Does anyone else ever feel somewhat alienated and or isolated from their fellow christian brothers and sisters because of the whole creation/evolution thing? I cannot be intellectually honest to myself and what i understand to be true, using my God given sense and mind and for a mintute believe the YEC interpretation. I even think that some discourse on this forum has shown that the YEC interpretation is possibly unscriptural. All the same, most of the fellow christians i know are YEC, and when they start talking about evolution and all the things it isnt, i cringe and yet usually just keep quiet or try and tip toe around it because i want to avoid the arguments, puzzled looks...whatever. It makes me into somewhat of a misfit or outsider. It can actually be a little depressing at times. Does anyone else ever have this problem? Any advice?
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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
It can be a lonely life
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MattLangley
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Yes. It especially is hard when talking to family who are creationists and trying to avoid that topic since you know you have differing views.
I grew up very conservative, in fact my dad was a southern baptist pastor. I was still pretty conservative when I realized that being a YEC made no sense at all. I was into my adulthood already too. At first that created an issue in and of itself that separated me from my upbringing (including my parents, though they have loosened up a bit, when I talk with them on the phone I try to skirt some religious topics while still wanting to talk about others). I am now very liberal if I were to describe myself in a Christian comparative way. Obviously I don't think of myself as "liberal" and of course we all think we know a more accurate way of looking at things, so I simply feel I have found a more accurate way. Though I am very liberal on the spectrum of conservative to liberal. So now I have many different points of view between my family and me, with plenty of shared though. I am very much a Christian but I no longer believe much of what my upbringing infused into me.
This is a very common thing for people to face though. My wife grew up in Utah as a Mormon. She now isn't, though it was a long journey for her. To go against something that you were raised to believe with absolute truth is very challenging. It also leaves you on the other side of a battle against those you used to stand with. Now we of course don't like to think of it as a battle, but often the more conservative (or Creationist) side typically likes to make it so. So to cope, it is very common to hide from it and that can make us feel bad, like you say. I don't think hiding from ourselves is ever a good thing, though we all do it at times.
What I've found is that with YEC friends your first stand usually is the toughest. Once they realize that you do have conviction in your thoughts and if you can reach a point where you agree to disagree, then it gets a lot better. Then if they talk about creationism you can simply express that you disagree and you both simply respect your viewpoints.
This comes down to the cooperation of people who have conflicting beliefs. We like to think this doesn't happen within Christianity, but obviously it does. It's also a perfect example of how we should be able to cooperate with people of other beliefs, even if they conflict.
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Indeed it can be lonely, Gus. But it doesn't have to be. There are many evolutionary creationists in the world -- it may just be a matter of connecting with them. Coming here is a good start. Be sure to check out the American Scientific Affiliation, too.
I know how hard it is to be alienated by the YEC community. I was refused communion by my own church once my pastor learned that I subscribed to evolution.
I know how hard it is to be alienated by the YEC community. I was refused communion by my own church once my pastor learned that I subscribed to evolution.
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I have not experienced (in the real world) any particular ostracization due to my beliefs, but I generally don't volunteer or push it on anyone. As a geologist, which many people in my church know I am, I have never been openly challenged on anything about an old earth or evolution.
In fact I never realized the depth of disdain that some hold for it until I joined another forum a couple years ago. It is disheartening though when people question your salvation over these matters.
In fact I never realized the depth of disdain that some hold for it until I joined another forum a couple years ago. It is disheartening though when people question your salvation over these matters.
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I know how you feel, to an extent. I was first converted to Christ through the ministry of an Open Brethren assembly, in which YECism is the standard assumption, and for a time (probably close to five or so years), I believed and argued that the universe was created in six days 6000 years ago. Even through my first year of a science degree I continued to argue this position, but it was inevitable that as I became more familiar with evolutionary theory - which was an essential component of my ecology major - that I would eventually reject YECism and its assumptions.
I have since moved on somewhat from the doctrines and interpretations held by most Brethren, and have settled nicely into a traditional Anglican parish community. But I have maintained contact with my friends and fellow-believers in the Brethren, and still join with them in bible study and prayer; at times the topic of Cre-Evo comes up, and I am certainly in a minority position amongst this group, but they know what I believe, and accept my fellowship despite the strength of their disagreement with my position. To most of them, "theistic evolution" brings to mind the image of a woolly-minded liberal as envisioned by the likes of Ken Ham and AiG; some of them didn't even know someone could be Christian and accept evolution, so my presence among them can only be of educational value. I do feel alienated at times - not just by my evolutionism, but to an equal (and sometimes greater) extent by my Anglo-Catholic leanings
- but I've never really been one to care much about what others have thought about me or my beliefs... I've never been able to accept things at face value, and tend to question my beliefs and assumptions, and am usually comfortable taking the minority position in a group.
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No I don't feel lonely. I love my church and particularly my small group and I'm almost the only evolutionist and I know there are many who reject evolution. However, when the Christian message is understood properly I think there is a tremendous unity among the church family that makes evolution/creation differences look pathetic. To cling to those differences, either to ostracise one person from the whole or for one to gain a superiority over the whole is to miss the message of Christ.
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lawtonfogle
My solace my terror, my terror my solace.
Make sure you truly understand evolution. Don't ever put faith in it, or in any science. You can say 'I am not able to judge it now because I do not know enough', but never say 'it must be true because someone else says so'. Once you know evolution, start to disagree when they talk. Never disagree in groups though, only in one on one or two on one size, else they will just over run you. Be prepared to encounter stupidity of amazing types (I knew one guy who ended up saying the theory of gravity is false and gravity only works on clouds when it rains). Slowly get them to just start questioning. If you do that much, then you have done your part.
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Son of My right hand
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I didn't even know there was a name for what I believe until tonight. I've spent my entire life knowing only one other person who didn't see evolution as anti-Christian. I married her. Thank you everyone for being here. May God bless you.
Oh, and I hope that you are encouraged, Gus, as I am.
Oh, and I hope that you are encouraged, Gus, as I am.
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nasa1
Looking for those who love God and His creation
You have to be strong and believe what you know is right. There are popular evangelicals that believe the earth is billions of years old. If you want to bolster your argument, name drop a little. But dont feel alienated. The bible shows us from the very beginning that the earth was restored. It had been here a very long time and was restored by God.
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Darkness27
Junior Member
I have a similar problem, most of the Christians I know personally subscribe to YEC and are theologically conservative while I would say I am theologically liberal and a theistic evolutionist. Sometimes I feel that there are two sides; YEC and atheism, and by siding with evolution I have turned my back on Christ. After researching the Jewish stance on evolution (thinking that since they actually wrote Genesis they will know if evolution is compatible) and talking to my pastor and retired pastor I soon learned that YEC is not the only interpretation, and in some cases I've been hinted that it isn't scripturally sound. In any case the cre-evo debate isn't what Christianity is about. Christianity is supposed to unite us, not divide us. Even when I am doing a Bible study, or prayer session, with YEC's I still feel connected to them in Christ, and the cre-evo debate no longer matters, only Christ does.
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