Is the Trinity explicitly taught?

[The Times]

Sorry. You are over my head.
http://usccb.org/bible/readings/bible/mark/6:7
MK 6:7-13
Jesus summoned the Twelve and began to send them out two by two
and gave them authority over unclean spirits.

You haven't totally understood what I tried to explain to you, but that's OK!

 

[The Times]

The Devine Providence to give life and to take away life is that of God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

Disciples do not have Devine Providence.

Devine Providence
Traditional theism holds that God is the creator of heaven and earth, and that all that occurs in the universe takes place under Divine Providence— that is, under God’s sovereign guidance and control.

All authority under THE NAME. On the Ark of the Covenant it is written Kha-Shim, meaning THE NAME or ONE NAME.

The disciples called upon the Devine Providence, to do miracles. For example "in the name of Jesus".

Devine Providence is in the NAME. The name's authority is God.

Jesus uses the personal pronoun of his name's authority by saying, "I will raise you up on the last day".

Notice that Jesus doesn't say in the name of the Father I will raise you up, but he uses the Devine Providence connected to the personal pronoun "I", that is the "I Am".

Disciples had no Devine Providence.

 

[Erik Nelson]

Michael Heiser observes that God angelically appears in human form in the OT, e.g. walking in the Garden of Eden, and as the "man" wrestling with Jacob.

If Jews and everyone else can accept that Jacob struggled with God in human form -- and was so surprised at having seen God face to face and yet having been spared to live that Jacob named the place Penuel...

then why not also accept that 1st century Judaean sons & daughters of Jacob again saw God face to face in human form... namely the bodily form of Jesus of Nazareth, in whom the Word of God tabernacled(John 1) and the fullness of Deity dwelt (Col 2:9) ?

 

[FutureAndAHope]

There are lots of verses that point to the trinity and although the word itself doesn't appear in scripture is it still thought of as an explicit doctrine or is the the concept of the trinity more of an implicit doctrine?

I have written a document on the trinity in scripture here http://www.futureandahope.net/trinity.php it may not cover everything, but it covers the angle of the Seven Spirts of God, and how they are depicted in biblical literature.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

There are lots of verses that point to the trinity and although the word itself doesn't appear in scripture is it still thought of as an explicit doctrine or is the the concept of the trinity more of an implicit doctrine?

I would discuss this...but not sure if the rules allow that if you have an alternative view.

 

[DamianWarS]

I would discuss this...but not sure if the rules allow that if you have an alternative view.

keep it to Nicene Christianity

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

I would say it's not specifically expressed...or taught in scripture to answer the question as it is.

 

[SolomonVII]

Sorry. You are over my head.
MK 6:7-13
Jesus summoned the Twelve and began to send them out two by two
and gave them authority over unclean spirits.

I think that by 'delegate' what the poster was saying is that the apostles and the disciples cast out demons, etc. in the NAME of Jesus, or Father or Holy Ghost. Their authority was not in their own name but in the name of God.
Maybe it is close to the idea in the parable where the king gives some money to his slaves to invest. The money they make belongs to the king still.
To delegate to a lesser being might mean, if I am understanding correctly, that the money that the slaves earn would belong to them, rather than the King.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I think that by 'delegate' what the poster was saying is that the apostles and the disciples cast out demons, etc. in the NAME of Jesus, or Father or Holy Ghost. Their authority was not in their own name but in the name of God.
Maybe it is close to the idea in the parable where the king gives some money to his slaves to invest. The money they make belongs to the king still.
To delegate to a lesser being might mean, if I am understanding correctly, that the money that the slaves earn would belong to them, rather than the King.

That's what I intended. I still have no way of knowing what the poster was trying to say. God does delegate authority within His Church, but it is still His authority and not ours. I get that. I don't get whatever the poster was trying to say. That was "God does not delegate to a lesser being." Doesn't make sense to me in the context of the Scripture I posted which shows Jesus delegating authority to cast out demons to the Twelve.

 

[throughfiierytrial]

There are lots of verses that point to the trinity and although the word itself doesn't appear in scripture is it still thought of as an explicit doctrine or is the the concept of the trinity more of an implicit doctrine?

Here are the greatest, in my view, supporting passages of the Trinity which, yes, is implied and taught in Scripture while the word Trinity itself is extra-biblical. Passages...
Isaiah 9:6-7:
For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7 Of the greatness of his government and peace
there will be no end.
He will reign on David’s throne
and over his kingdom,
establishing and upholding it
with justice and righteousness
from that time on and forever.
The zeal of the Lord Almighty
will accomplish this.

 

[FatalHeart]

Can you clarify the above?

Much like Abel, the object of Jesus was not known, just the principle and the coming promise. They both were putting their faith in God and the aspect of His Christ to come without an actual name to that Christ. You can say they were both believing in a person, perhaps, because Abel used a real life example of a lamb and Abraham had to believe he'd have a son, but there was definitely a very finite understanding of the Christ, much like faith in Jesus is today: "He (Jesus) was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake. Through him (Jesus) you believe in God (Not Jesus), who (Not Jesus) raised him (Jesus) from the dead and glorified him (Jesus), and so your faith and hope are in God (Not Jesus)."

 

[Erik Nelson]

Is it alright to throw some thoughts out there?

Genesis 1:1-2 and John 1:1 collectively show that God, God's [Holy] Spirit, and the Word [of God] were all present in the beginning.

God is the overall intelligence directing everything. The HS + W are "emanations" of God "reaching into creation" to affect creation, and to effect God's Will for & within creation.

Humans are created in the image of God (Gen 1:27). So perhaps it's not utterly completely inappropriate to anthropomorphize, for the sake of illustration?

Humans have a mind & body to carry out the mind's desires. God has the HS + W to carry out Divine Will.

 

[throughfiierytrial]

Much like Abel, the object of Jesus was not known, just the principle and the coming promise. They both were putting their faith in God and the aspect of His Christ to come without an actual name to that Christ. You can say they were both believing in a person, perhaps, because Abel used a real life example of a lamb and Abraham had to believe he'd have a son, but there was definitely a very finite understanding of the Christ, much like faith in Jesus is today: "He (Jesus) was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake. Through him (Jesus) you believe in God (Not Jesus), who (Not Jesus) raised him (Jesus) from the dead and glorified him (Jesus), and so your faith and hope are in God (Not Jesus)."

The saved were required to believe in a coming Messiah as promised in Genesis 3:15 (I believe it is). Also, Jesus was manifested to some on earth as the Angel of the Lord...to Hagar and Samson's parents for a couple examples.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I would say it's not specifically expressed...or taught in scripture to answer the question as it is.

Correct. Some or many, maybe most of The early Ekklesia (and OT, as well as NT) had a much better understanding of Yahweh's Word than billions do today. If something was taught by Jesus to the disciples, they would have taught others as He taught them. Perhaps this year today and following, Yahweh will again grant to Ekklesia the same revelation of His Word and with experiential understanding and knowledge as they had then,
perfectly and simple, in line with all of His Word, as He perfectly knows and accomplishes in His Good Pleasure.....

 

[Erik Nelson]

The saved were required to believe in a coming Messiah as promised in Genesis 3:15 (I believe it is). Also, Jesus was manifested to some on earth as the Angel of the Lord...to Hagar and Samson's parents for a couple examples.

and maybe you could say the Angel of the Lord manifested to 1st century Judaeans as Christ ?

Is there any tradition of using the name "Jesus" to refer to the human person & human nature of Christ, and "Christ" to refer to the Divine person & Divine nature (= Word of God per John 1:1) ?

If so, would you mind saying "Christ was manifested to (say) Abraham", when God revealed His plan by which "all the nations would be blessed" (paraphrase) through Abraham? Presuming Jesus Christ fulfills that prophesy, wouldn't it be reasonable to guess that Abraham was then & there shown some foreknowledge of the Messiah, so explaining why Jesus said "Abraham saw my day & rejoiced" (John 8:56) ?

 

[FatalHeart]

As long as you don't take away the literal Jesus, I'm fine with the discussion in what exactly the essence of the word of God is. XD But it's important to not ignore the sentence, "The Word became flesh and dwelt among us," and that His name is Jesus. XD

 

[Erik Nelson]

As long as you don't take away the literal Jesus, I'm fine with the discussion in what exactly the essence of the word of God is. XD But it's important to not ignore the sentence, "The Word became flesh and dwelt among us," and that His name is Jesus. XD

Are you saying we know the Name of the Word of God? That the Word has a Name, vaguely similar to Archangels having names, like Michael, Gabriel, Raphael? And that the Word's "Archangelic Name" is Jesus?

Or was "Jesus" (Joshua, Yehoshua) the name of the human person & human nature, in which the Word (John 1:1) and "the fullness of Deity dwelt" (Col 2:9)?

Obviously God in heaven, who knows all, knew the human Messiah would be named "Jesus". So, the name "Jesus" was known to God from at least Gen 3:15, when God foretold that Eve's seed would crush the head of the snake.

If God knows all possibilities, then God knew what the snake & Eve might do, and so had a "contingency plan" prepared in place prior to Gen 3. So it's plausible that the name "Jesus" was known to God well before Gen 3.

However, is the name "Jesus" a (foreordained, foreknown) name of a human person & human nature (of the Messiah)… or is it the Archangelic Divine Name of the Word of God, much as "YHWH" is the Divine Name of God the Father ?

God = "YHWH (Jehovah)"
Word = "Yehoshua (Joshua, Jesus)"​

Is that what you're saying ?

 

[throughfiierytrial]

and maybe you could say the Angel of the Lord manifested to 1st century Judaeans as Christ ?

Is there any tradition of using the name "Jesus" to refer to the human person & human nature of Christ, and "Christ" to refer to the Divine person & Divine nature (= Word of God per John 1:1) ?

If so, would you mind saying "Christ was manifested to (say) Abraham", when God revealed His plan by which "all the nations would be blessed" (paraphrase) through Abraham? Presuming Jesus Christ fulfills that prophesy, wouldn't it be reasonable to guess that Abraham was then & there shown some foreknowledge of the Messiah, so explaining why Jesus said "Abraham saw my day & rejoiced" (John 8:56) ?

A lot to address and I'll try what I can or with what I know.
The meaning of the title "Christ" as I find it from a Google search is "anointed one". Here's the full explanation as given and if it can be trusted...I believe it can as I have heard this before, but I like to find Scripture to prove things out. Here it is...
"Christ" is not a surname, it's a title. It's appended to the Greek form of Yeshua's name as part of a claim that he was the Messiah, which in Greek is Χριστός (Christos). This in turn is the Greek form of the Hebrew מָשִׁיחַ (Māšîaḥ) meaning "anointed one".
Checking Scripture after remembering a few things I find this good passage to back up the above:
Matthew 16:16:
And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
and...
Luke 4:41:
And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.
So I say, yes, you are correct in saying Jesus refers to the human person and nature while Christ is referring to His divine nature...we see this in not only the title Christ, but also He is Emmanuel.
Jesus was manifested to Abraham as one of the three men which many believe are the three persons of the Trinity...beyond that all I can say that although there are three persons there is still only one God. I believe God spoke as the one God when conversing to Abraham only because Scripture does not render that passage as Angel of the Lord. I believe there is a distinction made for a reason.
addressing this comment now:
"Christ was manifested to (say) Abraham", when God revealed His plan by which "all the nations would be blessed" (paraphrase) through Abraham? Presuming Jesus Christ fulfills that prophesy, wouldn't it be reasonable to guess that Abraham was then & there shown some foreknowledge of the Messiah, so explaining why Jesus said "Abraham saw my day & rejoiced"
I believe that when Jesus made this statement He spoke about the fact that Abraham was/is in heaven and was quite well aware at that point that He, the Messiah, was born into the world.

I hope this helps...we all continue to learn from one another.

 

[Erik Nelson]

A lot to address and I'll try what I can or with what I know.
The meaning of the title "Christ" as I find it from a Google search is "anointed one". Here's the full explanation as given and if it can be trusted...I believe it can as I have heard this before, but I like to find Scripture to prove things out. Here it is...
"Christ" is not a surname, it's a title. It's appended to the Greek form of Yeshua's name as part of a claim that he was the Messiah, which in Greek is Χριστός (Christos). This in turn is the Greek form of the Hebrew מָשִׁיחַ (Māšîaḥ) meaning "anointed one".
Checking Scripture after remembering a few things I find this good passage to back up the above:
Matthew 16:16:
And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
and...
Luke 4:41:
And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.
So I say, yes, you are correct in saying Jesus refers to the human person and nature while Christ is referring to His divine nature...we see this in not only the title Christ, but also He is Emmanuel.
Jesus was manifested to Abraham as one of the three men which many believe are the three persons of the Trinity...beyond that all I can say that although there are three persons there is still only one God. I believe God spoke as the one God when conversing to Abraham only because Scripture does not render that passage as Angel of the Lord. I believe there is a distinction made for a reason.
addressing this comment now:
"Christ was manifested to (say) Abraham", when God revealed His plan by which "all the nations would be blessed" (paraphrase) through Abraham? Presuming Jesus Christ fulfills that prophesy, wouldn't it be reasonable to guess that Abraham was then & there shown some foreknowledge of the Messiah, so explaining why Jesus said "Abraham saw my day & rejoiced"
I believe that when Jesus made this statement He spoke about the fact that Abraham was/is in heaven and was quite well aware at that point that He, the Messiah, was born into the world.

I hope this helps...we all continue to learn from one another.

Please do recall Luke 16, Abraham was not yet in Heaven as of the time Christ spoke to 1st century Judea. Abraham, like Samuel in the days of Saul, resided in the "pleasant part of Sheol = Hades = realm of disembodied spirits of righteous dead"

NOT to be confused with Tartarus = unpleasant part of Sheol Hades = realm of disembodied spirits of unrighteous dead

Christian martyrs are depicted raised "specially" at the onset of the Millennium. Abraham was not martyred... all other spirits are raised at the Final Resurrection at The End of earth on Final Judgement Day (Revelation 20:11)

Luke 16 depicts Abraham (on one side of Sheol, presumably with Samuel and other souls of the righteous) and others (on the other side) in some sort of "purgatory-like limbo" awaiting Final Judgement & Resurrection at The End of earth (Rev 20:11). (Most) Human souls accumulate there, until The End.

According to Judas Maccabeus, one can meanwhile pray for the souls of the departed and "help their case" on Final Judgement Day.

 

[throughfiierytrial]

Please do recall Luke 16, Abraham was not yet in Heaven as of the time Christ spoke to 1st century Judea. Abraham, like Samuel in the days of Saul, resided in the "pleasant part of Sheol = Hades = realm of disembodied spirits of righteous dead"

NOT to be confused with Tartarus = unpleasant part of Sheol Hades = realm of disembodied spirits of unrighteous dead

Christian martyrs are depicted raised "specially" at the onset of the Millennium. Abraham was not martyred... all other spirits are raised at the Final Resurrection at The End of earth on Final Judgement Day (Revelation 20:11)

Luke 16 depicts Abraham (on one side of Sheol, presumably with Samuel and other souls of the righteous) and others (on the other side) in some sort of "purgatory-like limbo" awaiting Final Judgement & Resurrection at The End of earth (Rev 20:11). (Most) Human souls accumulate there, until The End.

According to Judas Maccabeus, one can meanwhile pray for the souls of the departed and "help their case" on Final Judgement Day.

Thank you Erik.
I do not believe this way. I have heard parts of this but have never come to the same conclusions from my readings and have wished to make the topic a study. I do see that II Peter 2 records the ancient world and the disobedient angels as having been imprisoned...beyond this the word shoal, etc but not enough thorough knowledge on those topics that might refute my understanding that Abraham and all who lived in faith went to live in heaven or if there was a different version of heaven at that time (which some assume drawing off the parable of the rich man and poor Lazarus) they went there. We know they were conscious.
Matthew 22:31-32:
But about the resurrection of the dead—have you not read what God said to you, ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? He is not the God of the dead but of the living.”

The dead in Christ live...way I see it now and don't wish to change positions without strong Biblical support and time to study such. So far all I have run across is extra-biblical sources.