Kim Jung Un meets with South Korean delegation in pursuit of talks with the US and reunification

[NightHawkeye]

From the "Motivation matters", files: Kim Jong Un meets with South Korean delegation in pursuit of reunification

The goal of the South Korean delegation was to promote talks between the North and the United States. Over the weekend, President Trump said he was open to such discussions, but is only willing to do so after the North Koreans “denuke.” Kim Jong Un called the notion of his country’s nuclear disarmament “preposterous” and “nothing short of ridiculous.”
...
“It is significant these talks are happening. Kim Jong Un has hardly met anyone.” But he added that “they are apparently feeling the pinch of economic sanctions.”​

 

[Rion]

How does one un-meet with people?

 

[NightHawkeye]

How does one un-meet with people?

Isn't any meeting with Kim Jung Un an un-meeting?

 

[com7fy8]

prayer prayer prayer

Prayer works to deal with the impossible . . . including in us, by the way . . . how we ourselves have been ones who would not change.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Note that Trump did not speak with anyone from NK the other day, despite errant comments to the contrary. He apparently got them mixed up.

Phone call Trump said he had with North Korean regime was actually with South Korea's president

Next time anybody rolls out Obama's "57 states" comment again, I'm busting out this.

 

[mindlight]

From the "Motivation matters", files: Kim Jong Un meets with South Korean delegation in pursuit of reunification

The goal of the South Korean delegation was to promote talks between the North and the United States. Over the weekend, President Trump said he was open to such discussions, but is only willing to do so after the North Koreans “denuke.” Kim Jong Un called the notion of his country’s nuclear disarmament “preposterous” and “nothing short of ridiculous.”
...
“It is significant these talks are happening. Kim Jong Un has hardly met anyone.” But he added that “they are apparently feeling the pinch of economic sanctions.”​

Interesting that a Korean solution is developing that has nothing to do with China or the USA. To be achievable ideas about reunification would probably have to include Kim Jong Un giving up absolute power in the North as the whole country came under a broader administration, American troops leaving and a massive bill for South Korea. But maybe each of these is more attractive than the prospect of nuclear war or the mass starvation of the North Korean people.

A united and neutral Korea is probably the best solution in the long run but would involve both China and the USA taking a step back from an area they regard as in their sphere of influence.

 

[NightHawkeye]

Interesting that a Korean solution is developing that has nothing to do with China or the USA. To be achievable ideas about reunification would probably have to include Kim Jong Un giving up absolute power in the North as the whole country came under a broader administration, American troops leaving and a massive bill for South Korea. But maybe each of these is more attractive than the prospect of nuclear war or the mass starvation of the North Korean people.

A united and neutral Korea is probably the best solution in the long run but would involve both China and the USA taking a step back from an area they regard as in their sphere of influence.

It's not without some precedent. East and West Germany reunited quickly when allowed to do so.

I am also reminded that even Taiwan and mainland China desire reunification.

 

[mindlight]

It's not without some precedent. East and West Germany reunited quickly when allowed to do so.

I am also reminded that even Taiwan and mainland China desire reunification.

Glasnost for all the rhetoric about it from Gorbachev was really just the surrender of an unsustainable Soviet Empire of its occupied territories. America and its allies won the Cold war and in a sense gained influence over Eastern Germany and Europe as a result. Reunification of East and West Germany was really absorption by the West. But population wise the two Koreas are more evenly balanced and the problems far deeper.

So I wonder if Kim Jong Un would ever give up power, if the South really wants to pay the billions It would cost to bring North Koreas people into the 21st century. Also will America and China willingly sacrifice the influence they have in the area to allow this to happen.

In the long run the peace , security, prosperity and freedom of the Korean people as a whole depends on such a vision being achieved but it may cost too much for them to take the risk on it.

The Taiwanese remain opposed but with some movement towards the idea of unification

Majority reject unification: poll - Taipei Times
NPF News Website

 

[NightHawkeye]

But population wise the two Koreas are more evenly balanced and the problems far deeper.

So I wonder if Kim Jong Un would ever give up power ...

That is the single issue, isn't it? Except for Un's family, I doubt there are other problems preventing the North Koreans from joining with the South.

... if the South really wants to pay the billions It would cost to bring North Koreas people into the 21st century.

My sense is that the South would do it in a heartbeat ... to be rid of the non-stop nuclear threat from the North.

Also will America and China willingly sacrifice the influence they have in the area to allow this to happen.

I would expect Trump to support it in a heartbeat as well. Hillary, maybe not.

North Korea has always been a proxy for China ... but even China can't be real pleased with how things have worked out recently. I'd expect them to demand Taiwan in return for relinquishing control of North Korea. Fortunately, the Taiwanese have long wanted to reunite with China, so even that seems workable.

In the long run the peace , security, prosperity and freedom of the Korean people as a whole depends on such a vision being achieved but it may cost too much for them to take the risk on it.

It's really a no-brainer, just as it was for West Germany. The cost of not re-unifying is potentially much much more expensive.

The Taiwanese remain opposed but with some movement towards the idea of unification

In my travels to Taiwan, I was surprised to hear directly from Taiwanese how favorably they looked at reunification.

Majority reject unification: poll - Taipei Times
NPF News Website

They've gotten used to independence. The poll of negative responses was dominated by those under the age of 30 though ... and even those supported discussions.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

It's looking like "Rocket Man" wants to talk with Trump now. If and when it comes down and there is actually some kind of an agreement, who gets the credit? It's going to make me woozy inside when I hear some say that Obama gets the credit.

Anything good he claims. Anything bad he blames on Bush.

Illegal wiretap on Trump -- I think Bush did it.

M-Bob

 

[NightHawkeye]

It's going to make me woozy inside when I hear some say that Obama gets the credit.

I don't think Trump would care much if the press gave credit to Obama.

Jus' sayin ...

 

[Fantine]

Praying for peace on the Korean peninsula, and that the positive steps North and South Korea are taking together will not be derailed by unhinged tweet storms from Washington.

 

[NightHawkeye]

Praying for peace on the Korean peninsula, and that the positive steps North and South Korea are taking together will not be derailed by unhinged tweet storms from Washington.

Noting that the "unhinged Tweet storms" are the reason the two Koreas have engaged in discussion.

Jus' sayin ...

 

[Mountainmanbob]

I don't think Trump would care much if the press gave credit to Obama.

Jus' sayin ...

Probably not.
Wait -- Trump will never go for that!
M-Bob

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Praying for peace on the Korean peninsula, and that the positive steps North and South Korea are taking together will not be derailed by unhinged tweet storms from Washington.

Those tweets have probably been helpful.
Mr. President seems to be doing fine with North Korea -- thank you..
MB

 

[Fantine]

The two Koreas began productive discussion when they decided to meet on their own. South Korea has much more skin in the game than does the U.S., as does Japan, and yet Trump seems to feel that the U.S. needs to give permission for them to act independently.

He pulled out of the Trans Pacific Partnership. He spoke openly about the people of South Korea and Japan being dispensible if he launched a military strike to ostensibly protect the U.S.

As we have seen when Trump has tried to deal with people with different beliefs (e.g. Democrats during the DACA and gun crises) he restrains himself (perhaps with mood altering drugs administered by doctors), sticks to a script, and reads notes off his hands----and immediately reverses his position. I can only think he does it to have sound bites for a possible 2020 run ("Look! Trump acted normal and presidential for two half-hour conferences in his first fourteen months of office!")

I hope he sends one of the few capable people in his administration (if any are left after this week) to negotiations, and stays as far away as possible, and I hope General Kelly rigs his cell phone so that an electric shock will be administered if he tries to tweet.

 

[Truth7t7]

Interesting that a Korean solution is developing that has nothing to do with China or the USA. To be achievable ideas about reunification would probably have to include Kim Jong Un giving up absolute power in the North as the whole country came under a broader administration, American troops leaving and a massive bill for South Korea. But maybe each of these is more attractive than the prospect of nuclear war or the mass starvation of the North Korean people.

A united and neutral Korea is probably the best solution in the long run but would involve both China and the USA taking a step back from an area they regard as in their sphere of influence.

Thing is I believe China is backing North Korea 100%

North Korea is a diversion for the proposed tariffs on China.

Trump got tough yesterday on the (NAFTA) agreement, hes not backing down on Mexico and Canada.

"China is worried about American tariffs", throwing North Korea as the token of world peace in a deal.

 

[Truth7t7]

The two Koreas began productive discussion when they decided to meet on their own. South Korea has much more skin in the game than does the U.S., as does Japan, and yet Trump seems to feel that the U.S. needs to give permission for them to act independently.

He pulled out of the Trans Pacific Partnership. He spoke openly about the people of South Korea and Japan being dispensible if he launched a military strike to ostensibly protect the U.S.

As we have seen when Trump has tried to deal with people with different beliefs (e.g. Democrats during the DACA and gun crises) he restrains himself (perhaps with mood altering drugs administered by doctors), sticks to a script, and reads notes off his hands----and immediately reverses his position. I can only think he does it to have sound bites for a possible 2020 run ("Look! Trump acted normal and presidential for two half-hour conferences in his first fourteen months of office!")

I hope he sends one of the few capable people in his administration (if any are left after this week) to negotiations, and stays as far away as possible, and I hope General Kelly rigs his cell phone so that an electric shock will be administered if he tries to tweet.

Sounds like you voted for Hillary?

It was Trumps hardline stance that has the situation where it is now.

North Korea is a bluff, propaganda!

 

[variant]

How does one un-meet with people?

There really seems like there should be a good wordplay joke in there somewhere.

 

[variant]

The two Koreas began productive discussion when they decided to meet on their own. South Korea has much more skin in the game than does the U.S., as does Japan, and yet Trump seems to feel that the U.S. needs to give permission for them to act independently.

He pulled out of the Trans Pacific Partnership. He spoke openly about the people of South Korea and Japan being dispensible if he launched a military strike to ostensibly protect the U.S.

As we have seen when Trump has tried to deal with people with different beliefs (e.g. Democrats during the DACA and gun crises) he restrains himself (perhaps with mood altering drugs administered by doctors), sticks to a script, and reads notes off his hands----and immediately reverses his position. I can only think he does it to have sound bites for a possible 2020 run ("Look! Trump acted normal and presidential for two half-hour conferences in his first fourteen months of office!")

I hope he sends one of the few capable people in his administration (if any are left after this week) to negotiations, and stays as far away as possible, and I hope General Kelly rigs his cell phone so that an electric shock will be administered if he tries to tweet.

If Trump's blather has convinced them to maybe, stop looking to us for guidance and work out their own differences than maybe he's good for something.