Judge declares state abortion law unconstitutional

[Paul12]

Hmm. Perhaps there is some merit here, but the law would have to reflect the ages stipulated by rape statutes, not all minors.

Thats exactly what I'm trying to say. Some states, the age of consent is 17, others 15, whatever that particular state declares to be the age of consent, should be when parental notification is required.

 

[Paul12]

Not if she were having sex with another fourteen-year-old.

Legally speaking, the fourteen year old male could still be charged with statutory rape, as that's how the law is on the books. I don't see it ever happening, but you never know.

www.sexlaws.org

 

[Dagna]

That's quite all right Humble Man. My experience may have been the odd one out, with so many different abortion providers out there nowadays. But, then again, many people that have not had an abortion don't understand the process many women go through to get one. And I very much agree with you. Parents need to be involved in their children's lives. I can't imagine it's easy, mainly because I know how I was as a teenager, but parents can't just say kids will be kids any more. And when I had my abortion, I would rather have had someone against abortion walk up and talk to me about it and why i did what I did, then seen the protestors outside of my school with their little posters screaming at people.

 

[HumbleMan]

I would rather have had someone against abortion walk up and talk to me about it and why i did what I did, then seen the protestors outside of my school with their little posters screaming at people.

That's why I believe that our time and effort should be in outreach and counselling, not ostracizing and condemning. I actually believe that emotional protesting is a good way to let Satan into your heart (not always, but sometimes) because people get angry, and then that's the Trojan Horse he uses to enter.

I truly hurt for what you went through, and I pray you came away from it with as little emotional scars as possible. For someone as young as you are, you seem very grounded and confidant. Those are admirable qualities.

 

[Valkyr]

Women being informed would be the swift demise of the abortion industry. They don't want that...

Oh, Ignorance. I am completely informed about abortion, having volunteered at an abortion clinic. I was exposed to both sides of the argument quite extensively. I know all of the potential health risks. I have had friends who chose to have abortions and friends who chose not to end the pregnancy, and supported both in their personal decisions. And at this point in my life, if I were to get pregnant (which would be impossible, but for the sake of argument), I would have an abortion. So please, keep your self-righteous, ill-informed dogma to yourself.
I agree with the decision made by the NH judge. I am against requiring parental consent for the same reasons I am against boys being circumsized at birth. Even parents have no right to make decisions* for their children about what happens to their bodies.

* Obviously I mean personal decisions that don't affect health. If the kid needs a shot and is afraid of them, obviously the parent has to step in. Etc. etc.

 

[HumbleMan]

Even parents have no right to make decisions* for their children about what happens to their bodies.

* Obviously I mean personal decisions that don't affect health. If the kid needs a shot and is afraid of them, obviously the parent has to step in. Etc. etc.

You can't have it both ways. Either you're totally responsible, or not at all. It is the parents right to raise their children, from birth, in a manner consistent with their beliefs. If their beliefs are contrary to law, and intrisically harm the child, then the child should be protected. But parental consent laws DO NOT harm the child in any way.

 

[Firscherscherling]

You can't have it both ways. Either you're totally responsible, or not. It is the parents right to raise their children, from birth, in a manner consistent with their beliefs. If their beliefs are contrary to law, and intrisically harm the child, then the child should be protected. But parental consent laws DO NOT harm the child in any way.

One reason consent laws for abortion are resisted is because children are indeed harmed in many cases. Young women who are pregnant are sometimes fleeing from abusive households and may even be carrying their father's baby. In addition, many question whether a 15 year old girl should be forced by anyone to carry a baby to term if they don't want to.

Folks absolutely love to paint a picture of a wild 14 or 15-year old going and having sex like crazy and skipping off the the clinic to get an abortion, then heading out to have more unprotected sex. These aren't wild kids. These are your kids and mine. Christian honor students get pregnant just like poor kids from the wrong side of the tracks. Kids get raped. Kids get molested. And kids just make mistakes. But I know no one who would joyfully go get an abortion. It isn't pleasant and isn't something a woman would want to make a regular practice.

 

[Firscherscherling]

I often wonder whos child will be more likely to get pregnant.

1. A Christian zealot who puts premarital sex in the sin category, fails to explain to their child the biology of pregnancy, and refuses to talk about any type of birth control other than abstinence.

OR

2. A parent who is open with their children about sex and the biology of it, expresses an understanding of the difficult choices we all must make in regard to sex and how best to make those choices, and explains how not to get pregnant using birth control.

This begs another question... Which child will be more likely to try and hide a pregnancy from their parent? To me the answer is quite obvious.

 

[HumbleMan]

If it is indeed a Christian home, then hopefully the parents would talk to the children about premarital sex, the dangers of it, and why they beleive it is morally and spiritually wrong. Then, maybe, the children wouldn't feel as if their parents would condemn them, and come forward. Truth is always best.


In the cases you cited about incest and rape, the parents SHOULD be told so that the police would be called and the rapist arrested.

I know kids of all stripes make mistakes and get into trouble, but it's how they handle the responsibility of their actions that is the issue.

 

[Firscherscherling]

If it is indeed a Christian home, then hopefully the parents would talk to the children about premarital sex, the dangers of it, and why they beleive it is morally and spiritually wrong. Then, maybe, the children wouldn't feel as if their parents would condemn them, and come forward. Truth is always best.


In the cases you cited about incest and rape, the parents SHOULD be told so that the police would be called and the rapist arrested.

I know kids of all stripes make mistakes and get into trouble, but it's how they handle the responsibility of their actions that is the issue.

You can't protect these kids in all situations and a sweeping law simply insures that some will be victimized. A kid who feels informed, safe and unconditionally loved is fairly unlkely to get an abortion withut mentioning to thier parents. And how a person handles the responsibility of their actions is exactly the point. They make a choice. It is their choice to make.

Abortion is legal. Should a young woman be forced by her parents to have a baby she does not want to have?

 

[Mac6yver]

Indeed. I would have no problem with a law that states the child must inform the parents, but the final decision is the child's. They can not be forced to have that child.

 

[EvolvEarth]

There is no use to have the parents find out about the kid having an abortion. It's like saying parents should be notified if their kid is gay. What if the parents chastise their kid and then spread it around their family so the kid could be emotionally abuse by them? What if the parents both emotionally and physically abuse their children for it? People that are against abortion are capable of such things.

 

[feral]

When I was fourteen, a friend of mine who was fifteen got pregnant. She wanted an abortion but was told her parents needed to consent to it first. She killed herself rather then tell them she was pregnant. I would much rather she was able to make the choice on her own. Ideally everyone would have supportive, understanding parents that they could trust to discuss such a traumatic issue with, but we don't live in Utopia. She made the choice independantly to have sex...she should be able to make the choice independantly for the abortion, or adoption, or any other option.

 

[Clay]

its sad when a CHILD can have their baby killed, but can't buy cigarettes, lottery tickets, see an R-rated movie, or in some cases-drive.

 

[HMM1]

Amen Clay, or get their ears pierced....I'm sure the list goes on. Oh, yeah....spray paint kids get carded when they try to buy spray paint!

 

[burrow_owl]

What surprises me is that no one in favor of the law is putting any heat on the legislature. I mean, any legislator would have to have been living in a cave for the last 30+ years with his hands over his ears to not know that abortion laws need medical emergency exceptions. Either that, or the fine people of New Hampshire have elected orangatangs, or possibly super-smart dogs, to their state congress, because any reasonable human being would know that if there isn't a medical exception, the law will be stricken.

 

[HumbleMan]

I've said before that I'm against making abortions illegal because of the safety issue. Instead, we must change our culture so that women and children aren't placed in the situation of having to choose.

The world is not perfect, but sitting here moaning and groaning about it won't make it more so. People need to take an active part in their lives and their children/families lives.

Medical exception laws will not pass either, because the rhetoric is so high on both sides of the issue, and neither side will stop and listen to each other.

Children are banned from buying smokes and stuff because it's for their safety....... but on the flip side, any surgical procedure (and abortion is) can carry severe risks and complications. Children have to get their parent's consent for just about everything, except abortion. The one procedure that can have lasting psychological, emotional, and physical damage, and world says "It's OK. We think your self esteem carries more weight than trusting your parents. We think your right to privacy invalidates your parent's love". BTW, the incidences of parental abuse/harrassment/whatever brought up by some posters is a very small percentage of the total population, and yes, it is wrong, but those families need help also.

 

[Firscherscherling]

The one procedure that can have lasting psychological, emotional, and physical damage, and world says "It's OK. We think your self esteem carries more weight than trusting your parents. We think your right to privacy invalidates your parent's love". BTW, the incidences of parental abuse/harrassment/whatever brought up by some posters is a very small percentage of the total population, and yes, it is wrong, but those families need help also.

You guys are missing the point. You are making the assumption that any given teen that gets pregnant will sneak off and have an abortion without telling their parents. You have to ask yourselves which teens are the ones who are so afraid of their parents that they would feel safer facing this decision alone than with family support.

Any young woman from any demographic can make the mistake of getting pregnant. Young women from loving and supportive families would be more likely to seek support. At-risk kids would be less likely. Do any of you even know how many girls get abortions each year without parental consent? Is it 1? Is it 50? Who are they? Do you have any idea? I didn't think so.

 

[Firscherscherling]

I have a impression that the people most strongly calling for consent laws are the ones most liley to have children who want to sneak and get an abortion.

The Christians here would be appalled to know what I will tell my daughter about sex.

The facts are these:
As a parent, I hope that my daughter will wait to have sex until she is mature enough to understand what she is getting into. I also have to accept that it is up to her to decide when that will be. But when the time comes, she must protect herself from unwanted pregnacy and from the possibility of infection. But no matter what, she has to understand that I will not stop loving her and I will not judge her. It is my job to love and support her no matter what.

And that is exactly what I intend to tell her.

 

[HumbleMan]

You guys are missing the point. You are making the assumption that any given teen that gets pregnant will sneak off and have an abortion without telling their parents. You have to ask yourselves which teens are the ones who are so afraid of their parents that they would feel safer facing this decision alone than with family support.

Any young woman from any demographic can make the mistake of getting pregnant. Young women from loving and supportive families would be more likely to seek support. At-risk kids would be less likely. Do any of you even know how many girls get abortions each year without parental consent? Is it 1? Is it 50? Who are they? Do you have any idea? I didn't think so.

No, I know that not every girl who gets pregnant tries to get an abortion without informing their parents. And I know that not every parent deserves to be one. But it is still the parent's right to know. A parent is held legally responsible for any action a child takes, and just because they may be jerks, doesn't mean their parental rights should be circumvented. As I've said before, all the money and time going into protesting clinics should instead go to outreach and counselling, so that women and girls should have a place to turn if their parents/spouse/family flip out.

The recurring theme I keep hearing is that once the girl decides to get an abortion, that's it, decisions made, let her go through with it. I bet that if there is effective counselling and a show of true love before a girl enters that clinic, a good portion of them will decide to keep their babies. I know that not all will, but if we can stop just one, that's one more life to celebrate.