Jesus Held to Sola Scriptura

[stuart lawrence]

Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness for everyone who believeth rom10:4

I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness comes through the law Christ died for nothing gal2:21

But now a righteousness APART from law has been made known, to which the law and the prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe
Rom3:21&22

We who are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners know that a man is not justified by observing the law but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we too have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law. Because by observing the law no one will be justified
Gal2:5&16

So who, in reality believes in sola scripture and who does not?

 

[stuart lawrence]

That is your excited heart speaking.

No, just honesty and making a valid point

 

[stuart lawrence]

In my personal experience, the churches I have known that most earnestly emphasise the innerancy of scripture/ the Bible is the bottom line and must be fully followed/ you must accept the whole message, are churches that preach morality to a very high degree, but do NOT alongside it preach Pauls core basic message of grace.
Indeed, I was raised in such a church. At the age of nineteen i finally read Pauls letters for myself. I was literally stunned by much of what I read. For the church of my youth, that resolutely stated we must accept the full biblical message and boldly proclaim it, had never once preached on what Paul so often relentlessly stated.
It is my firm belief, that any minister of any mainline church, who fully and forthrightly preached Pauls core message of grace, would have a church packed out with people, there would be no empty seats.
For what is often sadly a hugely untapped market, would come flocking to hear the message

 

[rjs330]

Who truly follows sola scripture?

Sin is the transgression of the law
1john3:4

Therefore if you observe the law you do not commit sin, if you fail to observe the law you do commit sin

Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law, rather through the law we become conscious of sin rom3:20

And Paul goes on repeating it. Isn't that sola scripture?
BTW

I'm NOT advocating a licence to sin.
But I feel I must repeat, the churches I have known, who in effect subscribe the most to sola scripture, only preach one side/ part of sola scripture.

There isn't two sides of Sola Scriptura. What you are talking about is doctrine not the authority of scripture. Yes some churches are legalistic. Some preach all grace so people do whatever they want and pastors use foul language from the pulpit. Some preachers teach prosperity gospel. And all of them use scripture to back them up. But none of that had anything to do with Sola Scriptura. The misuse of scripture is doctrinal it is not Sola Scriptura.

 

[stuart lawrence]

There isn't two sides of Sola Scriptura. What you are talking about is doctrine not the authority of scripture. Yes some churches are legalistic. Some preach all grace so people do whatever they want and pastors use foul language from the pulpit. Some preachers teach prosperity gospel. And all of them use scripture to back them up. But none of that had anything to do with Sola Scriptura. The misuse of scripture is doctrinal it is not Sola Scriptura.

I can only once more repeat. The churches I have known, that most earnestly state the Bible is the bottom line, it must fully be followed, it is infallible( mainly fundamentalist churches), preach morality to a very high degree, but do NOT preach the message of grace Paul wrote of alongside it

 

[The Times]

I will ask you again. Do you believe the Christian is not righteous/ justified before God by observing the law/ not committing sin.

No need to quote scripture, a yes or no will suffice

The Sola Scripture words of God give the answer. God places the believer in a position of making a free will choice, that is to continue on sinning as an unrighteous and unholy person or to repent and to DO THE LAW of the heart of flesh, that leads to the narrow path of righteousness and Holiness.

Christians are justified by the Holy Works of Christ on the cross, yet being justified will not save them onto eternal life, for many are called, but only a few chosen into his Heaven Kingdom (Ezekiel 36:26-30). Therefore one must be born again of the Spirit of God and in the personage of Jesus Christ, in order to be counted as righteous and Holy before the Holy God.

It is not fair to say answer yes or no to your question, without using Sola Scripture to back up what God expects of Christians.

In fact salvation formula is not only justification on its own, rather it must encompass the following......

Justification and sanctification

The sanctification of a justified by the blood of Christ Christian is the doing of the law of God, through the heart of flesh, which the righteous God will in turn determine, if it meets his standard of righteousness and Holiness.

John 3:5 gives that formula.....

Jesus answered, "Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.

Water is the justifying works of Christ

Spirit is the sanctifying life long works in a justified by Christ/Living Water Christian

God who is unchangable makes it clear three times in the Old Testament, as follows.....

6“Therefore say to the people of Israel, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: Repent! Turn from your idols and renounce all your detestable practices!

if these three men—Noah, Daniela and Job—were in it, they could save only themselves by their righteousness, declares the Sovereign Lord.

16as surely as I live, declares the Sovereign Lord, even if these three men were in it, they could not save their own sons or daughters. They alone would be saved, but the land would be desolate.

18as surely as I live, declares the Sovereign Lord, even if these three men were in it, they could not save their own sons or daughters. They alone would be saved.

even if Noah, Daniel and Job  were in it, they could save neither son nor daughter. They would save only themselves by their righteousness.

When God repeats himself in regards to righteousness, the law is expected to be applied on ones life. Previously in the Old Testament it was through the heart of stone and letter of the law, in the New Testament it is through the born again believers heart of flesh.

Without the law of God manifesting in the heart of flesh, there is no sanctification or the works of God present in that justified by the blood of Christ's believer in this regard, therefore many who call upon the Lord in that day shall be rejected as it is written.

What distinguishes the saved from the unsaved is not only the blood or faith in Christ, but the evidence of that faith, through the life long Holy Works of the Holy Ghost in a born again believer.

The salvation formula in John 3:5 stands as a testimony of Sola Scripture to what standard of Holiness and righteousness is required of a justified Christian.

When we were justified by blood, we walked as prisoners of Christ under the arbitrator of sanctification, the Holy Ghost and if we don't get cleansed in the heart of flesh by him, then our choice would have been that of disobedience and for that matter no disobedient Christian will enter the Kingdom unless they are determined to have being conformed to the law of Christ. As Jesus said.....

Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them." (John 14:21).

 

[stuart lawrence]

The Sola Scripture words of God give the answer. God places the believer in a position of making a free will choice, that is to continue on sinning as an unrighteous and unholy person or to repent and to DO THE LAW of the heart of flesh, that leads to the narrow path of righteousness and Holiness.

Christians are justified by the Holy Works of Christ on the cross, yet being justified will not save them onto eternal life, for many are called, but only a few chosen into his Heaven Kingdom (Ezekiel 36:26-30). Therefore one must be born again of the Spirit of God and in the personage of Jesus Christ, in order to be counted as righteous and Holy before the Holy God.

It is not fair to say answer yes or no to your question, without using Sola Scripture to back up what God expects of Christians.

In fact salvation formula is not only justification on its own, rather it must encompass the following......

Justification and sanctification

The sanctification of a justified by the blood of Christ Christian is the doing of the law of God, through the heart of flesh, which the righteous God will in turn determine, if it meets his standard of righteousness and Holiness.

John 3:5 gives that formula.....

Jesus answered, "Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.

Water is the justifying works of Christ

Spirit is the sanctifying life long works in a justified by Christ/Living Water Christian

God who is unchangable makes it clear three times in the Old Testament, as follows.....

6“Therefore say to the people of Israel, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: Repent! Turn from your idols and renounce all your detestable practices!

if these three men—Noah, Daniela and Job—were in it, they could save only themselves by their righteousness, declares the Sovereign Lord.

16as surely as I live, declares the Sovereign Lord, even if these three men were in it, they could not save their own sons or daughters. They alone would be saved, but the land would be desolate.

18as surely as I live, declares the Sovereign Lord, even if these three men were in it, they could not save their own sons or daughters. They alone would be saved.

even if Noah, Daniel and Job  were in it, they could save neither son nor daughter. They would save only themselves by their righteousness.

When God repeats himself in regards to righteousness, the law is expected to be applied on ones life. Previously in the Old Testament it was through the heart of stone and letter of the law, in the New Testament it is through the born again believers heart of flesh.

Without the law of God manifesting in the heart of flesh, there is no sanctification or the works of God present in that justified by the blood of Christ's believer in this regard, therefore many who call upon the Lord in that day shall be rejected as it is written.

What distinguishes the saved from the unsaved is not only the blood or faith in Christ, but the evidence of that faith, through the life long Holy Works of the Holy Ghost in a born again believer.

The salvation formula in John 3:5 stands as a testimony of Sola Scripture to what standard of Holiness and righteousness is required of a justified Christian.

When we were justified by blood, we walked as prisoners of Christ under the arbitrator of sanctification, the Holy Ghost and if we don't get cleansed in the heart of flesh by him, then our choice would have been that of disobedience and for that matter no disobedient Christian will enter the Kingdom unless they are determined to have being conformed to the law of Christ. As Jesus said.....

Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them." (John 14:21).

The problem is, you don't understand Pauls message. That is why you cannot endorse what i quoted. And yet, it is the basis of Pauls message of grace.
To your rational mind, what I quoted is tantamount to a licence to sin. Paul knew it wasn't, or he wouldn't have repeatedly stated it The message is spiritual, and can only be understood through the Spirits enlightenment

 

[stuart lawrence]

Which particular law is Paul speaking of in rom 7:4-6?
In the next five verses he gives a personal example from his own life as to why he had to die to the law. the example he gave was: Thou shalt not covet. One of the TC

 

[The Times]

The problem is, you don't understand Pauls message. That is why you cannot endorse what i quoted. And yet, it is the basis of Pauls message of grace.
To your rational mind, what I quoted is tantamount to a licence to sin. Paul knew it wasn't, or he wouldn't have repeatedly stated it The message is spiritual, and can only be understood through the Spirits enlightenment

Without the evidence of sanctifying works of the Holy Ghost in a justified believer, then God determines according to his standards which justified Christian is either in or out.

The fact remains that Sola Scripture is a benchmark to expose the subtlety of the serpent, who tries to mirror Christ's righteousness and Holiness through another gospel of justification and euphoria.

Reverent fear is not present in this equation. If I can pull you up on what you stated in your previous post, that fear brings the heart to an excited state of sinning whenever the Law is imposed. So by your reasoning reverent fear of God should not be part of faith.

So let me ask you, do you live your life having a reverent fear of God

A yes or a no is all that is needed.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Without the evidence of sanctifying works of the Holy Ghost in a justified believer, then God determines according to his standards which justified Christian is either in or out.

The fact remains that Sola Scripture is a benchmark to expose the subtlety of the serpent, who tries to mirror Christ's righteousness and Holiness through another gospel of justification and euphoria.

Reverent fear is not present in this equation. If I can pull you up on what you stated in your previous post, that fear brings the heart to an excited state of sinning whenever the Law is imposed. So by your reasoning reverent fear of God should not be part of faith.

So let me ask you, do you live your life work reverent fear of God

A yes or a no is all that is needed.

You don't stand on sola scripture. It is quite clear from your posts you believe in righteousness of observing the law. You are in direct opposition of Pauls core gospel message. And he was chosen to be the chief exponent of the NC to the world.
I am being utterly honest here. Your opinions are the stereotypical opinions of the average person I have known who earnestly states the Bible is infallible and it must be fully followed
But it isn't fully followed.

 

[The Times]

Which particular law is Paul speaking of in rom 7:4-6?
In the next five verses he gives a personal example from his own life as to why he had to die to the law. the example he gave was: Thou shalt not covet. One of the TC

Paul is still affirming the obedience to the law, through the newness of the Spirit within the heart of flesh. The laws don't change, they become applied through the heart and mind. Just like Jesus said You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

The letter of the law applied externally to be seen of men to be doing the right and lawful thing is now applied internally in the heart of flesh, with the goal posts moved higher, as God now expects more from us believers. The OT believers had to simply follow externally what was required to be seen, however their heart remained a heart of stone, that was absent from the sanctifying works of the Holy Ghost.

The application of the law as Paul writes in Romans 7:6, that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

So the law still is applied, however differently. As Jesus said if you hate on your brother, you have already committed murder. To the Holy God it is a THOUGHT CRIME before even manifesting into the world.

God now applies his laws to our very thoughts and the Holy Ghost administers his role to change us inwardly, that is the inward man. That is why Paul states....

Romans 7:22
For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

 

[stuart lawrence]

Paul is still affirming the obedience to the law, through the newness of the Spirit within the heart of flesh. The laws don't change, they become applied through the heart and mind. Just like Jesus said You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

The letter of the law applied externally to be seen of men to be doing the right and lawful thing is now applied internally in the heart of flesh, with the goal posts higher, as God now expects more from us believers. The OT believers had to simply follow externally what was required to be seen, however their heart remained a heart of stone, that was absent from the sanctifying works of the Holy Ghost.

The application of the law as Paul writes in Romans 7:6, that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

So the law still is applied, however differently. As Jesus said if you hate on your brother, you have already committed murder. To the Holy God it is a THOUGHT CRIME before even manifesting into the world.

God now applies his laws to our very thoughts and the Holy Ghost administers his role to change us inwardly, that is the inward man. That is why Paul states....

Romans 7:22
For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

So you believe heaven hinges on obeying the letter of the law. Frankly, I'm grateful you just openly come out and state that. Others are more subtle

 

[The Times]

I understand Roman 7 entirely because Paul instructs believers to abide by the law in the newness of the Spirit to....
then delight in the law of God after the inward man:

 

[stuart lawrence]

I understand Roman 7 entirely because Paul instructs believers to abide by the law in the newness of the Spirit to....
then delight in the law of God after the inward man:

My friend, you do not understand rom ch7

 

[stuart lawrence]

I understand Roman 7 entirely because Paul instructs believers to abide by the law in the newness of the Spirit to....
then delight in the law of God after the inward man:

Quote where the Holy Spirit is mentioned in rom ch7 from verse 7 onwards.

 

[The Times]

So you believe heaven hinges on obeying the letter of the law. Frankly, I'm grateful you just openly come out and state that. Others are more subtle

Heaven hinges on whether a person commits THOUGHT CRIMES, which God tests by the letter of his unchangable law.

Here are examples of the inward man's thought crimes......

The Fulfillment of the Law

17“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.19Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Murder

21“You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder,a and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ 22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sisterb c will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’d is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

23“Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, 24leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift.

25“Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison.26Truly I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.

Adultery

27“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’e28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

Divorce

31“It has been said, ‘Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce.’f 32But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, makes her the victim of adultery, and anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Oaths

33“Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not break your oath, but fulfill to the Lord the vows you have made.’ 34But I tell you, do not swear an oath at all: either by heaven, for it is God’s throne; 35or by the earth, for it is his footstool; or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the Great King. 36And do not swear by your head, for you cannot make even one hair white or black. 37All you need to say is simply ‘Yes’ or ‘No’; anything beyond this comes from the evil one.g

Eye for Eye

38“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’h39But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. 42Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.

Love for Enemies

43“You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbori and hate your enemy.’ 44But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

 

[The Times]

My friend, you do not understand rom ch7

I beg to differ. I think that other brothers and sisters can weigh in on the matter and have their say.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Heaven hinges on whether a person commits THOUGHT CRIMES, which God tests by the letter of his unchangable law.

Here are examples of the inward man's thought crimes......

The Fulfillment of the Law

17“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.19Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Murder

21“You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder,a and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ 22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sisterb c will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’d is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

23“Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, 24leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift.

25“Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison.26Truly I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.

Adultery

27“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’e28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

Divorce

31“It has been said, ‘Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce.’f 32But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, makes her the victim of adultery, and anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Oaths

33“Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not break your oath, but fulfill to the Lord the vows you have made.’ 34But I tell you, do not swear an oath at all: either by heaven, for it is God’s throne; 35or by the earth, for it is his footstool; or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the Great King. 36And do not swear by your head, for you cannot make even one hair white or black. 37All you need to say is simply ‘Yes’ or ‘No’; anything beyond this comes from the evil one.g

Eye for Eye

38“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’h39But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. 42Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.

Love for Enemies

43“You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbori and hate your enemy.’ 44But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Jesus told the disciples there was much more he wanted to teach them, more than they could now bear, but when the Spirit if truth was sent, he would lead them into all truth( John ch16)
Therefore, according to Jesus own words he was limited as to what he could teach the disciples.
The Holy Spirit had been received by the Apostles, and they wrote to people who had received the Spirit also

 

[stuart lawrence]

I beg to differ. I think that other brothers and sisters can weigh in on the matter and have their say.

Absolutely.
Please quote where the Holy Spirit is mentioned in rom ch7 from verse 7 onwards

 

[The Times]

Quote where the Holy Spirit is mentioned in rom ch7 from verse 7 onwards.

Continuity and context. Paul didn't write his letter to the Romans in Chapters, he wrote on a continuous scroll as follows.....

Romans 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

His conclusion in the above verse, sums up what he said in Romans 7.

Thankyou!