Jesus is a God of conditional Love, not unconditional love. (3)

[ozell]

You guys, You're arguing with a straight up legalist. He always presents his form of Christianity as "you either do this or you are not a Christian." He's been doing this for a couple years now on here, but none of it means he actually knows Jesus any better than anyone else.

Isn't it sad that he has come to the point of arguing with folks on here what the love of Jesus is?

Jesus is a legalist, He gave the law.

 

[Yeisu]

A Christian is someone who doesnt follow their self will, but the will of God, revealed to us through the Lord Jesus Christ. Jesus tells us: "he who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me." and "he who does not take up his cross and follow Me is not worthy of Me." A true Christian is not just a hearer, but a doer. Faith is dead without works. Jesus' love is enough for me and enough for anyone else. Because by following Him, abiding in His word, we are redeemed to our God. Blessed and holy is the Lord who reigns forever and ever on His throne of glory!

 

[ozell]

A Christian is someone who doesnt follow their self will, but the will of God, revealed to us through the Lord Jesus Christ. Jesus tells us: "he who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me." and "he who does not take up his cross and follow Me is not worthy of Me." A true Christian is not just a hearer, but a doer. Faith is dead without works. Jesus' love is enough for me and enough for anyone else. Because just by following Him, He redeems us to our God. Blessed and holy is the Lord who reigns forever and ever on His throne of glory!

a condition for love from Jesus.

 

[Yeisu]

Of course there is condition. Do you really think the road to eternal life is easy? Who are we to think we are worthy of such an awesome gift from a pure, holy Almighty God? It is the grace of God.

"Narrow and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."
-Jesus

For me, there is no higher honor than to live in the presence of such an awesome God for all eternity.

 

[razzelflabben]

the people in the flood where his children.

the people in sodom and gomorrah where his children.

the israelites who made the golden calf where his children.

what happen to these children of God?

what happen to God's love for these people as God burned, drowned or destroyed them and there family?

let me ask you this also even though i have posted it many times

what is Gods definition of Love?[

why would you keep asking if your only intent is to refuse to listen to the definition? The entire bible is God's definition of love. But the best short definition I know is that love is putting another above self as an act of humility....my husband and I are taking a course right now, that defines love as giving another value rather than devaluing them, this is also a working definition. And yes, it is important to summarize the definition or else we would simple be quoting the entire bible in reply.

how do we love the lord?

we love the Lord by many things, worship, praise, prayer, etc. but the one mark of our love for God that is unmistakable is our obedience of His commands.

how do we love one another?

Our love for one another is also marked by many things, in fact this is one place where I Cor. 13 comes in very handy, for love is patience, love is kind, etc. but the one unmistakable mark of love with one another is unity. This is not to say, love never disagrees, but rather that love united in Christ.

 

[razzelflabben]

Jesus is a legalist, He gave the law.

Actually god gave the law, but that is a different topic.

 

[razzelflabben]

Of course there is condition. Do you really think the road to eternal life is easy? Who are we to think we are worthy of such an awesome gift from a pure, holy Almighty God? It is the grace of God.

"Narrow and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."
-Jesus

For me, there is no higher honor than to live in the presence of such an awesome God for all eternity.

There is a price to pay for following Jesus, not for being loved by Him.

 

[Light hearted]

Jesus is a legalist, He gave the law.

Good point, I think we can turn this into love.....

I realize the difference of opinion of God or Jesus writing the law, I don't need to get into that. But just for the sake of discussion, lets say Jesus wrote the law.

Jesus wrote the law as Ozell says, yet we read elsewhere that no man has ever fulfilled the law. Remember, break one, you broke them all. Which leads to death.

Now we have the one, Jesus, the writer of the law, an unfulfillable law, for any motal man, comes to earth, born in the flesh, lives a perfect life, then at the end gives himself up to be tortured, beaten, and hung. All so mankind can have a chance of eternal live through the sacrifice of His life.

Wow, fulfilled His own law, yes, His own law, just for mankind, who is miserable to fulfill the law. If that aint Love, i don't know what is.

What's the condition....FAITH, faith that I am a sinner and he already paid my price. Yup, he loved me first, with no conditions.

 

[ozell]

Good point, I think we can turn this into love.....

I realize the difference of opinion of God or Jesus writing the law, I don't need to get into that. But just for the sake of discussion, lets say Jesus wrote the law.

Jesus wrote the law as Ozell says, yet we read elsewhere that no man has ever fulfilled the law. Remember, break one, you broke them all. Which leads to death.

Now we have the one, Jesus, the writer of the law, an unfulfillable law, for any motal man, comes to earth, born in the flesh, lives a perfect life, then at the end gives himself up to be tortured, beaten, and hung. All so mankind can have a chance of eternal live through the sacrifice of His life.

Wow, fulfilled His own law, yes, His own law, just for mankind, who is miserable to fulfill the law. If that aint Love, i don't know what is.

What's the condition....FAITH, faith that I am a sinner and he already paid my price. Yup, he loved me first, with no conditions.

LH

Jesus paid the price for the sins that are past once you come under his blood or start to beleive in him.

lets read

Romans 3:24-26
24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

once you come under the blood of Jesus and believe in him

you cannot sin wilfully

Hebrews 10:25-27
25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

26For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.


also let me show you how flawed your statement is

God would not give man something he can't keep

He said this about these 3 men

Genesis 6:9
These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

Genesis 17:1
And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.


Job 1:1
There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.

GOD SAID THESE MEN WERE PERFECT AND UPRIGHT who are you to say what can't be done when God said it can?

shame on you!!!

Now the statement on God or Jesus giving the law

Jesus is God

Jesus gave the law to Israel in the wilderness

lets read


1 Corinthians 10


1Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. 5But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.

6Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

7Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
8Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand. 9Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.

who was in the wilderness with Israel an Moses?

who did these people tempt?

who is the CHRIST IN THE BIBILE?

JESUS!

 

[ozell]

Actually god gave the law, but that is a different topic.

and Jesus is God!!!

1 Corinthians 10


1Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. 5But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.

6Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

7Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
8Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand. 9Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.

who was in the wilderness with Israel an Moses?

who did these people tempt?

 

[ozell]

There is a price to pay for following Jesus, not for being loved by Him.

and if the people don't follow him the price they pay from a God you think love everyone is eternal death!

what a price to pay if a person don't believe in a God that loves everyone.

everyone on this earth don't follow or believe in Jesus

everyone on this earth don't have one once of faith in Jesus

yet you think he loves them.

 

[ozell]

why would you keep asking if your only intent is to refuse to listen to the definition? The entire bible is God's definition of love. But the best short definition I know is that love is putting another above self as an act of humility....my husband and I are taking a course right now, that defines love as giving another value rather than devaluing them, this is also a working definition. And yes, it is important to summarize the definition or else we would simple be quoting the entire bible in reply. we love the Lord by many things, worship, praise, prayer, etc. but the one mark of our love for God that is unmistakable is our obedience of His commands. Our love for one another is also marked by many things, in fact this is one place where I Cor. 13 comes in very handy, for love is patience, love is kind, etc. but the one unmistakable mark of love with one another is unity. This is not to say, love never disagrees, but rather that love united in Christ.

it is marked by many things which is obedience, we are to obey all the things you said and more like keeping the commandment which Jesus said from his own mouth.

HOW DO I LOVE GOD AND HOW DOES GOD LOVE ME IN THIS CHAPTER?
WHERE IS THE DEFINITION OF Love IN THIS CHAPTER?
HOW DO THIS CHAPTER TEACH THE BABE THE MEANING OF LOVE?

1 Corinthians 13


1Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
9For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. 13And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

 

[ozell]

Now we have looked at the entire passage and you have denied what it says, so let's just look at the verse itself.

3 In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome,

Now Ozell, time to put your money where your mouth is....please take the above verse you are trying to use to support your claims and highlight for us where it says that God refuses to love the workers of iniquity and/or only loves those that obey HIM...your claim here is that we are missing the part of the verse that says that God only loves those that obey Him, so highlight the part we are missing. You were asked to do this before and refused...try again.

SISTER

the verse is self explanatory

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

this is the love of GOD,

notice it says the love of GOD,

not our love,

the love of GOD

is what?

notice it says that we keep his commandments

that WE keep his commandment

 

[ozell]

Ozell, repeating the same verse doesn't count, in fact, when we remove the repeats, you have hardly posted any scripture at all. As to what most people read, I guess that depends on whether you include the worldly or not. Most people who go to church and follow along in the sermon have read more verses and passages (different, unique verses and passages) than you have presented here and that is just with attending a church for a year.

Sister

the same verse count because it has been there long before us.

I doubt that sister if people here have read more verses that I have put in this thread alone.

on the topic of Godly love or unconditional love

these verse are not said in your average denominational church and non-denominational church

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.


a matter of fact this is not taught in the churches because most christian churches teach the law is no more.

Sister

consider

here on this site you have people calling me a legalist because I tell them they have to keep the commandments

why such foolishness?

even on this thread

people talk about there children and how much they the love them,

I bet they don't teach there children to steal, kill, lie, dishonour their parents,

yet these people who claim that the law is no more would tell an adult or worse yet a christian who they are supposed to love so much, they would say such none sense as

"the law is done away with"

"we are not under the law anymore"

how can you tell someone to steal, kill, lie, have other God's before me, take my name in vain. covet, etc

the condition for God's love is keep his commandments period!!!

 

[ozell]

ozell - Do you have any children? Well, I do. I love my children unconditionally. I have rules for my children - they don't always follow them but does that change my love for them? NO!

God is our heavenly Father. Sometimes we don't always follow His rules. Does that change His love for us? NO! His love is the same as our love for our children - its unconditional.

Sister

your love changes for them until they do something to makeup for there mistake.

the difference is sister we don't kill our children as the Lord kill his children the flood and sodom and Gomorrah to name a few, These people were the children of God were they not?

we love our children conditional also, and after time and obeying our words the children are back in good graces.

example Sister

if a 15 year old child or the 30 year old adult goes out and commits heinous crimes, the parent love is diminish, because shame and hurt enters in.

maybe after months and years the love and forgiveness may come back,

yet that child is locked away and has not committed a sin against the parent and God.

all is forgotten and forgiveness of the past sins one the child has repented

but if the child goes out and continue the same life style of sin and disobedience what is a parent to do?

what is Jesus to do?

read about the flood and see what Jesus did.

 

[ozell]

Ozell you're downplaying the eternal and complete atonement of the work of Jesus Christ on the Cross.

The world only feels the punishment of the original fall of man.

We dont get crushed by our sins. Not now. Not after Christ.

The wicked receive theirs after death.

we are not talking about the cross we are talking about love

pay attention to this from Paul

keep in mind this si long after Jesus death and resurrection


Hebrews 10:25-27

25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.


26For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.


what is this judgement that is a fiery indignation which shall devour the adversaries?

keep in mind this after the cross!!!

 

[ozell]

the people in the flood where his children.

The people in the flood did not heed Noah when he was building the ark and telling them that it was going to rain for 40 days and 40 nights. So Noah believed God, they didn't, they paid the consequence.

so your God that loves everyone made them pay the consequences? Not love but consequences?

the people in Sodom and Gomorrah where his children.

Did not God warn the people they would be destroyed if they continued in their evil ways. Do you realize what was going on in Sodom and Gomorrah? They were in total disobedience to God and had turned their backs on God therefore they paid the consequences.

again they are the children of God they were part of the creation, they disobeyed the God who loves everyone and they paid the consequences given by the God who loves everyone. CORRECT.

the Israelites who made the golden calf where his children.

Did God explicitly tell the Israelites to worship no other God's before Him?

and these children of God his chosen people were disobedient and broke God's commandments for loving him.

what happen to these children of God?

They all died in disobedience. Not because God did not love them.

Sister

you God that loves everyone should not had destroyed them or this act, he loves everyone, also it is taught here and in church that God "commandments are done away with" what happen to God' love when it comes to building a golden calf and worshipping it?

if I disobey the God that loves everyone my punishment is death and destruction?

what happen to God's love for these people as God burned, drowned or destroyed them and there family?

He still loved them.

Sister

you can't sell this to a 8 year old. please lets reason together

let me ask you this also even though i have posted it many times

what is Gods definition of Love?

God loved us so much that he gave his only begotten Son. That kind of love does not have a definition. Its too BIG!

how do we love the lord?

By reverence, honor and faith.

how do we love one another?
​

With respect, compassion, longsuffering, honesty, being kind to one another, tenderhearted and with forgiveness.

what is God definition of love in the bible?

but to comment on your answer

you have to tell a person

how to love one another,
how to be tender hearted
how to be forgiving
why we forgive
how to be long suffering

how are we to do these acts
why do we do these acts

thanks for the fellowship!
​

 

[mandyangel]

Jesus LOVES every one of his children. His children choose whether to accept God as their savior or not. Even if some go to hell, he still LOVES them.

 

[ozell]

You guys, You're arguing with a straight up legalist. He always presents his form of Christianity as "you either do this or you are not a Christian." He's been doing this for a couple years now on here, but none of it means he actually knows Jesus any better than anyone else.

Isn't it sad that he has come to the point of arguing with folks on here what the love of Jesus is?

are u watching me?

Jesus is a legalist!

I'm in Good company!

I rather be a legalist than a illegalist!

 

[razzelflabben]

and Jesus is God!!!

absolutely, and yet Jesus role, or job was different than God's....Jesus role or job as it were was to fulfill the law. Thus, God gave the law, Jesus fulfilled the law, the HS equips us to live according to the law. One God different jobs/purposes