Learning New Testament Greek

[Didaskomenos]

I have a question for filosofer - if I learn NT Greek, will I be able to understand ancient Greek too? I know koine is a variant of it, but is the same as, for example, reading modern english as opposed to middle english? So..sort of understandable but words have changed their meanings?

Well, I ain't filosofer, but your parallel to Middle/Modern English is actually a pretty good comparison. Many basic words are identical, and have similar meanings. Some of the more obvious changes are words dropping out to be replaced by more-or-less synonyms, changing inflections (-mi verbs being replaced by -w verbs). The difference in vocabulary probably stands as the most difficult distinction between the two.

 

[ThrdJohn13]

Filosopher, I really enjoy reading your posts. I thought I'd drop something by just in case you're interested: "translate" probably also appears one more time in the Aramaic of Ezra too. In Ezra 4:17 it translates literally: "...the letter which you sent to (or 'concerning' depending on how you read 'al) us has been 'called out, being made clear' (meparash qeri -- a peal passive part. + peil perf.) before me...". A lot of scholars think that the 'meparash qeri', given the historical context, and the way this term is used in extrabiblical texts, probably refers to on the spot translation (just like what the Jews of the Diaspora did with targum). At any rate, I do a lot of work in Aramaic, so I thought I'd drop that by. Just thought I'd pass it along.
-Justin

 

[ThrdJohn13]

Oh yeah, as far as Intro Greek Grammars go, I used Machen's Intro to NT Greek. I've been told by some NT Scholars that Mounce's Basics of NT Greek is very good, and is almost standard now. (I took a look at it myself and really liked it. It looked easy to reference, and find subjects in)

In so far as intermediate grammars go, I used Young's Intermediate Greek. Now I'm using Howard, Moulton, et al.'s reference grammar (only volumes 2 and 3 because 1 is really really basic, and vol. 4 is supposedly controversial).

-J

 

[Didaskomenos]

Same here. I used Machen to begin with. I've heard that Mounce is really good, and from what I've seen of it, it really is good. I used Daniel B. Wallace's Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics (the follow-up to Mounce) for my intermediate work, and I would highly recommend it.

 

[filosofer]

I have a question for filosofer - if I learn NT Greek, will I be able to understand ancient Greek too? I know koine is a variant of it, but is the same as, for example, reading modern english as opposed to middle english? So..sort of understandable but words have changed their meanings?

Wallace has a good overview of these issues in his book, Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics: An Exegetical Syntax of the New Testament, pp. 14-29. As with any development in languages, sentence structure tends to move toward the simpler, rather than complex. This matches the fact that Koine uses fewer conjunctions/particles. And indirect discourse was more common in classical/Attic Greek. As for forms, the middle voice is far less common in Koine, and the optative is almost not used (~70 x in NT).

There can be benefit from learning classical Greek. One of the problems for those who learn Koine is that the field is relatively small, so it becomes easy to rely on English texts to "translate" the Greek. By moving into the classical realm, that crutch is not necessarily available; this means that we have to actually learn Greek, rather than English-Greek. Now, it would help in becoming proficient in Koine reading other Koine writings that are not familiar to us: Josephus, Philo, Plutarch, etc.

 

[filosofer]

Now I'm using Howard, Moulton, et al.'s reference grammar (only volumes 2 and 3 because 1 is really really basic, and vol. 4 is supposedly controversial).

I had used Robertson while at seminary, but never bought it. I did purchase Blass - deBrunner and have used that extensively, even though it is somewhat dated. I also had the four volume set Howard, Moulton, and Turner, but gave it to a seminary student about 7 years ago. Turner offered some interesting twists on understanding the text. I also have his book, Grammatical Insights into the New Testament, and have found it refreshing to say the least.

I have twice read through Linguistics for Students of New Testament Greek: A Survey of Basic Concepts and Applications (1988) by David Alan Black, which focuses on a different part of learning and understanding Greek.

And, of course, for the relationship between semantics and Biblical studies the best is Biblical Words and Their Meaning: An Introduction to Lexical Semantics (1994 rev. ed.) by Moises Silva.

Three other books that I think are indispensible for NT studies are:

Exegetical Fallacies (1996, 2nd ed.) by D. A. Carson. Even those who do not know the Biblical languages would be well-served by reading this one.

What Does This Mean? Principles of Biblical Interpretation in the Post-Modern World (1995) by James Voelz. He deals with textual issues, semantics, and interpretation issues. Excellent book. (He was my final post-graduate advisor, after my professor died, prior to my finishing).

Multipurpose Tools for Bible Study (1993, rev. ed.) by Frederick Danker (of Bauer-Danker-Arndt-Gingrich fame). To me, for any serious student of the original languages, this is a must because he provides a list with detailed explanations of the various resources available for serious study in the original (and early textual) languages.

---

If you are interested in Septuagintal studies and the Greek language, there is Invitation to the Septuagint (2000) by Karen Jobes and Moises Silva. You can wade in the pool, or take a very extended deep-sea dive in this book. Very good. I have read it once already and will soon go back for a second swim.

 

[Divinus]

Originally posted by filosofer
Wallace has a good overview of these issues in his book, Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics: An Exegetical Syntax of the New Testament, pp. 14-29. As with any development in languages, sentence structure tends to move toward the simpler, rather than complex. This matches the fact that Koine uses fewer conjunctions/particles. And indirect discourse was more common in classical/Attic Greek. As for forms, the middle voice is far less common in Koine, and the optative is almost not used (~70 x in NT).

There can be benefit from learning classical Greek. One of the problems for those who learn Koine is that the field is relatively small, so it becomes easy to rely on English texts to "translate" the Greek. By moving into the classical realm, that crutch is not necessarily available; this means that we have to actually learn Greek, rather than English-Greek. Now, it would help in becoming proficient in Koine reading other Koine writings that are not familiar to us: Josephus, Philo, Plutarch, etc. [/B]

Maybe it would make more sense to try to learn ancient Greek and then figure out koine from there? I wish I'd gone to the sort of school where they teach ancient Greek as part of primary to secondary education!

I have a book I bought a while ago called - New Testament Greek: A Complete Course from the "Teach Yourself" series by D F Hudson - I don't know whether anybody here has heard of it (I only bought it because it was cheaper than the rest) but is that likely to be any good? The trouble I find is that I know nothing of the rules, or even the names of types of words in English grammar, which causes some problems in looking at other languages. I couldn't even tell you what a verb is - I learnt English grammar entirely from just reading it - so if there are any books which don't have all the talk of cases and subjunctives, that would be best for me!

-Divinus

 

[ThrdJohn13]

There are both advangates and disadvantages to learning Attic before Koine. I guess in my mind, it really does boil down to how "seriously" you're planning on studying Greek texts -- professionally, or as an amateur. I've been told that learning Attic before Koine is easier than the other way around. I will probably be forced to do the reverse at some point in my field of study.

About Koine studies -- considering that Near Eastern Studies and Classical studies are both small fields in general, I think that the study of Koine texts is not all that small (specifically as it concerns NES). THere are quite a few texts available for study -- many of them scholars have spent limited time in. For example, we have many Koine translations of OT texts, the books of Enoch, the OT Apocrypha, Philo, various mss from the Dead Sea community, Josephus, various political documents from the diaspora, many many religious documents and mystery cult documents, documents from the first 1 and 2 centuries of the church (eg. Eusebius' commentary on Ephesians, the Apostolic Fathers), etc. etc. Anyway, thought I'd just pass that along.

-Justin

 

[filosofer]

I couldn't even tell you what a verb is - I learnt English grammar entirely from just reading it - so if there are any books which don't have all the talk of cases and subjunctives, that would be best for me!

Sadly most people don't learn English grammar until they begin learning another language. I am fortunate because I had excellent English grammar/composition instructors (40 years ago), and took Latin in 7-8th grades. Helped considerably.

I would say - plunge in and enjoy! No matter which way you learn, you will gain by learning more of the language (Greek).

 

[ThrdJohn13]

Yeah, that's a great point too. I watched tons of Greek students really flounder around because the didn't understand English grammar. I think what really helped me in Greek is the fact that I had done serious studying in German (both grammar, and then took a class in German classics, etc.) and that really solidified a lot.

 

[Divinus]

One of my lecturers complains a lot because no one knows grammar anymore - he said it was much easier to teach ancient languages some years back, when grammar was taught in schools much more often. As far as I can recall, we didn't learn "proper" grammar (i.e. the names of the various things) when we learnt French (compulsory, unfortunately) and German at school either.

I wonder why the teaching of that sort of thing changed?