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Israel-Hamas Thread II

Valletta

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I rate MSNBC, CNN, NBC, ABC, CBS, Hamas, and the New York Times as being extremely biased. Should we dismiss all articles from those sources?
Instead of shooting the messenger, see if you can find something to show the story is not accurate.
 
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DaisyDay

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Actual videos from the ground in Gaza are getting out, don't rely on the major media:

I'm sorry, but do you seriously think the Black Market goes away in war zones?
 
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Valletta

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I'm sorry, but do you seriously think the Black Market goes away in war zones?
You're talking to the wrong person, obviously the vendors received the food from someone, Hamas looters or just looters. Also there is no sight of huge crowds clamoring for food. As I've said, the way to end this is to quickly defeat Hamas.
 
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DaisyDay

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You're talking to the wrong person, obviously the vendors received the food from someone, Hamas looters or just looters. Also there is no sight of huge crowds clamoring for food. As I've said, the way to end this is to quickly defeat Hamas.
More likely, it will create a new generation of Hamas sympathizers. The window for "quickly" is long gone.
 
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Valletta

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DaisyDay

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Not completely defeating Hamas will create more jihadists.
Blood thirsty and short sighted thinking. Besides being inhumane killing off the people will create more what you refer to as “jihadists”.
 
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JosephZ

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Not completely defeating Hamas will create more jihadists.
It's too late; the next generation of terrorists and terrorist sympathizers has already been born as a result of this current conflict, and their numbers will be huge. There's also a good chance that the next generation of terrorists will be even more radical and determined to destroy Israel than Hamas currently is.
 
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essentialsaltes

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The result, according to a global initiative that tracks food insecurity, is “imminent” famine for parts of Gaza. The Integrated Food Security Phase Classification, or IPC, said in a report this month that all of Gaza’s 2.3 million people face high levels of acute food insecurity.

“The situation in Gaza is catastrophic,” said the report. “Famine is projected and imminent in the northern governates and there is a risk of Famine across the rest of the Gaza Strip.”

Israel has said reports of hunger in Gaza are exaggerations.

“As much as we know, by our analysis, there is no starvation in Gaza,” Col. Moshe Tetro, the head of the Coordination and Liaison Administration for Gaza, told reporters at a crossing point recently “There is sufficient amount of food entering Gaza every day.”

In northern Gaza, the IPC report noted, people have been scavenging from destroyed buildings and eating animal feed, but even those resources are running out. Much of the agricultural land is damaged, along with the infrastructure required to cultivate crops.

With only two entry points, both in the south, trucks have to traverse miles of rubble-filled landscape.

The problem is compounded because aid groups, especially the United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East, known as UNRWA, have had their movements restricted by Israel and their facilities and staff hit in the fighting.

Since Oct. 7, 171 agency workers have been killed in Israeli bombardment, an average of one a day, the agency says, and more than 160 of its facilities have been struck, including warehouses and distribution centers, Touma said.

UNRWA head Philippe Lazzarini said this week in a post on X that Israel told the agency its convoys would no longer be allowed to travel into the north of the Gaza Strip.
 
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Valletta

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It's too late; the next generation of terrorists and terrorist sympathizers has already been born as a result of this current conflict, and their numbers will be huge. There's also a good chance that the next generation of terrorists will be even more radical and determined to destroy Israel than Hamas currently is.
They are hardly the first to think they can conquer the world forever. All of them did such boasting.
 
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Valletta

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Blood thirsty and short sighted thinking. Besides being inhumane killing off the people will create more what you refer to as “jihadists”.
As with the Germans and the Japanese in World War II, the longer it took to defeat them the more lives were lost. A lot of people didn't know the extent of the brutality, the New York Times and the rest of the major media played down or concealed the atrocities.
 
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JosephZ

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It appears that many of the "terrorists" the IDF claims it has killed have been innocent civilians.

Israel Created 'Kill Zones' in Gaza. Anyone Who Crosses Into Them Is Shot

The Israeli army says 9,000 terrorists have been killed since the Gaza war began. Defense officials and soldiers, however, tell Haaretz that these are often civilians whose only crime was to cross an invisible line drawn by the IDF

The number of dead Gazans is now estimated to be over 32,000. According to the army, some 9,000 of these are terrorists.

However, a host of reserve and standing army commanders who have talked to Haaretz cast doubt on the claim that all of these were terrorists. They imply that the definition of terrorist is open to a wide range of interpretation. It's quite possible that Palestinians who never held a gun in their lives were elevated to the rank of "terrorist" posthumously, at least by the IDF.

"In practice, a terrorist is anyone the IDF has killed in the areas in which its forces operate," says a reserve officer who has served in Gaza.

The army's figures are no secret. On the contrary, over time they have become a source of pride, perhaps the closest thing to a "victory image" Israel has achieved since the war began. But this image, says a senior officer in Southern Command who is very familiar with the issue, is not quite authentic.

"It's astonishing to hear the reports after every operation, regarding how many terrorists were killed," he says, explaining: "You don't need to be a genius to realize that you don't have hundreds or dozens of armed men running through the streets of Khan Yunis or Jabaliya, fighting the IDF."

So, what do the battles in Gaza really look like? According to a reserve officer who was there, "usually there is a terrorist, maybe two or three, hiding inside a building.

One of the roles of this officer was to inform senior echelons of the number of terrorists killed in the area he and his men were fighting in. "This wasn't an official debriefing where they want you to produce all the bodies," he explains. "They ask you how many and I give a number based on what we see and understand on the ground, and we move on."

He emphasizes that "it's not that we invent bodies, but no one can determine with certainty who is a terrorist and who was hit after entering the combat zone of an IDF force." Indeed, a number of reservists and other soldiers who were in Gaza in recent months point to the ease with which a Palestinian is included in a specific category after his death. It seems that the question is not what he did but where he was killed.

The combat zone is a key term. This is an area in which a force sets itself up, usually in an abandoned house, with the area surrounding it becoming a closed military area, but with no clear marking as such. Another term for such areas is "kill zones."

"As soon as people enter it, mainly adult males, orders are to shoot and kill, even if that person is unarmed," says the reserve officer


 
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Valletta

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It appears that many of the "terrorists" the IDF claims it has killed have been innocent civilians.

Israel Created 'Kill Zones' in Gaza. Anyone Who Crosses Into Them Is Shot

The Israeli army says 9,000 terrorists have been killed since the Gaza war began. Defense officials and soldiers, however, tell Haaretz that these are often civilians whose only crime was to cross an invisible line drawn by the IDF

The number of dead Gazans is now estimated to be over 32,000. According to the army, some 9,000 of these are terrorists.

However, a host of reserve and standing army commanders who have talked to Haaretz cast doubt on the claim that all of these were terrorists. They imply that the definition of terrorist is open to a wide range of interpretation. It's quite possible that Palestinians who never held a gun in their lives were elevated to the rank of "terrorist" posthumously, at least by the IDF.

"In practice, a terrorist is anyone the IDF has killed in the areas in which its forces operate," says a reserve officer who has served in Gaza.

The army's figures are no secret. On the contrary, over time they have become a source of pride, perhaps the closest thing to a "victory image" Israel has achieved since the war began. But this image, says a senior officer in Southern Command who is very familiar with the issue, is not quite authentic.

"It's astonishing to hear the reports after every operation, regarding how many terrorists were killed," he says, explaining: "You don't need to be a genius to realize that you don't have hundreds or dozens of armed men running through the streets of Khan Yunis or Jabaliya, fighting the IDF."

So, what do the battles in Gaza really look like? According to a reserve officer who was there, "usually there is a terrorist, maybe two or three, hiding inside a building.

One of the roles of this officer was to inform senior echelons of the number of terrorists killed in the area he and his men were fighting in. "This wasn't an official debriefing where they want you to produce all the bodies," he explains. "They ask you how many and I give a number based on what we see and understand on the ground, and we move on."

He emphasizes that "it's not that we invent bodies, but no one can determine with certainty who is a terrorist and who was hit after entering the combat zone of an IDF force." Indeed, a number of reservists and other soldiers who were in Gaza in recent months point to the ease with which a Palestinian is included in a specific category after his death. It seems that the question is not what he did but where he was killed.

The combat zone is a key term. This is an area in which a force sets itself up, usually in an abandoned house, with the area surrounding it becoming a closed military area, but with no clear marking as such. Another term for such areas is "kill zones."

"As soon as people enter it, mainly adult males, orders are to shoot and kill, even if that person is unarmed," says the reserve officer


It in no way appears that way to me. You're posting Hamas propaganda. Hamas continues to turn down deals offered by the United States and won't release hostages.
 
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Valletta

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"Let me be clear," Harris said. "A ceasefire means to cease your firing. And if firing does not cease, then it is not a ceasefire. If firing continues, then it has not ceased. You have not ceased to fire and therefore have not agreed to a ceasefire. War is firing. Peace is not firing. If you do not fire, you will have peace, and peace is the absence of war."

Enjoy
 
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DaisyDay

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"Let me be clear," Harris said. "A ceasefire means to cease your firing. And if firing does not cease, then it is not a ceasefire. If firing continues, then it has not ceased. You have not ceased to fire and therefore have not agreed to a ceasefire. War is firing. Peace is not firing. If you do not fire, you will have peace, and peace is the absence of war."

I think those words speak for themselves.
Babylon Bee? Parody.
 
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Valletta

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“I think the Biden administration and Democrats need to change their tune. They voted against Israel aid. America didn’t even stand up for Israel at the U.N. resolution,” Scott added. “This is disgusting what the Biden administration is doing. Support Israel. They’ve got to kill Hamas. They will never get the country back.”
 
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Valletta

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"According to polls, some 75% of Israelis support a Rafah operation and the total defeat of Hamas. Former President Donald Trump, Democratic Senator John Fetterman, the vast majority of Republican senators and an overall majority of Congress members agree.
Israel should follow the will of its people and its genuine supporters. It must also remember that, if it achieves total victory, a perfidious world will eventually thank Israel for it."
 
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JosephZ

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Israeli troops exit Gaza's Shifa Hospital, leaving rubble and bodies

al shifa hospital.jpg


 
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