Is the Seventh Day Adventist Church orthodox

[tall73]

For me it was not a point as my posts and scriptures provided were specifically to the Mosaic book of the law that was written by Moses.

Then post the text that refers to the book of the law of Moses and quotes from Genesis.

Please post the whole text, not just the reference.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Then post the text that refers to the book of the law of Moses and quotes from Genesis. Please post the whole text, not just the reference.

Why don't you want to discuss why you believe the Sabbath is not longer binding anymore? You keep seeking to change the topic of discussion.

As posted earlier, the book of the law does not state that it is any of the individual books of the Pentateuch (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy and Numbers) because the book of the law is referred to as all these books collectively.

Deuteronomy 31:24-26, [24] And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished, [25], That Moses commanded the Levites, which bore the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,[26], Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against you.

Joshua 23:6, Be you therefore very courageous to keep and to do all that is written in the book of the law of Moses, that you turn not aside therefrom to the right hand or to the left

There is too many more scriptures already posted referring to the Torah of Moses (see post # 1210)

 

[tall73]

Why don't you want to discuss the Sabbath anymore?

We ended the Sabbath conversation, because you didn't seem to have any interest in hearing my view on the various texts. Instead you wanted to post your views at length, including addressing views I don't hold in response to me.

When I was going through the various texts you indicated:

even if Gods' commandments where only known in Exodus 16 and Exodus 20 it is not an excuse to break them

So there is little point in going over all the texts with you.

 

[tall73]

You keep seeking to change the topic of discussion.

You were discussing elements brought up in the discussion.

As posted earlier, the book of the law does not state that it is any of the individual books of the Pentateuch (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy and Numbers) because the book of the law is referred to as all these books collectively.

Deuteronomy 31:24-26, [24] And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished, [25], That Moses commanded the Levites, which bore the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,[26], Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against you.

Joshua 23:6, Be you therefore very courageous to keep and to do all that is written in the book of the law of Moses, that you turn not aside therefrom to the right hand or to the left

There is too many more scriptures already posted referring to the Torah of Moses (see post # 1210)

Neither of those, nor any of the others, indicate that Genesis is included in the book of the law that was placed by the ark.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

We ended the Sabbath conversation, because you didn't seem to have any interest in hearing my view on the various texts. Instead you wanted to post your views at length, including addressing views I don't hold in response to me.

When I was going through the various texts you indicated:

So there is little point in going over all the texts with you.

Of course I was interested in your view. Your claims here are not true. I am yet to hear your view as you have not made any argument from the scriptures that I am aware of in regards to why you no longer keep the Sabbath that I can see in this thread.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Neither of those, nor any of the others, indicate that Genesis is included in the book of the law that was placed by the ark.

If you read the rest of my post instead of micro-quoting and making my posts our of context you would have seen they were never meant to.

 

[tall73]

Of course I was interested in your view. Your claims here are not true. I am yet to hear your view as you have not made any argument from the scriptures that I am aware of in regards to why you no longer keep the Sabbath that I can see in this thread.

As stated at the beginning of the process I was going through all the texts.

If you have seen no discussion of that by this point, then we really have no need to continue.

 

[tall73]

If you read the rest of my post instead of micro-quoting and making my posts our of context you would have seen they were never meant to.

If you are referring to this:

As posted earlier, the book of the law does not state that it is any of the individual books of the Pentateuch (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy and Numbers) because the book of the law is referred to as all these books collectively.

You would need to post the Scripture that demonstrates that Genesis is part of the book of the law.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

As stated at the beginning of the process I was going through all the texts. If you have seen no discussion of that by this point, then we really have no need to continue.

All I can see is your trying to talk about everything else except God's 10 commandments and the Sabbath which is a part of the 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of good and evil; sin and righteousness (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172.

 

[tall73]

All I can see is your trying to talk about everything else except God's 10 commandments and the Sabbath which is a part of the 10 commandments.

I don't doubt that is all you can see.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

If you are referring to this: You would need to post the Scripture that demonstrates that Genesis is part of the book of the law.

Why can you show me where Moses wrote Numbers? What do you think John 5:46-47 is talking about? As posted earlier, the book of the law does not state that it is any of the individual books of the Pentateuch (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy and Numbers) because the book of the law is referred to as all these books collectively. If you believe that Moses did not write the Pentateuch what is the book of the law that Moses wrote and who wrote the rest? What is the Torah and do you think the Jews who were given the Mosiac book of the law from Moses by God got it all wrong in believing that Moses wrote the Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy and Numbers? For me I see Exodus as a continuation of Genesis as Genesis ends with the Children of Israel in Egypt and Exodus begins with God's people in Egypt as a continuation of the Genesis narrative from the beginning.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I don't doubt that is all you can see.

Perhaps I see much more than you think I do. I am still waiting to hear your argument against the Sabbath. You have not made one. I am looking forward to bringing everything in this regards to the scriptures so we can see by God's grace what is true and what is not.

 

[tall73]

Why can you show me where Moses wrote Numbers? What do you think John 5:46-47 is talking about? As posted earlier, the book of the law does not state that it is any of the individual books of the Pentateuch (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy and Numbers) because the book of the law is referred to as all these books collectively. If you believe that Moses did not write the Pentateuch what is the book of the law that Moses wrote and who wrote the rest?

I spelled out my reasons for believing it likely that Moses is responsible for the vast majority of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy. This is because of the continuation of the narrative, the commands from God to write down what was stated, etc.

The name of Moses is directly linked when quoting from Exodus and Deuteronomy.

I think Jesus meant Moses wrote about Him. So for instance the prediction of the prophet like unto him that must be listened to, etc. point towards Christ.

However, that is a different argument than you are making. You are stating that the Pentateuch is the same as the book of the law placed next to the ark.

However, you have not demonstrated that. No mention is made in the text of Deut. 31 of the contents of Genesis being included. I am asking where the Scriptures state that the contents of the book in Deuteronomy 31 include Genesis.

It sounds like it contained the various laws given to the children of Israel.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I think Jesus meant Moses wrote about Him. So for instance the prediction of the prophet like unto him that must be listened to, etc. point towards Christ. However, that is a different argument than you are making. You are stating that the Pentateuch is the same as the book of the law placed next to the ark.
However, you have not demonstrated that. No mention is made in the text of Deut. 31 of the contents of Genesis being included. I am asking where the Scriptures state that the contents of the book in Deuteronomy 31 include Genesis. It sounds like it contained the various laws given to the children of Israel.

I respectfully disagree as the scriptures provided to you already specifically state that Moses wrote the torah (first five books of the bible). My understanding is that the book of the law is in reference to the first five books of the bible. Which according to the Jews represents the Torah. Moses wrote the Torah. (scriptures posted earlier). Are you saying the Jews who were given the Mosiac book of the law (Torah) also called the book of the covenant *Exodus 24:7 got it wrong? I do not disagree that Moses did not write every part of the five books but do consider him the main author (e.g. last part of Deuteronomy at the death of Moses).

 

[tall73]

Perhaps I see much more than you think I do.

We have been discussing the law and sabbath for many pages, and were going through the various texts. You claim to have seen no discussion by me of the Sabbath or the ten commandments. I am not going to waste my time going through probably 100 texts if you claim I have not talked about it to this point, when I have.

And you claimed I should believe your viewpoint if there were only two texts, without waiting to see what the review of all of the texts brought out.

You asked for a conversation. However, you now claim not to have seen any discussion of the law or sabbath from me.

That is not a good use of my time. If you can't see what I am saying, then I don't want to have a conversation.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I wouldn't know.



We have been discussing the law and sabbath for many pages, and were going through the various texts. You claim to have seen no discussion by me of the Sabbath or the ten commandments. I am not going to waste my time going through probably 100 texts if you claim I have not talked about it to this point, when I have.

And you claimed I should believe your viewpoint if there were only two texts, without waiting to see what the review of all of the texts brought out.

You asked for a conversation. However, you now claim not to have seen any discussion of the law or sabbath from me.

Meanwhile you opined on views I do not hold in responses to me, such as Sunday sacredness.

And while going through all of the many texts on the subject, which we had just started to do, you said I should believe on the basis of two of them and then started making appeals to me.

That is not a good use of my time. If you can't see what I am saying, then I don't want to have a conversation.

Well I think every post you have provided has been responded to with a detailed scripture response. I am being honest with you by saying that I do not believe you have put up an argument that shows from the scriptures that God's 4th commandment is no longer a requirement for Christian living in the new covenant when Gods' Word clearly shows that it is.

 

[tall73]

Are you saying the Jews who were given the Mosiac book of the law (Torah) also called the book of the covenant *Exodus 24:7 got it wrong? I do not disagree that Moses did not write every part of the five books but do consider him the main author (e.g. last part of Deuteronomy at the death of Moses).

I am stating that I think the Jewish scholars got a lot wrong, but I didn't think we were basing claims on what Jewish scholars thought or think.

I have stated my view that Moses wrote the vast majority of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy.

However, I am asking for biblical evidence that the content of Genesis is included in the book referenced in Deut. 31.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I am stating that I think the Jewish scholars got a lot wrong, but I didn't think we were basing claims on what Jewish scholars thought or think.

I have stated my view that Moses wrote the vast majority of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy.

However, I am asking for biblical evidence that the content of Genesis is included in the book referenced in Deut. 31.

I believe I have already provided biblical evidence showing that Moses wrote the majority of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy. Which you say is what you believe as well. I would find it difficult to believe that the Jews did not know what the Torah was when they were given it from God through Moses who was the author of it as shown through the scriptures already.

 

[tall73]

I would find it difficult to believe that the Jews did not know what the Torah was when they were given it from God through Moses who was the author of it as shown through the scriptures already.

I note that you based your case on what you would find difficult to believe about what people thought, and not on what Scripture said.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I note that you based your case on what you would find difficult to believe about what people thought, and not on what Scripture said.

No. I stated that because of the overwhelming evidence of the scriptures already provided showing God gave the book of the covenant (law) *Exodus 24:7 through Moses to the Jews and it is the Jewish understanding that the Torah includes Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy which is supported by the scriptures as the scriptures clearly state as posted earlier that Moses wrote the Torah so to state otherwise I believe is against the scriptures. Let's talk more latter I have to go out for now. I would like to see why you no longer think the Sabbath which is Gods' 4th commandment that is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken in the new covenant *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; James 2:10-11 is no longer a part of God's standard for Christian living. So if we could get back on topic I am keen to discuss this with you and I think it would be great. I think we are in agreement here that Moses wrote most of the Pentateuch.

Thanks for the chat.