joel osteen is a good man

[Mattsanity]

how could osteen critics call themselves christians who claim he preaches false doctrine and yet judge someone they dont know? isnt that a contradiction?

 

[Hentenza]

Not at all. I've been to his church and listened to his false teaching. I am not judging him. That is God's job, however, I can most certainly judge his teachings and they are nothing more than watered down Christianity.

 

[Mattsanity]

Not at all. I've been to his church and listened to his false teaching. I am not judging him. That is God's job, however, I can most certainly judge his teachings and they are nothing more than watered down Christianity.

this is what Im talking about though. why cant christians and non-believers just look at him in the most positive light? after all, everything he utters is positive. just cause he doesnt talk about sin and hell doesnt mean he's a false prophet. my mom says he's a genuine follower of God, and believe me my mom is as spiritual as you can get. she says he's genuine cause she looks at him positively, not negatively.

by the way, look forward to his next book It's Your Time.

 

[seashale76]

Who? What man is this and what doctrine/s is he espousing? Where does he get his authority and why should I listen to him?


I'm failing to see how this is persecution. Is this man getting people's money, time, and attention to spread his views without hindrance? Has he had his rights taken away, violated, his life threatened?

 

[Jeffz]

Just because a man speaks of good things and positive words that does not mean He went to the Lord to recieve of Him a message. When many people follow one man it makes me wonder? The word of the Lord is sharper than a two edged sword, it can hurt.
If I always speak nice flowery words does it cause any one to look at thier evil ways?
Jerimiah had some words from God about those who say peace peace all is peace:

Jer 23:21 ¶ I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran: I have not spoken to them, yet they prophesied.

Jer 23:22 But if they had stood in my counsel, and had caused my people to hear my words, then they should have turned them from their evil way, and from the evil of their doings.

Jer 23:23 ¶ [Am] I a God at hand, saith the LORD, and not a God afar off?

Jer 23:24 Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the LORD. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the LORD.

Jer 23:25 I have heard what the prophets said, that prophesy lies in my name, saying, I have dreamed, I have dreamed.

Jer 23:26 How long shall [this] be in the heart of the prophets that prophesy lies? yea, [they are] prophets of the deceit of their own heart;

Jer 23:27 Which think to cause my people to forget my name by their dreams which they tell every man to his neighbour, as their fathers have forgotten my name for Baal.

Jer 23:28 The prophet that hath a dream, let him tell a dream; and he that hath my word, let him speak my word faithfully. What [is] the chaff to the wheat? saith the LORD.

Jer 23:29 [Is] not my word like as a fire? saith the LORD; and like a hammer [that] breaketh the rock in pieces?

Jer 23:30 ¶ Therefore, behold, I [am] against the prophets, saith the LORD, that steal my words every one from his neighbour.

Jer 23:31 Behold, I [am] against the prophets, saith the LORD, that use their tongues, and say, He saith.

Jer 23:32 Behold, I [am] against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the LORD, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the LORD.

Jer 23:33 ¶ And when this people, or the prophet, or a priest, shall ask thee, saying, What [is] the burden of the LORD? thou shalt then say unto them, What burden? I will even forsake you, saith the LORD.

Jer 23:34 And [as for] the prophet, and the priest, and the people, that shall say, The burden of the LORD, I will even punish that man and his house.

Jer 23:35 Thus shall ye say every one to his neighbour, and every one to his brother, What hath the LORD answered? and, What hath the LORD spoken?

Jer 23:36 And the burden of the LORD shall ye mention no more: for every man's word shall be his burden; for ye have perverted the words of the living God, of the LORD of hosts our God.

Jer 23:37 Thus shalt thou say to the prophet, What hath the LORD answered thee? and, What hath the LORD spoken?

Do his words cause ones to turn from thier evil ways? When I see multiple thousands in the stands of a stadium with many smiles and not tears I have to wonder.

 

[Mattsanity]

Who? What man is this and what doctrine/s is he espousing? Where does he get his authority and why should I listen to him?


I'm failing to see how this is persecution. Is this man getting people's money, time, and attention to spread his views without hindrance? Has he had his rights taken away, violated, his life threatened?

I thought it suits this section cause he gets persecuted for being a genuine follower of Christ.


and Jeffz, if Joel really is a conman, dont you think his church would lose attendance? he cant deceive thousands of people like that year after year. the fact that his church has thrived this long proves he's a genuine follower of Christ.

why is it that anyone who does good tries to be put down. people even think usain bolt took steroids cause he's on top - no it was all hard work.

 

[Hentenza]

2 Timothy 4:2-4
2Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. 3For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

Joel Osteen is a false teacher. He preaches a prosperity gospel and therefore, what itchy ears want to hear. He does not preach the message of the bible but one of his own making.

No one is persecuting him but merely showing the error of his teaching. Joel serves two masters.

 

[Mattsanity]

2 Timothy 4:2-4
2Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. 3For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

Joel Osteen is a false teacher. He preaches a prosperity gospel and therefore, what itchy ears want to hear. He does not preach the message of the bible but one of his own making.

No one is persecuting him but merely showing the error of his teaching. Joel serves two masters.

'
Ive heard this a million times. whatever though, let God be the judge.

 

[cwolf20]

Don't restrict it to him.

After all, Christians who

1)support abortion and Christians who are against it

2)support/are against alcohol.

3)Support/are against women being in leadership in the church

are persecuted too


I could go on. It's not limited to one specific section of Christianity

 

[Hentenza]

'
Ive heard this a million times. whatever though, let God be the judge.

God is the judge on his soul not me but I am biblically commanded to discern and rebuke false teachers.

If you have heard this a million times then why do you doubt it?

 

[Mattsanity]

God is the judge on his soul not me but I am biblically commanded to discern and rebuke false teachers.

If you have heard this a million times then why do you doubt it?

there's nothing wrong with the timothy verse you posted by apostle paul.

Im talking about how you're quick to judge him. his preaching style is more about living an abundant life compared to shoving down the idea that you're full of sin and going to hell. the bible talks about prosperity plenty of times:

God is not selfish or stingy but "gives us richly all things to enjoy." (1 Timothy 6:17)

The blessing of the Lord makes one rich." (Proverbs 10:22)

Jesus Christ "became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich." (2 Corinthians 8:9)


this is exactly what osteen preaches. he's been preaching for 10 years and counting. there hasnt been any strange publicity or scandals involving him and his church so clearly he's doing something right.

 

[DennaVeritas]

Sorry, I am confused. What does he say that is false? I don't know him that well, except for some of his devtionals i think. I didn't even know people has a problem with him. I heard he was great. Could someone please explain?

 

[Jeffz]

I thought it suits this section cause he gets persecuted for being a genuine follower of Christ.


and Jeffz, if Joel really is a conman, dont you think his church would lose attendance? he cant deceive thousands of people like that year after year. the fact that his church has thrived this long proves he's a genuine follower of Christ.

why is it that anyone who does good tries to be put down. people even think usain bolt took steroids cause he's on top - no it was all hard work.

OhhhChung, I didn't call him a conman, but if you read the scriptures I quoted from you will see what God says. I do not think that He is intentially teaching wrong but I do not see him speaking the hard things of God. A preacher that is called by God and does not speak the truth that would cause a man, woman, boy or girl to have Godly sorrow is couching the word of God. It is no wonder that He has so many followers because most do not want to hear truth, they want to be lulled to sleep. Sound the Alarm!! wake up oh sleeper! For the kingdom of heaven is at hand,Tear your garments and fall down before almighty God and seek repentance, Ye must be born again.
Does he preach the message of the cross? For that is what a preacher should preach.

one man set free,
Jeffrey

 

[DeaconPhil]

you dont have to judge somebody to see what kind of fruit they have. Just a thought. Also I don't really care for critics to much it seems their time cold be better spent

 

[bsd31]

Being a good man isn't the same as being a sound teacher of the scriptures, and for some reason when I hear the word "church" mentioned I tend to expect sound doctrine from whoever is at the podium speaking. He is a good man (at least as far as any man can be good), but that doesn't make him a good teacher of God's word.

 

[daviddub]

The question is not whether the man is good. But let's first recognize our own hypocrisy. If you are saying that to speak against what Joel O. is saying is judgment, then aren't you judging those who speak against Joel; when you speak against what they say about Joel?
Secondly. Truth is good WHEN IT IS USED TRUTHFULLY. Consider this: Someone is telling you of all the joy, and freedom, and mobility, and flexibility of owning a vehicle. They just go on and on non-stop. They tell you about all the features of current cars, etc. The problem is that they never tell you what is needed in order to actually get a car. They can deliver the story, but they can never actually deliver the keys.
Here is the point of the story. The person who talks forever about the grace of God, and never about the wrath of God, understands neither. You do not understand His grace until you really understand His wrath. You aren't grateful of being saved, until you truly understand what you have been saved from. I have one type of gratefulness if I think God has delivered me from debt and disease so that I can live my "Best Life Now". There is a whole other type of fiery gratefulness, and thanksgiving, and worship, and love that results from understanding that I was headed to a torment that our words cannot quantify...because of sin which my abominable heart chose time and time again...and also that this sin is so abominable that our words, again, cannot quantify. Notice how the "Gospel of God" and "righteousness of God" (Rom 1:16-17) stands back-to-back with the "wrath of God" (Rom 1:18-32). These two have been illustrated in tandem, and using such language because the "Gospel" or good news is only truly understood (to fallen man) if we know what the bad news should have otherwise been. As the Lord Himself tells us in Luke 7:47 that They who are forgiven much will love much; but they who are forgiven little will love little. 'paraphrased'

 

[Bethshaya]

damn this is what Im talking about though. why cant christians and non-believers just look at him in the most positive light? after all, everything he utters is positive. just cause he doesnt talk about sin and hell doesnt mean he's a false prophet. my mom says he's a genuine follower of God, and believe me my mom is as spiritual as you can get. she says he's genuine cause she looks at him positively, not negatively.

by the way, look forward to his next book It's Your Time.

Because that is not why Jesus came. If that were so, He would have told us we could all go to heaven because we are "good" people and that whatever we believe is Ok with him.

He didn't. He told us to be watchful for false prophets in the end times. Osteen does not preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He preaches a feel-good, don't talk about sin because everyone needs to feel fluffy, warm and fuzzy gospel.

The truth is, the road is narrow and the gate is small. Most of those who profess to be Christian, pastors too, will be denied entrance to heaven. Why? Because they profess with their mouth, but do not do so in their heart.

We are not judging his salvation, we are judging his fruit. A bad tree cannot produce good fruit. If the fruit is rotten, the tree is rotten. Every Christian needs to meet the "test" to know if they are a true Christian as John states in 1 John. If you fail the tests, you are not saved.

You cannot preach salvation without preaching sin. You cannot teach prosperiety without teaching suffering and trials.

End Times are approaching fast (they are here already), those who are stuck with this feel-good fuzzy gospel are going to be ill-equipped to deal with the persecution that lies ahead for us all. There will be no prosperiety, they will take everything you own, including your bible, home and job. You see, the Gospel was never meant to make your life on earth easy, prosperous and fun, it was meant to save you from the fiery destruction to come. The Gospel is meant to Glorify God.

Osteen preaches that we should be satisfying our earthly cravings for things by using Gods Word instead of seeking to Glorify God. It isn't about us...it is about Him...ALL about Him.

There are blessings of God, but people always quote them out of context, as if there is some magical words you need to say for him to "bless" you with a BMW.

You quote 1 Timothy:

God is not selfish or stingy but "gives us richly all things to enjoy." (1 Timothy 6:17)

But you left out the preceeding verse:

Command those who are rich in this present world to not be arrogant nor to put their hope in wealth which is so uncertain, but to put their hope in God

The blessing of the Lord makes one rich." (Proverbs 10:22)

Wealth is worthless in the day of wrath, but righteousness delivers from death (Proverbs 11 4)

Jesus Christ "became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich." (2 Corinthians 8:9)

You need to read all of 2 Corinthians 8. You get a different point of view as the single verse is out of context. Paul is saying that one being rich, while other brothers are poor is not good. To share your wealth with your brother in need so that all are equal. He says "give yourselves first to the Lord, then to your brother according to God's will"

 

[Almighty's humble servant]

Peace and blessings brothers and sisters,

The abundant life ALmighty has prepared for us in our Beloved's Kingdom, and the ensuing eternity IS NOT OF THIS WORLD!

Rev JO is not teaching scripture, he is teaching wealth. he is a motivational speaker at best. True we should not sell ourselves short. True we should keep working for our daily bread, but false is the search for wealth.
We all know the "love of money is the root of all evil", but it seems that if we see socalled teachers living this life of overabundance, that we to should lust after the same.
i am not rebuking the rich. i am simply saying that it is far more important to share and be happy with what we have. And if we are blessed with wealth, we should try hard to share until our accounts bleed as Messiah did, lest it be our curse.

Praise and exalt Him above all forever!

 

[scrofford]

Joel Osteen is a false teacher. He preaches a prosperity gospel and therefore, what itchy ears want to hear. He does not preach the message of the bible but one of his own making.

No one is persecuting him but merely showing the error of his teaching. Joel serves two masters.

Ok, personally I don't think Joel teaches the "meat" of the Word. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with preaching prosperity. God wants us to prosper. Not just spiritually, but physically and mentally and financially. God wants us to prosper in every area of our lives in order to bring Glory to Him and be able to help other people.

It is not wrong to believe God for the things you need or even WANT. It is ok to ask Him for things and then believe that you will receive them. The Bible tells us that we have the Blessings of Abraham (See Deut. 28) and that as Christians we have been redeemed from the curse of the law.

At worst Joel doesn't preach on anything else, which I think is wrong. He should be feeding his church with more than just the prosperity message. I just wanted to make it clear that prosperity in every area of our lives is what God wants.

 

[Bethshaya]

God wanting us to prosper is different then the "Prosperiety Gospel".

The Prosperiety Gospel says the we can manipulate God by praying for things in Jesus' name. The focus isn't on God's will, but on ours.

While owning expensive things isn't, of itself, a bad thing, the wanton need for financial and material possessions is the problem with that gospel.

The Prosperity Gospel's basic notion is that if you are "godly", you will prosper, but its opposite is also what they believe, if you are ungodly, then you will be in poverty.

There are plenty of godly people who are true to Him that are poor, and there are plenty of rich people who are ungodly and untrue to God and are rich.

Job was righteous, and yet he was shown to be in poverty (of the worst kind...everything gone), and yet, he was not ungodly or even caused his own poverty because he lacked faith. It was because he had faith that he was targeted, and because he remained faithful, that it all was restored.

The faith in God to deliver us from our situation, or see us through it, good or bad, is the true principle, not the prosperity.

The dangers of Osteen teaching the types of messages he does is that he does not give the whole picture. There will be people, though their intention isn't viscious, have misplaced motived for their faith and miss the whole true gospel message. They want to see the fluffy feel good message, but the Gospel isn't always fluffy feel good. God isn't Santa Claus, he's God.