Joel Osteen

[Nadiine]

There will always be someone that judges or criticizes every one of us, especially someone that is doing so well. Also when a church has grown like it has in 7 or 8 years, all the judges and critics come out.
I know that Lakewood and Pastor Joel is for me, may not be for you, but it is for me. And I thank any of you that are praying for us, because I also pray for the pastors and leaders of this world. It is much appreciated.

I was hoping you wouldn't see people judging HIM as a person, or any members there. None of us know people's spiritual conditions - only God knows that.

Church growth actually does not prove that a church is spiritually healthy; in fact sometimes it can be quite the contrary! Never monitor a church's health just by that.

Some of us have shown you valid proof as to why we take issue w/ his teaching... that isn't wrongful judging or judging only becuz the church is growing & now we're coming out of the woodwork in attack.
We WANT churches to grow & thrive - just that we want them to grow becuz the FULL TRUTH of the gospel is being promoted... not mostly segments of fluff.

I'm glad you enjoy your church... the question would be would you enjoy it if he DID preach on sin issues? on condemnation/God's justice? etc?
How many might leave that huge church if he preached on other things that are taught in scripture?
Who knows... we may never know if he doesn't choose to preach the whole counsel of God.
peace

 

[Nadiine]

You have to understand that Joel is called to be an encourager...he would be the first one to say that. He does preach from the Bible at every service.

But NewChild, an "encourager" is NOT A SHEPHERD! OR PASTOR. An encourager isn't an evangelist & shouldn't be pastoring & overseeing over a church.
He should then be an ASST. pastor, who brings that to people separately.
Pastor/shepherds give God's full counsel to members to spiritually feed them.
Encouraging & self esteem are not pastoral positions.

I hear so many people that are non-Christians RUN from preachers or Christians because they want to "shove" the Bible or scriptures down there throat!

Then guess what, THEY DON'T WANT GOD! Let them GO then! Did Jesus ever change His message that offended the people so much just becuz they didn't wanna hear His verses?
Never.
When they attacked him for his truth, did he apologize & tell them he'll stop saying it? Stop quoting it? No.
If people are so repulsed by the Bible, then they do not want the Lord either. THat's fine then. Those who come to church need to hear truth.. if that makes them leave, let them go.
There are TONS of churches that thrive (incl. the one I go to) that preach straight out of the bible, chapter by chapter in a whole study series... how is it we thrive & grow??

Watering down or not giving the entire truth leads people to being ignorant of truth. What happens when they DO find out God condemns people eternally? Or what sins God forbids etc.?
We don't change our message for people's comfort. We give the truth IN LOVE and kindness.

 

[LittleladyinChrist]

I say this with all love, because I pray people will turn away from false teaching and love the Bible and its truth. (with sometimes hurts)

POPULAR CHARISMATIC SPEAKER REFUSES TO SAY THOSE OUTSIDE OF CHRIST GO TO HELL. Friday Church News Notes, July 8, 2005 (Fundamental Baptist Information Service, www.wayoflife.org fbns@wayoflife.org, 866-295-4143) – In a June 20th interview on the international cable television program Larry King Live, the pastor of one of America’s largest churches said that he does not know who goes to heaven or who goes to hell. When asked if atheists go to heaven, Joel Osteen of Lakewood Church in Houston, Texas, replied, “I’m going to let God be the judge of who goes to heaven and hell” (Charismanow.com, June 30). When asked where Jews or Muslims go if they don’t accept Jesus Christ, Osteen replied, “You know, I’m very careful about saying who would and wouldn’t go to heaven; I don’t know.” In a letter posted to his web site, Osteen later apologized for being “unclear on the very thing in which I have dedicated my life.” He said: “In my desire not to alienate the people that Jesus came to save, I did not clearly communicate the convictions that I hold so precious.” In fact, in his statements on Larry King Live Osteen was indeed communicating the core conviction of his church-growth philosophy, which is to preach “positive truth.” He has not drawn a crowd of tens of thousands by preaching clearly on eternal Hell as the Lord Jesus Christ did, and even in his “apology” Osteen did not plainly state that those outside of Christ go to an eternal fiery Hell. When Osteen packed out the Coliseum in Charlotte, North Carolina, in March of this year, a local news reporter enthused, “Osteen doesn’t rail against gays or thump a Bible, like so many others do” (“Evangelist: Don’t Worry, Be Happy,” The Charlotte Observer, March 8, p. E1). Osteen’s message was, “Make a decision before you leave this place, you’re going to get happy where you are.” This is a direct fulfillment of 2 Timothy 4:3-4: “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears, and they shall turn away their ears from the truth and shall be turned unto fables.” Beware of ear tickling preachers who are willing to give a wicked, apostate generation a soft, new kind of Christianity that we do not see in Scripture.

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

" 2 Timothy 4:3-4: “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears, and they shall turn away their ears from the truth and shall be turned unto fables.” Beware of ear tickling preachers who are willing to give a wicked, apostate generation a soft, new kind of Christianity that we do not see in Scripture"

Thank you for posting that article LittleladyinChrist.

I think that the end of the article and 2 Timothy 4:3-4 sum it all up.

 

[allhart]

What do you guys know about him? I have heard his name, but I haven't really heard him speak or read his books. I overheard someone talking about him, but I don't know much about him, so I couldn't really join the discussion.

One of my friend went to one of his senimars weekend talks and show all class.He walks a thin line on Christian beliefs and ethics. He supporting that you make things happen almost like more than GOD. Like GOD isn't in control as much as you are in your LIFE . He pushes the envelope way to far and to much for me.

 

[Pasat_14]

I have a question about Joels church.

How often does he encourage a relationship with Jesus Christ? I've read his book and heard some of his sermons but he never mentions a relationship with Christ. Our spiritual life is way more important than our one on earth. Our relationship with Christ lasts for eternity but the things here on earth on last as long as we are on here.

This is only from my experience with him, I'm just wondering if he's any different when he's preaching at church. I'm not trying to attack him or anything as I know people who have been encouraged and helped by him!

 

[Cris413]

Hi Cris413! About Joel actually teaching the Word, he does and at every sermon.

Hi NewChildofGod,

I totally understand defending Mr Osteen. I would defend Pastor Bob with my dying breath.

I would very much like to encourage you to check out Pastor Bob Coy's teachings. And I will make a commitment to check out Mr Osteen. I have never made it past the first several minutes...but I will watch again and with a sincere open mind.

But I would like a commitment from you as well to check out Pastor Bob Coy. You can catch him on television here in Houston on KLTJ channel 22 at 12:30 CDT on Sundays. If you have cable he's also on Daystar Network same time slot.

Or you can see videocast at www.activeword.org. All of his teachings are archived so you could literally go straight through the bible with Him from Genesis 1 through Revelation 22. That might take some time though.

I promise you sister....you will be amazed at how quickly you will grow in the Spirit with a steady and balanced diet of OT and NT teaching.

Pastor Bob is an excellent Pastor-Teacher and his practical application of teaching gets me through every facet of my life.

Some do criticize him sometimes for the humor he injects into his teaching (no holy laughter just plain humor)...but trust me he can also be very very serious when Scripture directs it.

When I first started going to Calvary Chapel Ft Lauderdale...about 15 years ago...we had about 3,000 people crammed into a warehouse....Now CC Ft Lauderdale serves about 22,000 brothers and sisters...all this growth from a church that doesn't even ask for an offering. We consider your finances are between you and God ...not between you and the church. So IMO this is a church God built...not man. (Oh how I miss this church) I haven't found a home church here in Houston yet...CC Ft Laud and Pastor Bob set my standards pretty high but I praise God I can still get the Bible Studies on line and on TV.

I'm suggesting Pastor Bob because I'm so familiar with him and I know without any doubt or any hesitation he is truly an anointed man of God. I grew more there in 4 years than I did in the 10years before finding CC FT Laud.

I'm not suggesting you not go to Lakewood...fellowship and worship are important too...but I will be praying you will include hanging with Pastor Bob for awhile and see what a healthy diet of God's Word does for your spiritual growth.

As you study with Pastor Bob...keep your Bible handy...you will surely need it. Keep markers where the different books are so you can quickly move to them with the teaching... 'cause believe me...you will be going through the Bible...not just hitting on a few verses. He mainly uses NKJV but often refers to other translations as well as the original language. Also have a notebook and pen ready...he usually gives notes as well.

It will be AWESOME!

I'll be praying for you sister and looking forward to what you have to say about Pastor Bob's teachings.

God bless!

 

[PassionateOne]

One of my friend went to one of his senimars weekend talks and show all class.He walks a thin line on Christian beliefs and ethics. He supporting that you make things happen almost like more than GOD. Like GOD isn't in control as much as you are in your LIFE . He pushes the envelope way to far and to much for me.

Sorry, that's not true, here's some chapters in his book:

Chapter3: God has more on store!
Chpt 19: Let God bring justice into your life.
Chpt 22: Trusting God's timing.
Chpt 24:Trusting God when life doesn't make sense.

Mostly his whole book, even if it doesn't have "God" in the titles of his chapters, teaches you to turn your life and trust over to God.

I have a question about Joels church.

How often does he encourage a relationship with Jesus Christ? I've read his book and heard some of his sermons but he never mentions a relationship with Christ. Our spiritual life is way more important than our one on earth. Our relationship with Christ lasts for eternity but the things here on earth on last as long as we are on here.

This is only from my experience with him, I'm just wondering if he's any different when he's preaching at church. I'm not trying to attack him or anything as I know people who have been encouraged and helped by him!

Here's an ending statement from his book:

"Each week, I close our international TV broadcast by giving the audience an opportunity to make Jesus the Lord of their lives. I'd like to extend that same opportunity to you.
Are you at peace with God? A void exists in every persons heart that only God can fill. Will you pray with me today? Just say, 'Lord Jesus, I repent of my sins. I ask You come into my heart. I make You my Lord and Savior."

Hmmmnnnn....interesting, AND he quotes bible scriptures allll thru his book.

 

[VCViking]

But NewChild, an "encourager" is NOT A SHEPHERD! OR PASTOR. An encourager isn't an evangelist & shouldn't be pastoring & overseeing over a church.

 

[VCViking]

Here's an ending statement from his book:

"Each week, I close our international TV broadcast by giving the audience an opportunity to make Jesus the Lord of their lives. I'd like to extend that same opportunity to you.
Are you at peace with God? A void exists in every persons heart that only God can fill. Will you pray with me today? Just say, 'Lord Jesus, I repent of my sins. I ask You come into my heart. I make You my Lord and Savior."

Hmmmnnnn....interesting, AND he quotes bible scriptures allll thru his book.

He should of did that on Larry King.

 

[Pasat_14]

He should of did that on Larry King.

I agree!

Here's an ending statement from his book:

"Each week, I close our international TV broadcast by giving the audience an opportunity to make Jesus the Lord of their lives. I'd like to extend that same opportunity to you.
Are you at peace with God? A void exists in every persons heart that only God can fill. Will you pray with me today? Just say, 'Lord Jesus, I repent of my sins. I ask You come into my heart. I make You my Lord and Savior."

Hmmmnnnn....interesting, AND he quotes bible scriptures allll thru his book.

Yes, this is the first step to having a relationship with Christ. But does he ever preach the importance of having Christ as your best friend? Like not just a paragraph, but a whole sermon or something.

Also, I have his book and have been reading it. I'm up to chapter 11 now. I've noticed that when he quotes the Bible a lot of the time he won't put the references in..which can get annoying, but more importantly I feel he takes the verses out of context. A lot of them are referring to Heaven but Joel makes it seem as though they're refferring to earth.

 

[Nadiine]

I have a question about Joels church.

How often does he encourage a relationship with Jesus Christ? I've read his book and heard some of his sermons but he never mentions a relationship with Christ. Our spiritual life is way more important than our one on earth. Our relationship with Christ lasts for eternity but the things here on earth on last as long as we are on here.

Better, how often does he teach WHO GOD IS... other than a heavenly genie up there waiting to shower blessings on you if only you'll "hang in there" and WAIT a little bit longer for your motherload to come in.

Most of the deeper teachings of scripture are ignored. Serious issues & information we need.

Just yesterday I watched a tv sermon by Bayless Conner? It was what causes people to fall away from God (steps to apostacy)... He gave scripture backup & listed how these things creep in our lives & steal us away from where we once were.
& since I took notes, I'll share them:

1) false teaching -1 Tim 4:1-2
2) disobeying your conscience 1 Tim. 4:3
3) persecution Mt. 10:34, Mt 24:9-10 (turning into a coward upon attacks and shrinking back from service)
4) love of the world (Lot's wife looking back) 2 Tim 4:9-10, 1 John 2:15-17

Now, THAT was a helpful sermon; warning us of the pitfalls - how we can start to stumble & fall away from God. THAT IS MEAT of the word. That is teaching to grow by.

Encouraging isn't enough, what good is encouraging if you're starting to crumble in any of the above conditions?
Just HANG IN THERE, it'll get better? People NEED meat of the Word to KEEP FROM the problems or how to recognize the problems and/or symptoms.

That is what a true Shepherd will bring his flock on a continual basis.

 

[indagroove]

Originally Posted by marke
If a single person comes to Jesus as a result of Joel Olsteen's actions that will be...


A modern miracle!

I work with many Hindu's and saw a Joel Olsten book on the desk of one of my Hindu friends. I asked about it and he said He and His wife saw Olsten on TV, and it made them want to know more about Jesus. They on the verge of acceptng Jesus. They are deeply spiritual in their Hindu culture, so it is no small step. I am picturing them converting, and then spreading the Gospel to the entrie Hindu community around here. Now wouldn't that bring Glory to God.


Joel took over when his father died. It won't do much for you if you are looking for a hard hitting bible teaching sermon. Lakewood Church is more of a "Lukewarm" Laodicean church.

This ministry did not start out as the mega televangelist that it appears. The church was founded by John Olsten in 1959 in a converted feed store.

I would like to see him dive into scripture, but I guess for a 30 minute segment, he just caters to the seekers.

 

[Nadiine]

I work with many Hindu's and saw a Joel Olsten book on the desk of one of my Hindu friends. I asked about it and he said He and His wife saw Olsten on TV, and it made them want to know more about Jesus. They on the verge of acceptng Jesus. They are deeply spiritual in their Hindu culture, so it is no small step. I am picturing them converting, and then spreading the Gospel to the entrie Hindu community around here. Now wouldn't that bring Glory to God.

Joel took over when his father died. It won't do much for you if you are looking for a hard hitting bible teaching sermon. Lakewood Church is more of a "Lukewarm" Laodicean church.

This ministry did not start out as the mega televangelist that it appears. The church was founded by John Olsten in 1959 in a converted feed store.

I would like to see him dive into scripture, but I guess for a 30 minute segment, he just caters to the seekers.

(not directed at this post) -
I think we should get one fact straight, GOD CAN USE THE SAVED & LOST, GOOD AND BAD to reach people.

Just becuz God can use something to draw you to Himself doesn't mean it's a GODLY person, ministry, group, org., or anything else.
God uses everything for His purposes, dark or light.

We need to stop thinking things like, "well, this can't be bad, becuz people found the Lord thru it". Or, "this helped so & so, therefore, it MUST be annointed by God.
That's totally false.

God used Pharaoh's hard heart to show Israel His power & goodness. God sent lying spirits to work on someone to lead them to do His purpose.
God can use good or bad to reach & draw people to Himself, we cannot just leap to the assumption that it then must be TRUE and righteous.

I agree w/ this post, in that I believe it is one of the churches spoken of in Rev. as in trouble... it's basically led by a Tony Robbin's motivational type speaker who uses some scripture within the message.
I say that becuz anytime preachers of substance preach the Whole truth/counsel of God's word today, they get attacked for using 'hateful' or 'harsh' words... that they aren't "positive enough" or "gentle"... Joel's type of teaching promotes that PC agenda.
So anyone preaching the MEAT of God's word is attacked for being too fundamental or harsh... when it's the gospel message.

Just becuz someone says "GOD" in their sermon doesn't mean they're Shepherds of God or annointed by Him to teach/lead. I'm not judging the man's salvation; that's not my place, but I DO challenge his position in leading a church & his watered down, motivational, pop-psychology messages.

 

[Kelly]

I read a thing were many converts in India do not grasp (or haven't been properly explained) that Jesus is the only way. I guess it's not uncommon to see a picture of Jesus, next to pictures of Vishnu and Ganesh on the mantle in people's homes. Introducing them to Christ through a ministry that won't step out in faith and claim Christ is the only true pathway to salvation just compounds this sort of thing.

 

[PassionateOne]

People may not like him or say he doesn't follow the scripture of the bible or whatever you may say......but all I know is he has taught me to have a closer RL with God and when things in my life has started getting out of control......Joel Osteen has taught me to put all my faith in God and trust in Him that everything is working out the way He intends it.
So, for ME, it was a blessing that I came across his book at a time when I really needed it!

Again, I think it's sad when people focus on the Larry King interview. Okay, so he 'waffled' a bit when he was asked what people should believe......no, that wasn't great, but again he was trying to appeal to the 'masses'.....are you trying to tell me he is the only person that has ever done this?!

 

[Nadiine]

People may not like him or say he doesn't follow the scripture of the bible or whatever you may say......but all I know is he has taught me to have a closer RL with God and when things in my life has started getting out of control......Joel Osteen has taught me to put all my faith in God and trust in Him that everything is working out the way He intends it.
So, for ME, it was a blessing that I came across his book at a time when I really needed it!

Again, I think it's sad when people focus on the Larry King interview. Okay, so he 'waffled' a bit when he was asked what people should believe......no, that wasn't great, but again he was trying to appeal to the 'masses'.....are you trying to tell me he is the only person that has ever done this?!

On national tv? NO. But it wasnt' ONLY tv... his messages don't relay the answers he was asked by Larry King.
He doesnt' bother preaching on ANY topics that are exlusivistic to Jesus Christ being the ONLY way to God, or Christ being GOD (for that matter)... or to repent, or how to steer away from sin, what sins are, that you can't have any gods (thing) above God... or anything else.
It's just Tony Robbins plus some verses.

He doesn't waffle becuz no one puts the real issues to him to force him to answer; he JUST AVOIDS THEM ALL.

Encouragers aren't PASTORS. Pastors Feed their sheep, not motivationally keep them inspired alone - which is my biggest peeve w/ his preaching (which I could literally rehearse for you, I know it all by heart).

Help doesn't mean they're in the right position - a quick read of Rev. 2 will show you that there are many Shepherds & churches, but not that they're all in the will of God.

 

[GregoryTurner]

I would just like to put $0.001 in. If everyone would take a look around and see what is happening in the world, all people need to hear and/or be reminded that Jesus is the ONLY way to salvation and there are reprocussions for those who choose not to believe. I do not watch Joel Osteen. I have a few times and have even read the book. I think it is great that he motivates people towards the promises that God has for them. That is a good thing but sheep in any fold also need to be motivated as to what could and will happen to many if they do not know Jesus. Even in Rev. somewhere Jesus says, "Not everyone who says Lord, Lord..."

A pastor once told me that God places great responsibility on pastors because it is a pastor's job to feed His sheep... I do not know if Osteen is "feeding" his sheep or "scratching" their ears... God has a purpose for Osteen, let Him handle it. If he does not work for you or you do not follow his teaching, move on to someone else. He is reaching someone for the Kingdom, I hope; and if not, the blood of the flock will be on the hands of the shepherd/pastor if God's people are not fed correctly...

g

I guess I will have to see for myself if Osteen's teachings are biblical or not. He may be a motivational kind of person. Thequestion that comes to mind right now for me is,"Is Joel teaching milk or meat?"

 

[GregoryTurner]

Lakewood Church is more of a "Lukewarm" Laodicean church.

That statement is a scary one...

Rev 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
Rev 3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth


If that statement is a true statement, I will be sure to keep my distance from Lakewood, its teachings, and give my book of "best life" away to a new believer...

g

 

[GregoryTurner]

Please excuse my ramblings here but I read a post above that talked about John Osteen being harsh.

Sometimes, with God's direction, harshness is the only way that some will listen. Do you think that Jesus' Sermon on the Mount was hush, hush quiet talking? How many peolpe were there to hear? They did not have microphones and amps and pa systems, etc... Jesus was a loud preacher! Very bold and yet very loving at the same time. I am compelled to go and re-read Matthew 5... I thank you