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Is the Apostle John still alive?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by Achilles6129, Dec 26, 2013.

  1. Strong in Him

    Strong in Him I can do all things through Christ Supporter

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    Seems pretty pointless.

    What evidence is there from Scripture that Jesus said, "this is in fact my will; John will remain alive til I return"?

    Psalm 90:10 says that the years of a man's life are 70 (three score and 10) or 80 if we have the strength. so can you give a reason, from Scripture, why John managed to live for 2000+? As I said before, even Methuselah only made it to 969.

    No he didn't.
    What he was saying to Peter was; never mind about John's life or the plans I have for him - even if I decided to let him live until I come again, that has nothing to do with you.

    There is simply no evidence from Scripture that Jesus is giving a prophecy or a promise about the length of John's life. The rest of the passage says that there was a rumour going around, after Jesus said this, that John would not die, but John himself tells us that Jesus did not say this, he only said "IF I want him to remain .....".

    There's no harm in speculation unless you are reading into Scripture something that isn't there and using that to support a theory.
     
  2. rockytopva

    rockytopva Love to pray! :) Supporter

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    And the saying pleased the whole multitude: and they chose Stephen, a man full of faith and of the Holy Ghost, and Philip, and Prochorus, and Nicanor, and Timon, and Parmenas, and Nicolas a proselyte of Antioch: - Acts 6:5

    Let see... This was about 35 AD. If the epistles of John were written in 95 AD that means Prochorus would have been very old when he wrote for John.
     
  3. Achilles6129

    Achilles6129 Veteran

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    The fact that Christ himself, at no-one's urging, advanced the idea.

    No...it is talking about Israel. Obviously people have lived longer than 80 years. I gave a reason John would have managed to live for 2000 years - God supernaturally preserving his body. Remember that Adam's body was never meant to die - it was meant to live forever. Adam would be alive right now had he not taken from the tree of the knowledge of good/evil and eaten.

    Right. The "IF" I want him to remain part means that the answer could be either yes or no. We don't know for sure. But it could be yes. Then again, it could be no. So we have to at least admit the possiblity that John was to live until the second coming ;)
     
  4. Strong in Him

    Strong in Him I can do all things through Christ Supporter

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    But he's not "advancing an idea".
    Jesus had just told Peter that when he was old, people would lead him to where he did not want to go - and John says that by this comment, Jesus was indicating how Peter would die. Peter's response to Jesus' words was "what about him, Lord" (meaning John), then Jesus said, "if I want him to live until I return, what is it to you?"
    In other words, YOU follow me, Peter; keep your eyes on me and where I lead you; where I lead others, or what I require of them, is not your concern.

    Which is a fanciful idea with no Scriptural proof.

    If the apostle John was alive today, he would be BIG news - no one has lived that long. I am also certain he would have something to say to the church and about the state it's in.

    Common sense alone should tell us that there are no 2000 year old men in the world. Again, if he was alive, he would not be hidden away, he would be proclaiming the Gospel, and probably teaching the church too.

    We don't have to admit anything of the sort. There is no evidence for it and the date of John's death is not the point Jesus is making in John 21.
     
  5. Achilles6129

    Achilles6129 Veteran

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    We're going in circles here ;)

    The entire point is he would probably be one of the two witnesses. So he wouldn't be revealed until the very end.
     
  6. Standing Up

    Standing Up On and on

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    Methuselah was the outlier of the fulfillment of "in the day you sin, you die", with "day" from God's POV (1000 years in man's years). So, John would be what? 2 days old only.
     
  7. Messy

    Messy Well-Known Member

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    And the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not strive[a] with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.”
     
  8. Achilles6129

    Achilles6129 Veteran

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    I believe that was talking about man's time until the Flood.
     
  9. Messy

    Messy Well-Known Member

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    Matthew 16
    27 For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. 28 “Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.”


    If you read this the same way, not only John is more than 2000 years old now.
    Funny, my son just told me with Christmas: It's Jesus' birthday. He's 2013 now.
     
  10. Spinnaker

    Spinnaker Look away! I'm hideous!

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    Is St. John alive in Christ and with him in Paradise? Absolutely. Is he alive and walking the Earth á là Dracula? Nope.
     
  11. Lion King

    Lion King Veni, vidi, vici

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    No one is in the Paradise of God as of yet. John is still dead and buried, and patiently awaits the resurrection of the dead together with all the saints. Paradise is our final destination.

    Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who is victorious, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God. Revelation 2:7
     
  12. Achilles6129

    Achilles6129 Veteran

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    That passage is talking about spiritual death, not physical. John 8:51 - whoever keeps my saying shall never see death.
     
  13. Lion King

    Lion King Veni, vidi, vici

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    Actually, that passage is speaking about the transfiguration on the mountain. Some of Christ's disciples saw a VISION of the LORD in all His glory before the appointed time.
     
  14. Messy

    Messy Well-Known Member

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    Until? Before the flood they were much older and gradually died younger after the flood until 120 is the maximum now.
    It's impossible unless he got a new body in a split second, which would mean he didn't physically die, like with the rapture. I could believe that, because if Henoch was raptured and Elijah, why not John? Imo he was the one that was most close to the Lord.
     
  15. Messy

    Messy Well-Known Member

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    Oh wow, thanks, same word: thanatos. Finally I now what I can answer a preterist who asked me about it.
     
  16. Knee V

    Knee V It's phonetic.

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    Jesus suggested no such thing. He told the other disciples to mind their own business. Anything else is wishful thinking and conjecture with no factual basis.
     
  17. Standing Up

    Standing Up On and on

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    What do you mean conjecture? We know exactly how Mary was born, lived, and died with less information ;)
     
  18. Strong in Him

    Strong in Him I can do all things through Christ Supporter

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    Yes, because you seem to be ignoring what I am saying and just repeating your own idea.

    The disciples seemed to have believed, for a while, that this meant John would not die, but as John himself explains, Jesus did not say that.
     
  19. SG9

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    It is written in the Apocrypha of John that he laid himself down to rest and gave up the ghost. But it is also said that Christ comes with all of His saints, not just John. The Little Book was written for the future to be revealed at the end. IMO Thanks :)
     
  20. Achilles6129

    Achilles6129 Veteran

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    Yes, it is talking about 120 years until the Flood. Not a 120-year human lifespan.

    No problem. Here are a few passages:

    "51 Truly, truly, I say to you, if anyone keeps my word, he will never see death.”" Jn. 8:51 (ESV)

    "25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life.[d] Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, 26 and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?”" Jn. 11:25-26 (ESV)

    "49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. 50 This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”" Jn. 6:49-51 (ESV)



    Ditto :D
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2013
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