Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
There's a difference.
In the Old Testament, there wasn't talk of any sort of afterlife punishment or the like, and all punishment was strictly for this life.
The trouble with these websites is. People will reason anything, deflect any way they have to in order to cling to the beliefs they came here with.
Most of the tine it I just a scripture quoting contest. As those who come here are well versed in doing that, what I actually achieved? Nothing, but passing away a pleasurable pastime I guess ,, for those who like to quote scripture to others
Hence you using desperate measures to try and get out of an impossible situation.Which is why having this sort of post #94 where you can see all the efforts to sidestep -- yet the focus is not lost and the answer finally does come through obvious for all objective unbiased readers to see clearly!
It is perfect!
hence the benefit of #94 where it all is revealed -- all the back and forth and finally the 'answer'
Not quite. Enoch taken directly to heaven.
Elijah taken directly to heaven.
Moses and Elijah appear in glory - with Christ in Matt 17 before the cross.
The "New Heaven" and New Earth of Rev 21 mentioned in Isaiah 66:23 and the list is even longer.
Hence you using desperate measures to try and get out of an impossible situation.
You say Catholics pray to the dead.
They don't believe they do.
You say they worship graven images, they say they don't.
That passage in Isaiah never says it refers to the New Heaven and New Earth,
It was written in code - using the language of the OT text that Bible based Christians would understand - but Romans would not.and Revelation was written specifically for the church leaders of the time.
And as for those mentions of Elijah being taken directly to heaven, notice that there's no mention of the possibility of eternal punishment for anyone in the Old Testament. That's a New Testament thing.
Catholics believe the dead/ departed are alive in heaven. Nor do they believe they worship statues. I am afraid it is just a desperate attempt by you to deflect from the spiritual truth I showed you.Totally false - as we both know.
I am using the same rule for "do not make images or bow down or serve them" as for "Remember the Sabbath" and we both know it.
It is you that use different rules for one vs the other... and we both know it.
Paul says "The DEAD in Christ rise first". in 1Thess 4 -- Catholics freely admit to that.
The CCC
"958 Communion with the dead. "In full consciousness of this communion of the whole Mystical Body of Jesus Christ, the Church in its pilgrim members, from the very earliest days of the Christian religion, has honored with great respect the memory of the dead; and 'because it is a holy and a wholesome thought to pray for the dead that they may be loosed from their sins' she offers her suffrages for them."500 Our prayer for them is capable not only of helping them, but also of making their intercession for us effective. "
How many times do I need to quote CCC 958 on this point??
In any case -- it is you who said you would not accept anyone as Christian that bowed down to ... and promised to serve those represented by ... an image in church. By contrast - I flatly rejected your idea.
You are quoting "you" not me. I say they are bowing down before... and promising to serve .. those that the image represents.
you said that you would not accept a person as being Christian who did that.
I said that I would not join you in that aspect.
your idea is now fully exposed - it is you that make one rule for one commandment and another rule for Sabbath.
I treat them both alike - as does my entire denomination and in fact many Protestants join us in not condemning as "non Christian" those who bow down before...and promise to serve those being represented by... images in church.
And we both know it.
And they don't do that because they are trying to come up with some special rule for Sabbath breaking -- and we both know it.
What is more - you knew all of this when you started your question. it is you that makes different rules for different commandments and it is me that has the same rule and does not condemn as "non-Christian" those who differ with me.
in Christ,
Bob
The idea that Christ's teaching does not apply to the NEW Covenant - is news to most Christians.
.
So by your interpretation of scripture Jesus's words before the cross are null and void after the Cross. Using that analogy then there is no second coming as he said this before the new covenant.
Proof that you do not read a post and post anything calling it a reply.Not quite. Enoch taken directly to heaven.
Elijah taken directly to heaven.
Moses and Elijah appear in glory - with Christ in Matt 17 before the cross.
The "New Heaven" and New Earth of Rev 21 mentioned in Isaiah 66:23 and the list is even longer.
You are reading a commentary version of the Bible or you chopped the last two words of the text from your quote. The Greek text includes these two words peri emou. The English is concerning me. Those two words are very important to the meaning of the passage.Hello HC.
Jesus fulfilled all things in the law and the prophets, not some things!
Luke 24:44
Now He said to them, “These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.”
YEPJohn 19:28
After this, Jesus, knowing that all things had already been accomplished, to fulfill the Scripture, said, “I am thirsty.”
So you continue to try and show every one obeys at least some of the law at least by incidence whether or not they intend to trying to enforce your version of sabbath.So now I answered your question.
If I commit adultery as a lifestyle, would you accept me as a christian if I professed to be one?
If I was a habitual thief, would you accept me as a christian if I professed to be one?
If i constantly watched pornographic films, would you accept me as a christian if I professed to be one?
If I constantly bore false witness, would you accept me as a christian if I confessed to be one?
If I constantly committed murder, would you accept me as a christian if I confessed to be one?
If I did not observe a set seventh day Sabbath, would you accept me as a christian if I professed to be one?
Specific questions That should easily be answered, without deflection!
No because the NT is not about the law. The law including the 10 Cs has no jurisdiction over the Christian per the Gospels of John and Luke not mention Romans, Galatians and II Cor.In the NT 'The wages of sin is death' Romans 6:23
In the NT "sin IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4
agreed?
Hello BugKiller.You are reading a commentary version of the Bible or you chopped the last two words of the text from your quote. The Greek text includes these two words peri emou. The English is concerning me. Those two words are very important to the meaning of the passage.YEP
bugkiller
Do we then nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather we uphold the law rom3:31No because the NT is not about the law.
bugkiller
Sin is still the transgression of the law in the NT="bugkiller, post: 71046810, member: 376777"]So you continue to try and show every one obeys at least some of the law at least by incidence whether or not they intend to trying to enforce your version of sabbath.
No deal for me.
bugkiller
Hello Stuart.Do we then nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather we uphold the law rom3:31
That does not prove the OT teaches anything about eternal life.Not quite. Enoch taken directly to heaven.
Elijah taken directly to heaven.
Moses and Elijah appear in glory - with Christ in Matt 17 before the cross.
The "New Heaven" and New Earth of Rev 21 mentioned in Isaiah 66:23 and the list is even longer.
Hello Stuart.
We uphold the law but we are not under the law.
Galatians 5:18
But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.
The law is "that which is done away"; not merely the ceremonial law, or the judicial law, but the whole ministry of Moses, and particularly the law of the Decalogue
The law is done away, but the gospel does and shall remain, 2Co_3:11. Not only did the glory of Moses's face go away, but the glory of Moses's law is done away also; yea, the law of Moses itself is now abolished. That dispensation was only to continue for a time, and then to vanish away; whereas the gospel shall remain to the end of the world, and is always fresh and flourishing and remains glorious.
The splendor that attended the giving of the Law; the bright shining of the face of Moses; and the ritual institutions of his religion. It was to be done away. It was never designed to be permanent. Everything in it had a transient existence, and was so designed.
Yep the ROMANS were very stupid. Just maybe that is why they have been in so much control over religious matters for many centuries.Indeed it does refer to the New heavens and NEW Earth.
22 “For just as the New Heavens and the New Earth
Which I make will endure before Me,” declares the Lord,
“So your offspring and your name will endure.
23 “And it shall be from new moon to new moon
And from sabbath to sabbath,
All mankind will come to bow down before Me,” says the Lord.
Rev 21:1
Then I saw a New heaven and a New earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and there is no longer any sea. 2 And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. 3
It was written in code - using the language of the OT text that Bible based Christians would understand - but Romans would not.
HelloHello Stuart.
We uphold the law but we are not under the law.
Galatians 5:18
But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?