Is the mark of the beast Sunday worship?

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

Hello! I'm very curious about this topic!

Hey, so I'm pretty young in my (new) faith, considering becoming an ex-adventist after 18 years (I am 18) because now that I'm away from home, I have been reading the Bible for MYSELF and not listening to what people tell me like how it was in the past, and my beliefs have shifted that of my entire family.

Growing up, I did not know what to think about other people who worship on Sunday, because Adventists worship on Saturday (not only Adventists. I'm sure there are other denominations that worship on Saturday and Jews). I was taught that Sunday worship was the mark of the beast all my entire life, and that Saturday was the true perfect day of rest and whoever worships on Saturday has the seal of God (quoted from Ellen G White). Now I'm at college, away from home, and I joined a christian fellowship group; with no one who is an Adventist. I see all these Jesus loving people who don't worship on Sunday and at first I questioned their salvation, since they have the mark of the beast because of Sunday, but now I go to church on Sunday also where most of the sermons aren't one dimensional towards just a denomination.

Just still in the waters about this question. People say it is a microchip, Sunday worship, or that those prophecies in Revelation already happened with Emperor Nero.

It is also very hard to open up to my parents about my new faith and leaving Adventism. I am not doing it out of disrespect, but because I want my relationship with Christ to grow, which I think they will despise.

I'm open to plenty of insight, thanks for your time!

You should also be careful when reading the teachings of others and try everything by the word of God. Especially doctrines that are held simply because they are Old but are not shown in the NT.

You should also try everything said by the Early Church 'Fathers' by the Word of God if anything they preached was contrary to the word of God then everything they said comes into question and should not be treated as the Gospel truth. If you start looking into Church history (Such as the EC'F') you should also read about the Waldensians, Petrobrusians, Cathars, Anabaptists, and the dozens of other groups that existed Apart from the Catholic Church(and sometimes long before) and it's teachings.

 

[WESTOZZIE]

In Mark 8 when Jesus healed the blind man He led the blind man by the hand out of the village. That village was Bethsaida...where He pronounced woe upon them because they did not believe even though He had done many signs there..
Anyway..Jesus led the blind man out of the place of blindness...and it took 2 times for his sight to be restored.
For God to remove all the tares sown in our hearts which cause us to see wrong....takes time...lots of time.
In the meantime...Jesus told the man not to go back to the village and not to speak with the people.

 

[Monk Brendan]

Hello! I'm very curious about this topic!

Hey, so I'm pretty young in my (new) faith, considering becoming an ex-adventist after 18 years (I am 18) because now that I'm away from home, I have been reading the Bible for MYSELF and not listening to what people tell me like how it was in the past, and my beliefs have shifted that of my entire family.

Growing up, I did not know what to think about other people who worship on Sunday, because Adventists worship on Saturday (not only Adventists. I'm sure there are other denominations that worship on Saturday and Jews). I was taught that Sunday worship was the mark of the beast all my entire life, and that Saturday was the true perfect day of rest and whoever worships on Saturday has the seal of God (quoted from Ellen G White). Now I'm at college, away from home, and I joined a christian fellowship group; with no one who is an Adventist. I see all these Jesus loving people who don't worship on Sunday and at first I questioned their salvation, since they have the mark of the beast because of Sunday, but now I go to church on Sunday also where most of the sermons aren't one dimensional towards just a denomination.

Just still in the waters about this question. People say it is a microchip, Sunday worship, or that those prophecies in Revelation already happened with Emperor Nero.

It is also very hard to open up to my parents about my new faith and leaving Adventism. I am not doing it out of disrespect, but because I want my relationship with Christ to grow, which I think they will despise.

I'm open to plenty of insight, thanks for your time!

I have attended the SDA Revelation Seminar.

They falsely claim that the Pope is the beast, and the mark of the Beast is worship on Sunday, because the Pope is the one who changed Saturday to Sunday.

The are never clear about WHICH pope did so, or when.

They also never explain how pre-Reformation Eastern Churches that never had anything to do with the Pope all have Sunday as the primary day of worship.

But there's a simpler approach to this issue, again one that SDA never answers:

According to the Bible, on which day of the week are we FORBIDDEN to worship?

I also suggest you go to ralphwoodrow.org, and find his article DID SUNDAY WORSHIP COME FROM THE PAGANS? You should find it enlightening.

 

[Monk Brendan]

**If you start looking into Church history (Such as the EC'F') you should also read about the Waldensians, Petrobrusians, Cathars, Anabaptists, and the dozens of other groups that existed Apart from the Catholic Church(and sometimes long before) and it's teachings.**

Most of these groups you mentioned, aside from being strongly Trinitarian, are post-Reformation.

I noticed you forgot to mention the Copts, the Orthodox, the Assyrians, and other pre-reformation Eastern Churches that never had anything to do with the Pope. Why?

 

[Monk Brendan]

Yes, that is what we are shown. Sunday worship(as the Sabbath day) is abominable to the Lord and the World Government/Religious Power enforces it by Law. We are commanded to keep the Lord's Sabbath day holy and only those who keep The seventh day sabbath will be permitted entrance into the valley of the Mountain, and those in the New heavens and the New earth will keep the Sabbath day.

"Valley of the Mountain" is an oxymoron, a self contradictory phrase.

Land can be a mountain, a valley, or a plain, but it can't be a mountain AND a valley at the same time.

I looked up Petrobrusians. There are only TWO references to them in what was written at the time they flourished.

Strangely enough, some Baptists claim the they and the Waldensians were simply Baptists under another name.

If this were true, then why did the Waldensians in Italy join with the Methodists?

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

**If you start looking into Church history (Such as the EC'F') you should also read about the Waldensians, Petrobrusians, Cathars, Anabaptists, and the dozens of other groups that existed Apart from the Catholic Church(and sometimes long before) and it's teachings.**

Most of these groups you mentioned, aside from being strongly Trinitarian, are post-Reformation.

I noticed you forgot to mention the Copts, the Orthodox, the Assyrians, and other pre-reformation Eastern Churches that never had anything to do with the Pope. Why?

1. The Waldensians and the Cathars(and many others) existed before the start of the reformation by Luther during the 1400s. In Fact it is argued that the Ideas they held date back hundreds of Years prior to the 1100s.

2. I didn't forget to mention anything brother, I said there are dozens of Other groups. It is likely there were hundreds even. It would take quite awhile to name them all, so I named the ones that first came to my mind. I apologize if you took offense to what I said.

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

"Valley of the Mountain" is an oxymoron, a self contradictory phrase.

Land can be a mountain, a valley, or a plain, but it can't be a mountain AND a valley at the same time.

I looked up Petrobrusians. There are only TWO references to them in what was written at the time they flourished.

Strangely enough, some Baptists claim the they and the Waldensians were simply Baptists under another name.

If this were true, then why did the Waldensians in Italy join with the Methodists?

1. It is the valley of the Mount of Olives cleft in the midst.
Zech 14:
4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lordmy God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

2. AnaBaptists and Waldensians have many things in Common but the Waldensians existed long before the Baptists and the Reformation. In fact there is an account the Waldensians sending out people to see if the doctrine they held was true before coming to Join with them.

 

[A_Thinker]

Yes, that is what we are shown. Sunday worship(as the Sabbath day) is abominable to the Lord

Where is there any scripture which says that Sunday worship is abominable to the Lord ?

The commandment says ... to "Remember the Sabbath day ... to keep it holy." It doesn't say that we cannot worship on other days.

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

Where is there any scripture which says that Sunday worship is abominable to the Lord ?

The commandment says ... to "Remember the Sabbath day ... to keep it holy." It doesn't say that we cannot worship on other days.

Sunday worship as the Lord's Sabbath day is Abominable to the Lord. That is what I said.

Do you keep sunday as the Lord's Sabbath day and not the True seventh day Sabbath? Then you are not keeping the Lord's Sabbath day Holy as commanded. It is attempting to change the Law of God(Sabbath day rest) from Saturday to Sunday, and trying to change the Law of God is Abominable to the Lord.

We are free to worship any day of the week, in fact we are encouraged to worship every day. But only one day a week is commanded to be kept Holy and sacred by the Lord. That day is the seventh day sabbath, Saturday. So if you wish to worship with other denominations of Sunday then by all means do so. But make sure you are doing simply for worship and not to observe it as the Lord's holy day.

 

[Jordan_cg]

In Mark 8 when Jesus healed the blind man He led the blind man by the hand out of the village. That village was Bethsaida...where He pronounced woe upon them because they did not believe even though He had done many signs there..
Anyway..Jesus led the blind man out of the place of blindness...and it took 2 times for his sight to be restored.
For God to remove all the tares sown in our hearts which cause us to see wrong....takes time...lots of time.
In the meantime...Jesus told the man not to go back to the village and not to speak with the people.

I apologize, I'm trying to understand what you are saying, which I might, but can you elaborate please

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

I have attended the SDA Revelation Seminar.

They falsely claim that the Pope is the beast, and the mark of the Beast is worship on Sunday, because the Pope is the one who changed Saturday to Sunday.

The are never clear about WHICH pope did so, or when.

They also never explain how pre-Reformation Eastern Churches that never had anything to do with the Pope all have Sunday as the primary day of worship.

But there's a simpler approach to this issue, again one that SDA never answers:

According to the Bible, on which day of the week are we FORBIDDEN to worship?

I also suggest you go to ralphwoodrow.org, and find his article DID SUNDAY WORSHIP COME FROM THE PAGANS? You should find it enlightening.

The Pope(any of them/all of them) is the one who THOUGHT to change times and laws. There are many who came before who taught that Sunday worship was the way to go, but what set them apart from the Catholic Church is that none of them had the same amount of power/influence as the Catholic Church. Each of the Popes were/are an Anti Christ because they each work against Christ. Even in the days of Paul we are told there were those who tried to introduce false days of Worship, that is why he wrote Hebrews 4 to show that the day of Rest remains. And if the Lord were going to have changed the Sabbath day then would he not have spoken of another day?

There is no day we are forbidden to worship on, in fact we are glorify the Lord and worship him constantly, without ceasing. There is though only one SABBATH DAY for worship. That distinction may be where your confusion stems from.

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

Quote from Justin Martyr about 150 CE;
We all make our assembly in common on Sunday, since it is the first day, on which God changed the darkness and matter and made the world, and Jesus Christ our Savior arose from the dead on the same day. For they crucified him on the day before Saturn’s day, and on the day after (which is the day of the Sun) he appeared to his apostles and disciples and taught these things, which we have offered for your consideration.

And most Christians did likewise until about 1870 when EGW established the SDA church and ......
Sad truth is SDAs don't keep the Sabbath either, they only go to church on Saturday.
Most will kindle fires, start cars, carry loads, buy and sell, and ................................etc.
Yet condemn the rest for "not keeping the Sabbath"
Matt 7:1-2,
Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

Brother, just an addition to Matt 7:1-2 Which goes on to say, we should judge only after we ourselves are not doing that same sin. We are to judge all things by the word of God.

All will be Judged by the word of God in the Last day. So also are Christ followers to judge all things by the word of God and by the same word will they be judged. 1 Cor 2:15, 6:2-5; John 7:24


Also most of those things you mention about starting the fire and such were under the Old Law. They are not under the New.

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

Hello! I'm very curious about this topic!

Hey, so I'm pretty young in my (new) faith, considering becoming an ex-adventist after 18 years (I am 18) because now that I'm away from home, I have been reading the Bible for MYSELF and not listening to what people tell me like how it was in the past, and my beliefs have shifted that of my entire family.

Growing up, I did not know what to think about other people who worship on Sunday, because Adventists worship on Saturday (not only Adventists. I'm sure there are other denominations that worship on Saturday and Jews). I was taught that Sunday worship was the mark of the beast all my entire life, and that Saturday was the true perfect day of rest and whoever worships on Saturday has the seal of God (quoted from Ellen G White). Now I'm at college, away from home, and I joined a christian fellowship group; with no one who is an Adventist. I see all these Jesus loving people who don't worship on Sunday and at first I questioned their salvation, since they have the mark of the beast because of Sunday, but now I go to church on Sunday also where most of the sermons aren't one dimensional towards just a denomination.

Just still in the waters about this question. People say it is a microchip, Sunday worship, or that those prophecies in Revelation already happened with Emperor Nero.

It is also very hard to open up to my parents about my new faith and leaving Adventism. I am not doing it out of disrespect, but because I want my relationship with Christ to grow, which I think they will despise.

I'm open to plenty of insight, thanks for your time!

Hi the mark of the beast is certainly not Sunday Sabbath. If you look at Rev 13 the beast is given power by the dragon and has to survive a mortal wound. The scripture says he is given total dominion over every tribe tongue kindred and nation for exactly 42 months. At the end of the 42 month the beast and false prophet are cast into the lake of fire and Satan is bound for 1000 years. The nations which have been deceived are said to no longer be deceived until the 1000 years are over. The plagues in Rev such as a days wage for a quart of wheat are global in scale and 1/4 of all people die off in the 1st seal judgment. The water has not turned to blood nor have the ships of the sea been destroyed or the two witnesses come forth. The Adventist practice what I call leading you into their wind of doctrine. This issue if you studied Greek and Hebrew and has a 1000 years with your bible alone you would never come to that from the text. Taking what is in the text and relating it is called exegesis and reading into the text is called eisegesis. The Bible teaches no prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation and the very idea of Sunday Sabbath being the mark of the beast is a great example of a private interpretation.

 

[EJ M]

Brother, just an addition to Matt 7:1-2 Which goes on to say, we should judge only after we ourselves are not doing that same sin. We are to judge all things by the word of God.

All will be Judged by the word of God in the Last day. So also are Christ followers to judge all things by the word of God and by the same word will they be judged. 1 Cor 2:15, 6:2-5; John 7:24


Also most of those things you mention about starting the fire and such were under the Old Law. They are not under the New.

Correct, and neither is the commandment to keep the Sabbath in the NT. See Acts 15

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

Correct, and neither is the commandment to keep the Sabbath in the NT. See Acts 15

I don't see any mention of the Moral Law in Acts 15 brother? Could you show me what verse you were speaking of that mentions the Moral law or the Seventh day Sabbath specifically?

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

For those who believe the Mark of Beast described described by John is depicting Sunday Worship, my only question is who was the first to come up with this interpretation?

Don't quote the biblical text itself (since that is the subject of dispute), but quote me an interpreter, the first to lay this argument out. I'm willing to bet it's quite late and contemporary to us and the question I would then ask is, how did the Church misunderstand such a teaching for so long?

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

For those who believe the Mark of Beast described described by John is depicting Sunday Worship, my only question is who was the first to come up with this interpretation?

Don't quote the biblical text itself (since that is the subject of dispute), but quote me an interpreter, the first to lay this argument out. I'm willing to bet it's quite late and contemporary to us and the question I would then ask is, how did the Church misunderstand such a teaching for so long?

The knowledge of the End has been revealed more and more as time went by. The closer we get to the end the more is revealed. So the Church as a whole missing it for a very long period of time is well within reason. Especially considering how much supression of other doctrines was practiced by the Catholic Church, and many protestant groups. Then Islam, and other religions throughout history also had a part in destroying any light that may have shown through.
Daniel 12:4
4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

Ellen white is the first I can think of, though there may have been others that were lost to history(possibly killed for the doctrine they held and whatever writing they had destroyed).

 

[RDKirk]

Now I'm at college, away from home, and I joined a christian fellowship group; with no one who is an Adventist. I see all these Jesus loving people who don't worship on Sunday and at first I questioned their salvation, since they have the mark of the beast because of Sunday, but now I go to church on Sunday also where most of the sermons aren't one dimensional towards just a denomination.

Just still in the waters about this question. People say it is a microchip, Sunday worship, or that those prophecies in Revelation already happened with Emperor Nero.

It is also very hard to open up to my parents about my new faith and leaving Adventism. I am not doing it out of disrespect, but because I want my relationship with Christ to grow, which I think they will despise.

I'm open to plenty of insight, thanks for your time!

Are you saying that a person would have to be a Sunday-worshiping Christian to have the mark of the beast? Atheists will escape the mark of the beast because they don't worship on Sunday?

Satan is far, far too clever to make the mark of the beast something so easily identifiable as a tattoo or microchip.

IMO, the mark of the beast is a spiritual sign, just as our seals are spiritual signs. God can see it, Satan can see it, demons and angels can see it. A person accepts the mark of the beast in his thinking (head) and actions (hand) in conformance with the ways of the Beast.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

The knowledge of the End has been revealed more and more as time went by. The closer we get to the end the more is revealed. So the Church as a whole missing it for a very long period of time is well within reason. Especially considering how much supression of other doctrines was practiced by the Catholic Church, and many protestant groups. Then Islam, and other religions throughout history also had a part in destroying any light that may have shown through.
Daniel 12:4
4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

Ellen white is the first I can think of, though there may have been others that were lost to history(possibly killed for the doctrine they held and whatever writing they had destroyed).

Prove it or I and many others aren't taking the claim seriously. We know of plenty of heretics and their approximate beliefs mainly because the Church cared enough to respond to such people.

Still I wonder how you justify God's inaction letting the Church fall into Satan's hand by worshiping on Satan's high holy day, every week for about two thousand years. Why was God so absent?

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

Prove it or I and many others aren't taking the claim seriously. We know of plenty of heretics and their approximate beliefs mainly because the Church cared enough to respond to such people.

Still I wonder how you justify God's inaction letting the Church fall into Satan's hand by worshiping on Satan's high holy day, every week for about two thousand years. Why was God so absent?

First off, the Church of God is in individuals not in institutions. Second He wasn't absent, there have been many people throughout history who have tried to break from the false traditions instituted by the Catholic Church. These people were given the light of God(truth) so that they could continue on a path that would lead to further enlightenment and pure doctrine.

Yes they cared enough to torture and kill them after asking them a few questions. What accounts we have do not accurately represent the Churches that existed apart from Catholicism. We have for the most part a one sided view of Church history. If they really cared about the truth they would have let them live without persecuting them.

Sure, just read Ellen whites the Great controversy or desire of Ages to get started on understanding my position on Sunday being the Mark of the Beast. I doubt I could go as in depth as she did, you could also read the Shepherd's rod to get a better view of the Mark as well. That should be sufficient proof.

There are mountains of Truth in just the writings of Houteff and Ellen alone just waiting to be dug into, all you have to do is read it for yourself. Have you ever read any of their writings(which all have a multitude of Scripture to back them up)? If not then how can you know they are wrong unless you take the time to fully hear them out(Proverbs 18:13)?