Lessons of Krishnaism: We are ALL Female!

[dlamberth]

Anyway, this is actually the first I've heard of this universal feminine idea.

This is the first I've heard of it as well.

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[WonderBeat]

I guess all marriages are now null and void except for lesbians legally married in Argentina, Belgium, Canada, Denmark, Iceland, Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Spain, South Africa, Sweden, Mexico, Aruba, Curaco, Saint Maarten, Israel, Uruguay, Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, New York, New Hampshire, Vermont, and Washington DC.

Not so. I am speaking on the absolute, ultimate, esoteric level. The love the Soul has for its Source. In that, the Bride meets Her Lover who is God.

 

[awitch]

Not so. I am speaking on the absolute, ultimate, esoteric level. The love the Soul has for its Source. In that, the Bride meets Her Lover who is God.

Mine was a tongue-in-cheek post. Just having some fun at the expense of a few Christians. They're such good sports about it.

 

[WonderBeat]

Welcome to Christian Forums. I have to say off the bat I have nothing against you personally and am sure you are a nice person. I have had a very negative experience with the Hare Krsna religion. My dad got involved in it, and the beliefs he brought back he forced on my family. The result was my mom and sibling and I forced into vegetarianism, my dad going from a cheerful and loving person who would respect my mom and us to guilt tripping us, yelling at us, using silence that would stretch on for days and sometimes weeks as a form of emotional punishment for whenever he didn't get his way. My mom was mocked for going to church and taking us with her, we were terrorized if we brought home meat, fish or eggs. I grew up in dread of going home as a kid, we were never hit but the emotional abuse, especially what my mom went through, to a large extent made my childhood very painful and difficult. We were afraid to have friends over, we never knew how my dad would behave, when he would fly off the handle and when things would be alright. Same was with my Mom and her friends. When my dad decided to leave this belief system, things got a bit better and are better now, although things at home sometimes are still rough, not that I live there anymore. The things that would go on affected me as a kid and also still do as an adult, and I have struggled with suicide and self-harm. That is not an excuse, but part of the reason. God is helping me work through these things.

I am not judging you and I do not know too much about your religion except from what I have read from Hare Krsna pamphlets that would be at our home. However I am very strongly biased against it because of what my family went through. I will probably not respond to most of your posts promoting your religion, because it brings back too many bad memories and I do not want to say something I will really later regret.

I want to tell you that Jesus Christ died on the cross for you, and that He is the only light of the world and hope for your salvation. He can offer you a life on earth and in eternity that no other belief system ever can. I will be praying for you, and wish you all the best.

I am sorry to hear all this. Please note that there is a difference between what is ideal and how practice unfolds. I cannot tell you that my own path is "the way, the truth, and the ONLY truth" because I don't believe in fanaticism. I don't even believe the Hare Krsna movement is the sole gateway to KRSNA. Krsna is bigger than the Hare Krsna movement and, I dare say, bigger than Hinduism. He is the universal Father. As such, he transcends any given religion.If you find yourself growing closer to the One God through Christianity, that is all well and good. That is your dharma. And I respect it wholeheartedly.

 

[WonderBeat]

this is actually the first I've heard of this universal feminine idea. I've never seen it referred to in any Scripture, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's a large group of Hindus who hold to it. After all, there is no central orthodoxy in our religion. I don't know how much this has to do with Hare Krishna though. To draw a rough analogy, Hare Krishna is to Hinduism what Mormonism is to Christianity.

It is true that Hinduism as it exists today has many sects, many varying perspectives on the Absolute truth. This is why I qualified my post by mentioning what I consider to be "authentic" Hinduism - that is, Hinduism which has the finalmost Revelation intact.

You may not accept this final view to what is the Absolute Truth - that is fine, I am only giving you my own viewpoint... But please note that this is what Vaishnava Vedanta teaches, not merely one sect of Hinduism known as Hare Krsna... what that particular sect teaches is important, and accurate. But KRSNA and His Truth, transcends any one sect, even if it proclaims itself exclusively to be His. Truth (KRSNA) is one, paths are many...

 

[WonderBeat]

It matters not what religion you follow but the how that teaching flows through the self and out to others. The stumbling block or inhibiting process of any faith is the ego itself, this strong sense of self that try's to control, force, manipulate and push others into a fixed agenda. Hinduism has many, many worthy points as does Christianity and to my mind only a reduction in ego enables the view to become clearer.

Very Nice.

 

[Rajni]

I believe there's a story about one of Hinduism's poet-saints, Mirabai, who was a devotee of Krishna. She had gone to a temple and one of the men said that women were not permitted to enter. She replied that she saw no men there, only women, as Krishna is the only true male.

The guys let her in.


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[WonderBeat]

Interesting.

Can you please explain what you mean by "AUTHENTIC" Hinduism, and how it differs from the (presumably) "non-authentic"?

By authentic I mean that teaching which has passed down through time immemorial to the present day from the very Lips of God. Not contaminated or filtered through human intervention.

Also, are there any Hindu scriptures supporting your claim, and if so, which ones are they?

Thank you.

I will attempt to find some passages explicit enough to state exactly what I say. However, basing myself simply on the strength of tradition, particularly that of Vaishnavism, it can be inferred that there is One Purusha (or absolute spirit) who is the Enjoyer, as opposed to the many Prakrits or beings Enjoyed (again, traditionally regarded as feminine or receptive in character). Krsna is separate from His Energy. Thus he is the Energetic, and Radha is his energy..... I cannot think off the top of my head a verse that tells of all this specifically and succinctly but the weight of literature should speak for itself however.

I will try and look for such passages, though.

 

[TG123]

I am sorry to hear all this. Please note that there is a difference between what is ideal and how practice unfolds. I cannot tell you that my own path is "the way, the truth, and the ONLY truth" because I don't believe in fanaticism. I don't even believe the Hare Krsna movement is the sole gateway to KRSNA. Krsna is bigger than the Hare Krsna movement and, I dare say, bigger than Hinduism. He is the universal Father. As such, he transcends any given religion.If you find yourself growing closer to the One God through Christianity, that is all well and good. That is your dharma. And I respect it wholeheartedly.

Thank you for your kind words. My dad didn't believe in salvation through the Hare Krsna religion, but he pushed vegetarianism on us and was angry when we went to church.

I do know that eating meat is strongly condemned in your religion, although I have not read anything that allows others to force it on family members. The pamphlets I read tried to say that Hare Krsna, Christianity, Judaism, Islam all teach the same thing, which I do not believe and neither would anyone else after having studied any 2 of these faiths. I do not believe that anyone- Christian, Muslim, Jew, Hindu, Sikh, anyone.. stating their religion is the only true one is fanaticism. It means that you are willing to stand by your beliefs and not compromise. Some of my very close friends are Muslim and they just as strongly believe only their religion is correct, just as I do about mine. I believe they are sincerely wrong, and hope they come to Christ, and have told them. Guess what they said to me about Islam?...

According to my mom, my dad was an entirely different person before getting involved in the Hare Krsna religion. The years afterwards came close to destroying my family and have messed me up for a very long time. None of this is your fault and I am sure you are a very kind and sincere person, but I do not believe that your religion is of God.

 

[Illuminaughty]

Most Krishna devotees are not members of ISKCON. I don't believe they represent the tradition as a whole just one branch of it.

 

[Syrokal]

Hare Krishna!

I have never heard of this universal Femininity doctrine either, where is the source of this theology?
If you could quote from the Gita, Bhagavatam or other Puranas, or Parabhupada's works that would be great!

Thanks!

 

[Syrokal]

I am very sorry to hear that. He may have called himself a Christian but wasn't treating his family with love, and therefore was not following Jesus.

In a simmiler way, your father was not an example of the teachings and goals of the Gaudiya Vaisnava tradition.

I have read that in Hare Krsna societies, cult-like techniques like forcing a certain lifestyle on people and isolating them from their non Hare Krsna friends and family, and massive guilt tripping and unhealthily strict obedience to leadership have been used. I haven't ever experienced this but from what we through it sounds disturbingly familiar.

I don't mean to be rude, but Ironically if you were to replace "Hare Krishna" in this paragraph with "Christian" I have experienced the exact same thing from Christians.

But as they say...bad eggs everywhere!

 

[Supreme]

I do find the notion that we are all female rather absurd. Biologicially, it's completely wrong. If we were all female than sexual production would not be possible and humankind would have died out long ago.

 

[Rajni]

Hare Krishna!
I have never heard of this universal Femininity doctrine either, where is the source of this theology?

If you could quote from the Gita, Bhagavatam or other Puranas, or Parabhupada's works that would be great!
Thanks!

Here are some items I have come across:

"Physically, men and women are different. But spiritually, i.e., from the atmic point of view, both are equal. In fact, God is the only male while all others are females. The deham, body, is also called puram, dwelling place. It is the principle of atma that works from top to bottom. You know, colleges for women celebrate anniversary functions during which they present cultural items like a play. Here, girls play all the different roles like those of a soldier, a minister, a king, and so on.

"Similarly, all but God are women in this world. A similar thing happened in the life of Mira, the great devotee of Lord Krishna. She was stopped at the main entrance of a Krishna temple at Brindavan, and was told that women were not permitted to enter a temple of God . Then Mira replied, 'Oh! Is that so! Where are men here? I find only women. God is the only male person.'

"However, from the worldly point of view, for the division of work, men and women are different from each other. Everything and everyone is Divine. Even though it is your own body, you don't put slippers or footwear on the head or hands. Functionally, all the parts of the body are different from each other, though they may belong to the same person. So also physically and functionally, men and women are separate entities, though spiritually they are one and the same." ~ Sathya Sai Baba

"We say that Krishna is the only male. It means that there is only one independent enjoyer and everyone else is dependent. Our joy, our satisfaction, our fulfillment is dependent on Krishna's pleasure." ~ Excerpt from a lecture by HH Varsana Swami

"Regarding your questions, as Brahma realized that he was the maidservant of Krishna, similarly, everyone of us has to realize that Krishna is the only single purusa. purusa synonymously means male, but actually, in the spiritual dictionary, male means "enjoyer" and female means "enjoyed." So in this sense, Krishna is the only male and all others being energies of Krishna, they are prakrti, or female. Please do not try to understand this male and female in the material sense. In other words, our perfection of life will be actually realizing that we are all females. In the material world we have got simply different dresses. Here in the material world, everyone is in the temperament of male, even the so-called females are also in the temperament. This is very prominent in the Western part of the world, and you know it very well how the females here think on the level of equality with males. This aptitude is material." Prabhupāda's Letter to Janaki -- Los Angeles 28 February, 1969​

 

[Syrokal]

I do find the notion that we are all female rather absurd. Biologicially, it's completely wrong. If we were all female than sexual production would not be possible and humankind would have died out long ago.

I think the notion is more to do with the spiritual notion of Gender in regards to creation and expansion as opposed to Biological rolls.

However saying that, ive never heard of this concept before and certainly haven't come across it in the scriptures.

 

[Syrokal]

Here are some items I have come across:

"Physically, men and women are different. But spiritually, i.e., from the atmic point of view, both are equal. In fact, God is the only male while all others are females. The deham, body, is also called puram, dwelling place. It is the principle of atma that works from top to bottom. You know, colleges for women celebrate anniversary functions during which they present cultural items like a play. Here, girls play all the different roles like those of a soldier, a minister, a king, and so on.

"Similarly, all but God are women in this world. A similar thing happened in the life of Mira, the great devotee of Lord Krishna. She was stopped at the main entrance of a Krishna temple at Brindavan, and was told that women were not permitted to enter a temple of God . Then Mira replied, 'Oh! Is that so! Where are men here? I find only women. God is the only male person.'

"However, from the worldly point of view, for the division of work, men and women are different from each other. Everything and everyone is Divine. Even though it is your own body, you don't put slippers or footwear on the head or hands. Functionally, all the parts of the body are different from each other, though they may belong to the same person. So also physically and functionally, men and women are separate entities, though spiritually they are one and the same." ~ Sathya Sai Baba

"We say that Krishna is the only male. It means that there is only one independent enjoyer and everyone else is dependent. Our joy, our satisfaction, our fulfillment is dependent on Krishna's pleasure." ~ Excerpt from a lecture by HH Varsana Swami

"Regarding your questions, as Brahma realized that he was the maidservant of Krishna, similarly, everyone of us has to realize that Krishna is the only single purusa. purusa synonymously means male, but actually, in the spiritual dictionary, male means "enjoyer" and female means "enjoyed." So in this sense, Krishna is the only male and all others being energies of Krishna, they are prakrti, or female. Please do not try to understand this male and female in the material sense. In other words, our perfection of life will be actually realizing that we are all females. In the material world we have got simply different dresses. Here in the material world, everyone is in the temperament of male, even the so-called females are also in the temperament. This is very prominent in the Western part of the world, and you know it very well how the females here think on the level of equality with males. This aptitude is material." Prabhupāda's Letter to Janaki -- Los Angeles 28 February, 1969​

Thank you very much, that's more or less how I was thinking it was to be understood as always Parabhupada very eloquently layed that out.

From the Spiritual sense of enjoyer and enjoyed then that makes absolute sense and I suppose I would have to agree.

 

[Rajni]

I do find the notion that we are all female rather absurd. Biologicially, it's completely wrong. If we were all female than sexual production would not be possible and humankind would have died out long ago.

It's similar to the "Bride of Christ" concept. Guys are included in that category by Christianity. It's not referring to the physical plane, but rather the spiritual plane; I guess one could say it has more to do with types of energy/power. Another way to see it is that God is so powerful He makes the most powerfully-built human man look like a girl.

Of course, if one is Goddess-oriented, and associates superior power to the Feminine, just reverse the concepts and it works that way too.

 

[Cerdic]

How silly. There is no authentic Hinduism in the singular sense of the term. It's proper to say Hinduisms. I doubt that a follower of Shaivism or any of the other many Hindu-related doctrines would agree, partly or fully, with the OP.

 

[Rajni]

How silly. There is no authentic Hinduism in the singular sense of the term. It's proper to say Hinduisms. I doubt that a follower of Shaivism or any of the other many Hindu-related doctrines would agree, partly or fully, with the OP.

It is true that other religions are just as diverse within themselves as Christianity -- or rather, Christianities
-- is/are within itself. However, to go around calling others' beliefs "silly" is a tad rude, no?

 

[Cerdic]

It is true that other religions are just as diverse within themselves as Christianity -- or rather, Christianities
-- is/are within itself. However, to go around calling others' beliefs "silly" is a tad rude, no?

Given that this is a Christian forum and this is a non-Christian assertion about the true divinity of a pagan deity.. No.

I am the Way, the truth, and the life: no man comes unto the Father, but by me.