbath making the Sabbath the Lord's
day.
14. We still have a seven day week with the seventh day created as a blessed and
holy day.

So I ask you, what is really keeping you for honoring the seventh day as the Lord's day? It's not the Bible. It's not Jesus. It's not the New Covenant. What could it be? Maybe fear of persecution and excommunication? Maybe you're not willing to make such a life style change? Maybe pride is keeping you from acknowledging that you were wrong? What could it be?

 

[sunlover1]

Originally Posted by sunlover1

What is the church made up OF.. if not "individuals"?​

No shnikey. This same non-sense is used to put distance between misbehaving church officials & the rest of their church.
Innocence by disassociation.

Never heard it put quite that way.
RO=WS

OTOH, individuals are expected to be like the Bereans who did not automatically trust "the Church," but tested even the words of apostles against Scripture.

Because, as 1 Cor 12 says:
Now you are Christ's body,
and individually members of it.

Same one. We meet just in time.

Would that be in "due" time?

 

[SwordFall]

Worshiping God is no longer about Creation, but revering the Savior.

Being that Saturday was about Creation and Sunday is about the Christ's triumph, I see no reason why the Sabbath shouldn't be Sunday.

 

[maco]

Worshiping God is no longer about Creation, but revering the Savior.

Being that Saturday was about Creation and Sunday is about the Christ's triumph, I see no reason why the Sabbath shouldn't be Sunday.

Again, only the opinions of man.

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath so why not honor His day as you honor Him. Don't you realize that honoring the seventh day is, in itself, a form of worshiping God?

 

[Rick Otto]

Why not realize every day & everything therein is His?
There is no physical law that proves, illustrates, conveys, or establishes property rights.
Why? Because they all belong to Him. We are put by faith, in the position of trustees.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by SwordFall

Worshiping God is no longer about Creation, but revering the Savior.

Being that Saturday was about Creation and Sunday is about the Christ's triumph, I see no reason why the Sabbath shouldn't be Sunday.
​

Again, only the opinions of man.

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath so why not honor His day as you honor Him. Don't you realize that honoring the seventh day is, in itself, a form of worshiping God?

Not to the apostate non-Christian Jews of today

http://www.christianforums.com/t4956482/#post32639098
Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath of Creation...

God rested at creation (Genesis 2:1-3) and the Word (Christ) was with God (John 1:1-2) and the Spirit of God was was there at creation. God made the day holy at Eden and gave it to Adam and Eve before sin entered and 2500 years before the first Jew was born. Any unprejudiced mind may see the two laws in the New Testament, by carefully searching for the truth. One is called a yoke of BONDAGE; Gal.5:1 the other is called a royal law of LIBERTY; James 1:25; 2:8

Jesus Christ is Lord of the Seventh-Day Sabbath (Matthew 12:8) which is given to all mankind. (Mark 2:27,28). Many people get confused and think the Sabbath and Jesus are the same thing, but it clearly says in scripture that Jesus is Lord of it not the Sabbath itself. Many say they love and follow Jesus, but as soon as His holy name is associated with His Seventh day Sabbath [Matthew 12:8] it becomes clear, they may mouth the words but they are not "following" what Jesus gave as His testimonies. Yet, since all things were created through Him, He also created the Sabbath. If you accept Jesus, you will accept His Sabbath of the fourth commandment to keep it holy. After all, we are followers of Jesus Christ who never went to church on Sunday or declare another day as His day of worship, so we cannot be following Him if we go on a day that He didnt set as His Sabbath. Jesus Lord of the Sabbath and if we follow Him and keep his Sabbath, it should not matter if other Christians who want to be popular with the world dont follow.

God's Seventh-Day Sabbath was given to Adam as the head of all humanity and nations. When he failed, is where the Lord Jesus Christ succeeded, declaring Himself Lord of the Seventh-Day Sabbath in the New Testament as the new head of all humanity (Mark 2:28; Isa.9:6). It was kept by all the New Testament apostolic church, even the Gentiles (Acts 13:42-44; 15:21; 16:13 Rev.1:10) in honor of Christ as our Creator God (Gen.1:1-2:3; John 1:1-3, Eph.3:9; Col.1:16,17; Hebrews 1:2,10)

The very basis and foundation of the New Testament Covenant and the Gospel, is that the 10 Commandments point out our sins and bring us to CHRIST to seek forgiveness. Soon as we are cleansed from sin by the blood of JESUS, GOD gives us a brand new heart of flesh by taking away our stony hearts hardened by sin, where He Himself writes love for His holy moral code of the Decalogue. (Hebrews 8: 6-13; 10:16-26). This is true New Testament Christianity.

The Sabbath also has a moral element: “the worship of GOD” (Rev.14:6,7). The day is singled out by GOD as a mark, seal or sign of sanctification, the work of a lifetime according to John Wesley, the famous Reformation Preacher and founder of Methodism. (Ezekiel 20:12,13,20,21).

Now we can see why JESUS declared Himself Lord of the Sabbath. Because He is God our Creator and deserves all our affection and worship in answering His love for us.

"All things were made by Him (CHRIST); and without Him was not anything made that was made." John's Gospel 1:1-3
"And to make all man see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning (creation) of the world has been hidden in God, who created all things by JESUS CHRIST." Ephesians 3:9

Note here that Salvation is a free gift and cannot be earned (Eph.2:8) and it must be love for JESUS that inspires us to worship and obey Him. For by Him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him (JESUS CHRIST), and for Him:

15 Christ is the visible image of the invisible God.
He existed before anything was created and is supreme over all creation,[e]
16 for through him God created everything
in the heavenly realms and on earth.
He made the things we can see
and the things we can’t see—
such as thrones, kingdoms, rulers, and authorities in the unseen world.
Everything was created through him and for him.
17 He existed before anything else,
and he holds all creation together." Colossians 1:13-17.

"GOD has appointed His Son heir of all things, by whom He also made the worlds." (plural) Heb.1:2

Jesus Lord of the Sabbath, said that His Sabbath was made for man, to benefit us, His gift to us:

1And it came to pass on the second sabbath after the first, that he went through the corn fields; and his disciples plucked the ears of corn, and did eat, rubbing them in their hands.
2And certain of the Pharisees said unto them, Why do ye that which is not lawful to do on the sabbath days?
3And Jesus answering them said, Have ye not read so much as this, what David did, when himself was an hungred, and they which were with him;
4How he went into the house of God, and did take and eat the shewbread, and gave also to them that were with him; which it is not lawful to eat but for the priests alone? 5And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath. Luke 6:1-5


"Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Six days shalt thou labour, and do all your work;
But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your GOD: in it shalt thou not do any work, you, nor your son, nor your daughter, your servant, cattle, nor the stranger who is within your gates:
For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day, wherefore the LORD blessed the seventh day, and made it holy." Exodus 20:8

 

[sunlover1]

Worshiping God is no longer about Creation, but revering the Savior.

Being that Saturday was about Creation and Sunday is about the Christ's triumph, I see no reason why the Sabbath shouldn't be Sunday.

No problem.
Enjoy Sunday as the day to meet.
But if we want to please God,
we'll enter in 'today'

Again, only the opinions of man.

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath so why not honor His day as you honor Him. Don't you realize that honoring the seventh day is, in itself, a form of worshiping God?

No, I didn't.

Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, 7He again fixes a certain day, "Today," saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before, "TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE, DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS." 8For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that.…
​

Why not realize every day & everything therein is His?

Today.
AMEN .


SN
RO=WS
(WordSmith)

 

[maco]

No problem.
Enjoy Sunday as the day to meet.
But if we want to please God,
we'll enter in 'today'


No, I didn't.

Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, 7He again fixes a certain day, "Today," saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before, "TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE, DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS." 8For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that.…
​

Today.
AMEN .


SN
RO=WS
(WordSmith)

Do you believe marriage is done away with since we are now married to Christ?

 

[NorrinRadd]

So what have we learned so far:

1. Nowhere does the Bible say Sunday is the Lord's day.
2. Nowhere does the Bible say the early church gathered on Sunday.
3. Nowhere does the Bible say that the seventh day Sabbath was changed to the
first day.
4. Jesus gathered every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
5. Paul gathered every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
6. The early church gather every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
7. The seventh day was blessed and sanctified as part of creation itself.
8. God protected the seventh day with His Law.
9. The seventh day Sabbath is for all mankind, as well as, the animals.
10. The change to the seventh day Sabbath, from the seventh day to the first day,
came long after Jesus and the Apostles and is not supported by Scripture.
11. The Beast of Daniel and Revelation is the influencing force behind the change to
God's times and God's Law.
12. Those who love God and keep His commandments will be persecuted by the
dragon.
13. Jesus Himself said that He is Lord of the Sabbath making the Sabbath the Lord's
day.
14. We still have a seven day week with the seventh day created as a blessed and
holy day.

So I ask you, what is really keeping you for honoring the seventh day as the Lord's day? It's not the Bible. It's not Jesus. It's not the New Covenant. What could it be? Maybe fear of persecution and excommunication? Maybe you're not willing to make such a life style change? Maybe pride is keeping you from acknowledging that you were wrong? What could it be?

You left out a few things:

We are no longer under the Law of the Obsolete Covenant.

That Law of Commandments and ordinances was abolished and nailed to the Cross.

No longer are any days "above" others, or more holy than others.

A return to observation of special days, months, seasons, and years is a return to the elemental principles and slavery of the Law from which we have been freed.

We are specifically freed from judgment regarding observance of sabbaths or any other supposedly special days.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by maco

So what have we learned so far:

1. Nowhere does the Bible say Sunday is the Lord's day.
2. Nowhere does the Bible say the early church gathered on Sunday.
3. Nowhere does the Bible say that the seventh day Sabbath was changed to the
first day.
4. Jesus gathered every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
5. Paul gathered every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
6. The early church gather every Sabbath for sacred assembly.
7. The seventh day was blessed and sanctified as part of creation itself.
8. God protected the seventh day with His Law.
9. The seventh day Sabbath is for all mankind, as well as, the animals.
10. The change to the seventh day Sabbath, from the seventh day to the first day,
came long after Jesus and the Apostles and is not supported by Scripture.
11. The Beast of Daniel and Revelation is the influencing force behind the change to
God's times and God's Law.
12. Those who love God and keep His commandments will be persecuted by the
dragon.
13. Jesus Himself said that He is Lord of the Sabbath making the Sabbath the Lord's
day.
14. We still have a seven day week with the seventh day created as a blessed and
holy day.

So I ask you, what is really keeping you for honoring the seventh day as the Lord's day? It's not the Bible. It's not Jesus. It's not the New Covenant. What could it be? Maybe fear of persecution and excommunication? Maybe you're not willing to make such a life style change? Maybe pride is keeping you from acknowledging that you were wrong? What could it be?
​

You left out a few things:

We are no longer under the Law of the Obsolete Covenant.

That Law of Commandments and ordinances was abolished and nailed to the Cross.

No longer are any days "above" others, or more holy than others.

A return to observation of special days, months, seasons, and years is a return to the elemental principles and slavery of the Law from which we have been freed.

We are specifically freed from judgment regarding observance of sabbaths or any other supposedly special days.

I would say those are some pretty important things. Good catch!



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