Is the United States of America in Bible Prophecy?

[OhhJim]

I am not the rich young ruler of Matthew 19. Just because Jesus commands one thing of one person, doesn't mean He commands the same thing of all His followers. Your contention that the Holy Ghost is saying it is not entirely true. Jesus is speaking. I don't know why you are invoking the Holy Ghost.

Jesus gave many commands in His lifetime, to many different people. If you want to claim them as your own, that is up to you. I would not tell a Christian brother how he is to live his life. I would, however, point out some other commands Jesus gave:

John 21:6 And He said to them, "Cast the net on the right-hand side of the boat". Have you cast a net on the right-hand side of your boat, brother daniel?

John 2:7 Jesus said to them, "Fill the waterpots with water". Have you done this?

John 11:43 ...He cried out with a loud voice, "Lazarus, come forth". Do you expect to be raised after you die? (Before the resurrection, of course.)

You can see how silly it would be to take the command of Jesus to one or ten specific people, and apply it to all. Jesus didn't command Caiphus to sell his goods and give to the poor, because that's not what Caiphus needed to do at that point. He didn't command the money-changers in the temple to do that. He didn't command Mary & Martha to do it. He didn't command Zaccheus.

I submit that God has a different plan for different believers. Paul clearly teaches that we have different gifts, and are to use those gifts for the benefit of the church. 1 Cor. 12: 5&6 says, and there are differences of ministries, yet the same Lord.
And there are differences of workings, but the same God is working all things in all.
How can we all use our different gifts, if we are all to act the same?

 

[brother daniel]

I am not the rich young ruler of Matthew 19. Just because Jesus commands one thing of one person, doesn't mean He commands the same thing of all His followers. Your contention that the Holy Ghost is saying it is not entirely true. Jesus is speaking. I don't know why you are invoking the Holy Ghost.

?

Because there is evidence that you need to be baptised in the Holy Ghost

And remember this thread is based on the question is the United States of America in Biblical prophecy.

Jesus gave many commands in His lifetime, to many different people. If you want to claim them as your own, that is up to you. I would not tell a Christian brother how he is to live his life. I would, however, point out some other commands Jesus gave:

I am not telling you how to live your life. Jesus is, if you listen to him. He is giving the same message to all of us otherwise we cannot be of one mind and one accord.

You seem to enjoy being contentus and thats not our custom.

John 21:6 And He said to them, "Cast the net on the right-hand side of the boat". Have you cast a net on the right-hand side of your boat, brother daniel?

John 2:7 Jesus said to them, "Fill the waterpots with water". Have you done this?

John 11:43 ...He cried out with a loud voice, "Lazarus, come forth". Do you expect to be raised after you die? (Before the resurrection, of course.)

You can see how silly it would be to take the command of Jesus to one or ten specific people, and apply it to all. Jesus didn't command Caiphus to sell his goods and give to the poor, because that's not what Caiphus needed to do at that point. He didn't command the money-changers in the temple to do that. He didn't command Mary & Martha to do it. He didn't command Zaccheus.

He gave the same message to all. Every day for three years.

LUKE 12:33
Sell that ye have, and give alms; provide yourselves with bags that waxnot old, a treasure in the heavens that faileth not, where no thief approcheth, neither moth corrupteth.

Luke 14:26
If any man come to me and hate not his father, and mother, and wife and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot by my disciple.

V, 33
So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.


120 people actually did it,men and women including Mary the mother of Jesus were of one accord. as we see in acts 1:13-15

I
I submit that God has a different plan for different believers. Paul clearly teaches that we have different gifts, and are to use those gifts for the benefit of the church. 1 Cor. 12: 5&6 says, and there are differences of ministries, yet the same Lord.
And there are differences of workings, but the same God is working all things in all.
How can we all use our different gifts, if we are all to act the same?

There is no doubt that God has a differant plane for every believer but its based on the same gospel foundation which you like many appear to deny.

Those 120 in acts 1:13-15 all had diferant gifts but the same calling and understanding.
We see in Acts 2:41-47 that 3,000 more got and understood the same message.
At best Jim you are very luke warm.

Jesus is urging you to speak the words he spoke and stop making excuses.

You sound like a nice guy but you dont sound like you agree with Jesus.

I am not your judge but your words dont ring true.

Your position seems like one of very little faith and thats common in the United States today. There has been a great falling away from the gospel truth

With love in Christ
brother daniel

 

[gwynedd1]

Because there is evidence that you need to be baptised in the Holy Ghost

And remember this thread is based on the question is the United States of America in Biblical prophecy.




I am not telling you how to live your life. Jesus is, if you listen to him. He is giving the same message to all of us otherwise we cannot be of one mind and one accord.

You seem to enjoy being contentus and thats not our custom.



He gave the same message to all. Every day for three years.

LUKE 12:33
Sell that ye have, and give alms; provide yourselves with bags that waxnot old, a treasure in the heavens that faileth not, where no thief approcheth, neither moth corrupteth.

Luke 14:26
If any man come to me and hate not his father, and mother, and wife and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot by my disciple.

V, 33
So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.


120 people actually did it,men and women including Mary the mother of Jesus were of one accord. as we see in acts 1:13-15



There is no doubt that God has a differant plane for every believer but its based on the same gospel foundation which you like many appear to deny.

Those 120 in acts 1:13-15 all had diferant gifts but the same calling and understanding.
We see in Acts 2:41-47 that 3,000 more got and understood the same message.
At best Jim you are very luke warm.

Jesus is urging you to speak the words he spoke and stop making excuses.

You sound like a nice guy but you dont sound like you agree with Jesus.

I am not your judge but your words dont ring true.

Your position seems like one of very little faith and thats common in the United States today. There has been a great falling away from the gospel truth

With love in Christ
brother daniel

All those that labor honestly are worthy of their wages but should be humble and generous, especially to those that labor for the Lord.

[18] For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.

One is to work for their own bread and do not give wages to those who will not work but give to those that earn their bread, for even their sakes. Do not worry but work honesty for the day's wages.

[8] Neither did we eat any man's bread for nought; but wrought with labour and travail night and day, that we might not be chargeable to any of you:
[9] Not because we have not power, but to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us.
[10] For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.
[11] For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies.
[12] Now them that are such we command and exhort by our Lord Jesus Christ, that with quietness they work, and eat their own bread.

Do to you neighbor as you do to yourself. If you see a brother and you know that you would need if you were he, then by all means give.

1John
3
[17] But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
[18] My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

 

[Gary777]

Beloved Gary777,
I am a disciple of Jesus Christ and his word tells me to warn other disciples of the deceptions that have crept in among us.

With love in Christ
brother daniel

Sorry, daniel. I actually didn't read your post. I just answered to the title of this thread. I see that my post had a harsh tone. Warn all you want! My bad!

 

[brother daniel]

Sorry, daniel. I actually didn't read your post. I just answered to the title of this thread. I see that my post had a harsh tone. Warn all you want! My bad!

Beloved Garey777,
Since this thread is asking,"Is the United States of America in Biblical prophesy/" My answer is yes.

I see it as the wilderness where faithfull Israel has been sheltered from Satans flood of lies,

But now there has been a great falling away by "Christians" who do wickedly against the COVENENT OF JESUS CHRIST and The president of the United States is the King of the North in Daniel 11.

I see that as important because a lieing deceptive false gospel has flattered American Christians into thinking they dont have be the kind of disciples Jesus calls for.

As far as I can see the time is very short and we are called to redem the time doing what Jesus commanded us to do. Preach and teach his word.

With love in Christ
brother daniel

 

[gwynedd1]

Beloved Garey777,
Since this thread is asking,"Is the United States of America in Biblical prophesy/" My answer is yes.

I see it as the wilderness where faithfull Israel has been sheltered from Satans flood of lies,

But now there has been a great falling away by "Christians" who do wickedly against the COVENENT OF JESUS CHRIST and The president of the United States is the King of the North in Daniel 11.

I see that as important because a lieing deceptive false gospel has flattered American Christians into thinking they dont have be the kind of disciples Jesus calls for.

As far as I can see the time is very short and we are called to redem the time doing what Jesus commanded us to do. Preach and teach his word.

With love in Christ
brother daniel

We agree on much but not here. Who would be the king of the South in such a context? What will be is a world power that will be niether north or south. I believe the US is a waning power and is a stone in the path to the world beast system.

 

[brother daniel]

We agree on much but not here. Who would be the king of the South in such a context? What will be is a world power that will be niether north or south. I believe the US is a waning power and is a stone in the path to the world beast system.

Beloved brother gwynedd,

I see Iraq as king of the south in Daniel 11:11

Daniel 11:19
As I see it George Bush king of the North stumbles and falls.
V.20
The next U.S President will have to be a raiser of taxes.
Yet in a few days he will be destroyed neather in anger nor battle.

V.21 Here I see a vile Rothschild appointed UN/EUROPIAN UNION administrator in charge of U.S. economic assets military and police for the benifit of international creditors.
He will be the king of the North and man of sin
.
The King of the South In Daniel 11:40,
is Iran—at the helm of the Islamic Middle East!

A collition of China and Russia will come against the man of sin.

With love in Christ
brother daniel

 

[WayWord]

I've heard that the phrase on the dollar bill actually is translated, "A New Order for the Ages", not "New World Order". Either way, I don't see how it affects me. Like I've said before, if the Illuminati are running things, I think they're doing a good job. I'd much rather have my life today than the richest American in 1790. Or 1774, or any other date you can name.

If your life is so wonderful, why are you bothering to involve yourself in an eschatology forum? I've read another of your posts where you state your belief that the Son of God won't be returning for another 50 years or so at least. So, why the desire to mock anyone who believes otherwise?

 

[NumberOneSon]

So, why the desire to mock anyone who believes otherwise?

What? When has Jim mocked anyone? He may disagree with interpretations, but he doesn't mock people. I've been here for years and Jim is one of the most civil members on this board. You're way off base with that comment, Wayward. Don't equate disagreement with mockery.

In Christ,

Acts6:5

 

[Gary777]

If your life is so wonderful, why are you bothering to involve yourself in an eschatology forum? I've read another of your posts where you state your belief that the Son of God won't be returning for another 50 years or so at least. So, why the desire to mock anyone who believes otherwise?

Hm, i probably agree with Jim, and can't understand why his or my eschatology is not worthy a forum for eschatology?
I don't think there is any mocking going on, but IMHO, the interpretation of stuff like Dan. 11, that the king of the north is George W. Bush....sort of deserves to be, well not mocked, but heavily questioned.

 

[Covenant Heart]

Eschatology Is, Above All Else…


...Christian theology. As such, we need dogma--doctrine that we can require all to believe in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ. And while taking no pleasure in saying it, much of what passes for “eschatology” is not Christian theology at all. Christian theology does not arise form “what about” questions. What about all these storms, wars, and technological developments? What about that super computer? What about social security numbers, bar codes and computer chips? What about cell phones and bodily implants? What about, what about, what about, what about.

This is all speculation. As such, it forms sub-Christian discourse. These “what about” questions do not lead to anything that we can be required to believe in the Name of the Lord Jesus. And yet this is the stuff of which many “eschatological” fora are made.

The Hebrew prophets spoke out of their own world. Even when making prediction, they kept in view the people to whom they ministered in their time and place. They spoke in terms of the world they knew. That’s the rub. They did not know of the Americans. All attempts to “identify” the United States in Scripture must do so on the basis of analogy. But then we find that analogies also apply to many other times and places. Does this mean that analogies fail? Not at all! Indeed, this is the real point.

In Scriptures are solidly theological writings. We need to think about and to reflect on them theologically. Perhaps this is most apparent in the Revelation. People are forever reading John’s vision a predictive work. As a Christian prophet, John certainly makes predictive statements. But he is also a master of combining images from multiple writers over time into a new, composite picture that serves his theological purpose.

For example: John might combine images of judgment on Egypt, Babylon, Tyre, etc. in his statement about the Roman empire. He may in this way predict judgment on imperial Rome. But this does not mean that it is his intention to say, “this will happen to Rome.” By piling up images in this way, John effectively says, “this is what happens to ANY nation that forsakes God’s ways, oppresses people, practices extortion, discretionary wars and political idolatry. This uses OT Biblical images to make commentary on the Roman empire according to his theological purpose in that time and place.

By extension, this same reasoning applies in our own time. That explains my words earlier on this thread, “whomever the cap of Egypt/Babylon/Rome fits must wear it.”

This allows us to be faithful to the Scriptures. It allows us to apply those Scriptures in an ethical/theological manner in every time and place. And it delivers us from “what about” speculative inquiries that lead no where. Instead, we have a firm word from the Lord. In every time and place, those who walk in these ways are under the judgment of God. Repent! Believe! Change your ways! If not, you will perish. If so, God promises life and forgiveness. All are required to believe these soteriological/eschatological teachings in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ. The Bible is a theological book. Read it as such.

Blessings!
Covenant Heart

 

[brother daniel]

Eschatology Is, Above All Else…


...Christian theology. As such, we need dogma--doctrine that we can require all to believe in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ. And while taking no pleasure in saying it, much of what passes for “eschatology” is not Christian theology at all. Christian theology does not arise form “what about” questions. What about all these storms, wars, and technological developments? What about that super computer? What about social security numbers, bar codes and computer chips? What about cell phones and bodily implants? What about, what about, what about, what about.

This is all speculation. As such, it forms sub-Christian discourse. These “what about” questions do not lead to anything that we can be required to believe in the Name of the Lord Jesus. And yet this is the stuff of which many “eschatological” fora are made.

The Hebrew prophets spoke out of their own world. Even when making prediction, they kept in view the people to whom they ministered in their time and place. They spoke in terms of the world they knew. That’s the rub. They did not know of the Americans. All attempts to “identify” the United States in Scripture must do so on the basis of analogy. But then we find that analogies also apply to many other times and places. Does this mean that analogies fail? Not at all! Indeed, this is the real point.

In Scriptures are solidly theological writings. We need to think about and to reflect on them theologically. Perhaps this is most apparent in the Revelation. People are forever reading John’s vision a predictive work. As a Christian prophet, John certainly makes predictive statements. But he is also a master of combining images from multiple writers over time into a new, composite picture that serves his theological purpose.

For example: John might combine images of judgment on Egypt, Babylon, Tyre, etc. in his statement about the Roman empire. He may in this way predict judgment on imperial Rome. But this does not mean that it is his intention to say, “this will happen to Rome.” By piling up images in this way, John effectively says, “this is what happens to ANY nation that forsakes God’s ways, oppresses people, practices extortion, discretionary wars and political idolatry. This uses OT Biblical images to make commentary on the Roman empire according to his theological purpose in that time and place.

By extension, this same reasoning applies in our own time. That explains my words earlier on this thread, “whomever the cap of Egypt/Babylon/Rome fits must wear it.”

This allows us to be faithful to the Scriptures. It allows us to apply those Scriptures in an ethical/theological manner in every time and place. And it delivers us from “what about” speculative inquiries that lead no where. Instead, we have a firm word from the Lord. In every time and place, those who walk in these ways are under the judgment of God. Repent! Believe! Change your ways! If not, you will perish. If so, God promises life and forgiveness. All are required to believe these soteriological/eschatological teachings in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ. The Bible is a theological book. Read it as such.

Blessings!
Covenant Heart

Bless you Covenent Heart
Thank you for your clear words of understanding.
With love in Christ
brother daniel

 

[Sunny1]

America; or, "the little horn" which waxed exceeding great into "Mighty Babylon", is at the very center of ALL end-time Bible prophecy.

It's the nation which "cut of Christ", and "took away the daily sacrifice".

It's the nation where "the falling away" has occured.

It's the nation which has exalted the beast; the man of sin.

It's the nation which Jesus, in Matt.24:15, refered to as "the holy place", AND the nation which Paul, in 11Thes.2, refered to as "the temple of God".

It is that "great city" which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, and spiritually where our Lord was crucified, in Rev.11:8.

It's the nation where the 2 witnesses will be persecuted and killed by the beast during the tribulation.

It's the nation which is on a collision course with the face of an angry GOD.

Be very sure that you know the truth behind the end-time scriptures, because the truth we hold during these end times will be counted to us as righteousness. (11Thes.2:13)

 

[OhhJim]

If your life is so wonderful, why are you bothering to involve yourself in an eschatology forum? I've read another of your posts where you state your belief that the Son of God won't be returning for another 50 years or so at least. So, why the desire to mock anyone who believes otherwise?

First, I didn't say my life was "so wonderful". It's much better than it could be, and better than it was, and better than that of many others over the last 5,000 years.

Second, I like eschatology. I've changed my position at least once since coming here, because of the wisdom of posts I've read here, and may change it again.

Third, I believe what I believe (the 50 years thing). I also believe I could be wrong. I'm not willing to stake anything valuable on the idea that my beliefs are correct.

Fourth, as several have graciously pointed out, I don't inted to mock anyone. I do make little jokes now and then, but it's not intended to be hurtful.

Finally, let me point out something here: I totally disagree with Acts 6:5's viewpoint of end times/eschatology. Totally. And yet, he is intelligent, logical, willing to participate in discussions, and I believe he loves the Lord as much as any pre-tribber, post-tribber, mid-tribber, or whatever. It's entirely possible for two Christians to disagree on an important subject, and still have fellowship in the Lord.

 

[OhhJim]

America; or, "the little horn" which waxed exceeding great into "Mighty Babylon", is at the very center of ALL end-time Bible prophecy.

It's the nation which "cut of Christ", and "took away the daily sacrifice".

When has America ever had a daily sacrifice? I notice you put those words in quotation marks.

I also notice you said America is "spiritually" where our Lord was crucified. The Bible doesn't say "spiritually". Why are you changing what the Bible says?

 

[NumberOneSon]

Finally, let me point out something here: I totally disagree with Acts 6:5's viewpoint of end times/eschatology. Totally.

Dang. In that case, I'll have to work on you a little harder.

In Christ,

Acts6:5

 

[OhhJim]

We're probably both wrong.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

We're probably both wrong.

Which of you 2 agree that Ezekiel 39:12 is the fulfillment of the Olivet Discourse/Daniel and Revelation?
The way it looks here, it is the OC Priesthood being "buried" but not really sure.


Matt 23:32 "Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers' [guilt.] 33 "Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of gehenna?

Ezkeiel 39:12 "For seven months the house of Israel will be burying Them, in order to Cleanse/purify the land. 13 "Indeed all the people of the land will be burying, and they will gain renown for it on the day that I am glorified," says the 'Adonay Y@hovih.

 

[Prophetboy]

Today, the U.S. A. is the world’s only superpower and she dominates through economic, political and military power.

Biblical prophecies, in Daniel and Revelation, indicate that the Antichrist and his kingdom will dominate the whole world, economically, politically and militarily, during at least the last seven years of this age. This means that there must be a change in superpowers before the end of the age.

Daniel described the kingdom of the Antichrist as a beast with 10 kings and their 10 kingdoms. Daniel wrote that another king will arise from among the ten and subdue three of the10 kings. This new king will be the Antichrist and then his kingdom will have 7 kings and 10 kingdoms.

In Revelation, chapters 13 and 17, John identifies the kingdom of the Antichrist as the beast which has “7 heads and 10 horns.” Horn in Bible prophecy can signify a king, a nation or a kingdom. This means the 10 nation kingdom of the Antichrist will ultimately have 7 leaders, thus the expression “7 heads and 10 horns.”

The prophecies of Daniel and Revelation also tell us about the rise of the kingdom of the Antichrist. Daniel 11 indicates that the Antichrist will successfully attack the mightiest fortresses with the help of a foreign power. By defeating the mightiest fortresses, the beast kingdom of the Antichrist will then dominate the world until the end of the age.

In Revelation, chapter 17, John writes that the beast with “7 heads and 10 horns” will destroy a superpower. In Revelation 17 and 18 John describes the superpower as one who sits on (dominates) peoples, multitudes, nations and languages of the world. John writes that the superpower is also a great city that rules over the kings of the earth. Daniel and John both write that the kingdom of the Antichrist will rise to power by defeating an existing world superpower.

In Revelation 17 and 18, God calls this superpower “Mystery Babylon the Great” and describes her in detail. See the description below,

Description of Mystery Babylon the Great:

• She is called a prostitute. God refers to his people as a prostitute when they chase after other gods. (See Jeremiah 2, Ezekiel 16 and Hosea 9).
• She dominates peoples, multitudes, nations and languages.
• She dominates the kingdom with the 7 heads and 10 kingdoms.
• She will be hated by the 10 kingdom with the 7 heads and 10 kingdoms.
• She is responsible for innocent blood, those who bore testimony to Jesus.
• She is also a great city who rules over the kings of the earth.
• She has become home for demons and evil spirits.
• The kings of the earth commit adultery with her, and the merchants of the earth grow rich from her excessive luxuries.
• The whole world is intoxicated by the fruit of her labor.
• She has great riches, wealth and splendor.
• She thinks she cannot be defeated, she says I am not a widow, I will never mourn.
• When her destruction comes, the merchants of the earth will weep and mourn because no one buys their cargoes any more.
• Every sea captain, and all who travel by ship, the sailors, and all who earn their living from the sea, will stand far off and throw dust on their heads, weep and mourn.
• Her merchants are the world’s great men.

For almost 2,000 years people have been trying to figure out who this world power is, who God calls Mystery Babylon the Great. Each prophetic characteristic of Mystery Babylon the Great must be fulfilled before she can be positively identified. If we compare these characteristics to the current superpower, most if not all fit the United States of America. As we consider these characteristics we should be mindful that this is how God views this superpower, not necessarily how we view her.

But, couldn’t the USA be replaced by another superpower before the kingdom of the Antichrist defeats Mystery Babylon the Great? Possibly, but that would mean another superpower must arise and fill all these characteristics which would take many decades or more. Is there enough time for that to happen? Let’s see what Jesus had to say about when the end would be near.

In the Olivet Discourse Jesus said that the following signs would indicate that the end was near: ethnic group will rise against ethnic group, kingdom against kindom, famines, earthquakes, pandemics and fearful events occurring in various places. Jesus called these signs birth pains which biblical prophecy indicates will lead to the return of Christ and the Kingdom of God on earth. It appears that the world is experiencing all or most of these signs today.

Some have said that these signs and events have been taking place throughout history and people have thought that the end was near, and yet it wasn’t. However, never has the world experienced all of these occurring simultaneously at the level we are currently seeing.

At the same time that Jesus identified the signs and events of the birth pains He also said, “when you see all these things, you know that the Kingdom of God is near, right at the door. I tell you the truth this generation will not pass away until all these things have happened.” The Bible describes a generation as lasting about 48 years. Therefore, when we see the birth pains begin we can expect that Jesus will return within 48 years.

Therefore, if we are seeing the birth pains that Jesus identified, it would seem unlikely that another superpower could arise and fulfill all the characteristics of Mystery Babylon the Great in less than 41 years (48 years minus the last 7 years). That would seem to indicate that, yes, the U.S.A. is in Bible prophecy and she is the superpower God calls “Mystery Babylon the Great.”

Richard Perry - August 15, 2006
lastdaysmystery dot info

Note: I calculate the number of years in a biblical generation from Matthew: “Thus there were fourteen generations in all from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ” (Matthew 1:17 ). From Abraham to Christ covered about 2,000 years. Therefore, by dividing 2,000 years by 42 generations we calculate that a biblical generation is about 48 years

Yes.. America is mystery Babylon the great, which the antichrist rules in the times of revelation..ie, NOW.

God's witness of revelation.

 

[gwynedd1]

Yes.. America is mystery Babylon the great, which the antichrist rules in the times of revelation..ie, NOW.

God's witness of revelation.

So America killed the prophets then...????