Is the “Epiklesis” being the determination of the Eucharist wrong?

[TheLostCoin]

The Roman Catholic Church puts forth the claim that the point of “transubstantiation” in the Mass or the Liturgy are the Words of Institution. That is, when the Priest says “This is my Body, etc.” and “This is my Blood, etc.”

I’ve found that in opposition to the fact of such “scholastic developments,” the Orthodox while saying that “we don’t know when it happens specifically,” will also say that “the point we know when the Eucharist becomes the Eucharist is the Epiklesis.”

That is, when the Priest says the bread and wine to become the Body and Blood, and asks the Holy Spirit to make the change.

In fact, so important is this that the Western Rite Orthodox actually have an artificial Epiklesis inserted into the Mass to ensure Sacramental validity.

However, there is significant evidence that - as a matter of fact - the Eastern Orthodox are wrong on this point.

For one, Saint Paul himself, when discussing the Eucharist, actually does not mention any such Epiklesis on this matter, rather only invokes the Words of Institution.

1 Corinthians 11:18-29

For two, the Roman Mass Sacramentaries from the Pre-Schism that we have don’t have any such Epiklesis.

For three, the traditional author of the Byzantine Liturgy - Saint John Chrysostom - himself says that the Words of Institution directly change the Body and Blood into the Eucharist.

“But it is time then to approach that fearful table. Therefore, let us all approach with fitting discretion and sobriety. And let no one be Judas any longer; let no one be wicked; let no one possess venom, bearing one thing in his mouth and another in his mind. Christ is present, and He Who set in order that meal of old also sets this one in order now. For it is not a man who causes the elements that are set forth to become the Body and Blood of Christ, but Christ Himself, Who was crucified for our sake. Fulfilling the figure, the priest stands and utters the words. But the power and the grace belong to God. This is My Body, the priest says. These words transform the elements set forth; and just as the words "Increase and multiply and fill the earth" (Gen. 1:28) were said once, but throughout all time they give our nature the power to beget children, so also from that time until now and until His Coming, these words that were said once accomplish the perfect Sacrifice on each altar table in the churches.”

Homily on the Betrayal of Judas (St. John Chrysostom) | MYSTAGOGY RESOURCE CENTER

For four, the Oriental Orthodox Churches - at least as far as the Coptic Church is concerned - according to Father Peter Harrington - believes that the Words of Institution are the point when we know the Eucharist changes.

For five, we can actually see this theology reflected in the Byzantine Liturgy, by the sole fact that the Faithful Cross themselves when the Words of Institution are repeated by the priest.

In spite of all this evidence,
1. Why do the Orthodox believe that the Epiklesis are the words that change the Bread and the Wine?
2. Why do the Orthodox even have an Epiklesis?
3. What evidence exists for the mystical and Epiklesis position of the Orthodox?

 

[peregrinus2017]

Forgive my presumption, but these words posted above jumped out at me.

. For it is not a man who causes the elements that are set forth to become the Body and Blood of Christ, but Christ Himself, Who was crucified for our sake. Fulfilling the figure, the priest stands and utters the words. But the power and the grace belong to God.

To say that it is the words spoken that change the bread and wine seems to miss the point St. John Chrysostom just made above.

 

[Monk Brendan]

The Roman Catholic Church puts forth the claim that the point of “transubstantiation” in the Mass or the Liturgy are the Words of Institution. That is, when the Priest says “This is my Body, etc.” and “This is my Blood, etc.”

I’ve found that in opposition to the fact of such “scholastic developments,” the Orthodox while saying that “we don’t know when it happens specifically,” will also say that “the point we know when the Eucharist becomes the Eucharist is the Epiklesis.”

That is, when the Priest says the bread and wine to become the Body and Blood, and asks the Holy Spirit to make the change.

In fact, so important is this that the Western Rite Orthodox actually have an artificial Epiklesis inserted into the Mass to ensure Sacramental validity.

However, there is significant evidence that - as a matter of fact - the Eastern Orthodox are wrong on this point.

For one, Saint Paul himself, when discussing the Eucharist, actually does not mention any such Epiklesis on this matter, rather only invokes the Words of Institution.

1 Corinthians 11:18-29

For two, the Roman Mass Sacramentaries from the Pre-Schism that we have don’t have any such Epiklesis.

For three, the traditional author of the Byzantine Liturgy - Saint John Chrysostom - himself says that the Words of Institution directly change the Body and Blood into the Eucharist.

“But it is time then to approach that fearful table. Therefore, let us all approach with fitting discretion and sobriety. And let no one be Judas any longer; let no one be wicked; let no one possess venom, bearing one thing in his mouth and another in his mind. Christ is present, and He Who set in order that meal of old also sets this one in order now. For it is not a man who causes the elements that are set forth to become the Body and Blood of Christ, but Christ Himself, Who was crucified for our sake. Fulfilling the figure, the priest stands and utters the words. But the power and the grace belong to God. This is My Body, the priest says. These words transform the elements set forth; and just as the words "Increase and multiply and fill the earth" (Gen. 1:28) were said once, but throughout all time they give our nature the power to beget children, so also from that time until now and until His Coming, these words that were said once accomplish the perfect Sacrifice on each altar table in the churches.”

Homily on the Betrayal of Judas (St. John Chrysostom) | MYSTAGOGY RESOURCE CENTER

For four, the Oriental Orthodox Churches - at least as far as the Coptic Church is concerned - according to Father Peter Harrington - believes that the Words of Institution are the point when we know the Eucharist changes.

For five, we can actually see this theology reflected in the Byzantine Liturgy, by the sole fact that the Faithful Cross themselves when the Words of Institution are repeated by the priest.

In spite of all this evidence,
1. Why do the Orthodox believe that the Epiklesis are the words that change the Bread and the Wine?
2. Why do the Orthodox even have an Epiklesis?
3. What evidence exists for the mystical and Epiklesis position of the Orthodox?

Did you know the Liturgy of Addai and Mari of the Assyrian Church does not contain the words of institution.

But anyone with two wits to clap together can tell the intend to accomplish the mystery of the Eucharist.

 

[ArmyMatt]

if you think we think that the epeklesis is where the Bread and Wine turn to the Body and Blood, you need to read St Basil's Liturgy.

 

[TheLostCoin]

if you think we think that the epeklesis is where the Bread and Wine turn to the Body and Blood, you need to read St Basil's Liturgy.

Does Saint Basil’s Liturgy not have an Epiklesis, or wording that suggests that the Eucharist has transformed before the Epiklesis?

I’m going off of what my Priest told me and what I’ve read online.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Does Saint Basil’s Liturgy not have an Epiklesis, or wording that suggests that the Eucharist has transformed before the Epiklesis?

I’m going off of what my Priest told me and what I’ve read online.

different wording. St Basil's says that the point of the epiklesis is to reveal the change which has already taken place at some point.

 

[AMM]

different wording. St Basil's says that the point of the epiklesis is to reveal the change which has already taken place at some point.

GOARCH has the text of St Basil on their website, but I don't see what you're referring to. It looks essentially the same to St John to my eyes, but wikipedia and orthowiki say what you're saying too, that St Basil indicates the change has already happened. Are there different texts for St Basil's liturgy perhaps? Or a translation difference?

For when He was about to go forth to His voluntary, ever memorable, and life-giving death, on the night on which He was delivered up for the life of the world, He took bread in His holy and pure hands, and presenting it to You, God and Father, and offering thanks, blessing, sanctifying, and breaking it:

He gave it to His holy disciples and apostles saying: Take, eat, this is my body which is broken for you and for the forgiveness of sins.

People: Amen.

Priest: Likewise, He took the cup of the fruit of vine, and having mingled it, offering thanks, blessing, and sanctifying it.

Priest: He gave it to His holy disciples and apostles saying: Drink of this all of you. This is my blood of the new Covenant, shed for you and for many, for the forgiveness of sins.

People: Amen.

Priest: Do this in remembrance of me. For as often as you eat this Bread and drink this Cup, you proclaim my death, and you confess my resurrection. Therefore, Master, we also, remembering His saving passion and life giving cross, His three; day burial and resurrection from the dead, His ascension into heaven, and enthronement at Your right hand, God and Father, and His glorious and awesome second coming.

Priest: We offer to You these gifts from Your own gifts in all and for all.

People: We praise You, we bless You, we give thanks to You, and we pray to You, Lord our God.

Priest: Therefore, most holy Master, we also, Your sinful and unworthy servants, whom You have made worthy to serve at Your holy altar, not because of our own righteousness (for we have not done anything good upon the earth), but because of Your mercy and compassion, which You have so richly poured upon us, we dare to approach Your holy altar, and bring forth the symbols of the holy Body and Blood of Your Christ. We pray to You and call upon You, O Holy of Holies, that by the favor of Your goodness, Your Holy Spirit may come upon us and upon the gifts here presented, to bless, sanctify, and make this bread to be the precious Body of our Lord and God and Savior Jesus Christ.

He blesses the holy Bread.

Deacon: Amen.

Priest: And this cup to be the precious Blood of our Lord and God and Savior Jesus Christ.

He blesses the holy Cup.

Deacon: Amen.

He blesses them both.

Priest: Shed for the life and salvation of the world.

Deacon: Amen. Amen. Amen.

Priest: And unite us all to one another who become partakers of the one Bread and the Cup in the communion of the one Holy Spirit. Grant that none of us may partake of the holy Body and Blood of Your Christ to judgment or condemnation; but, that we may find mercy and grace with all the saints who through the ages have pleased You: forefathers, fathers, patriarchs, prophets, apostles, preachers, evangelists, martyrs, confessors, teachers, and every righteous spirit made perfect in faith.​

 

[AMM]

And as TLC pointed out - the added epiclesis to the western rite mass is a bit odd. I don't think it's wrong or heretical or anything, but it feels out of place. Especially because I've heard liturgical scholars say that the Roman Canon contains an epiclesis, it's just implicit rather than explicit. And it's not as though Rome didn't have the eucharist for 1000 years.

As an aside, I also think it feels out of place to include St John Chrysostom's pre-communion prayers ("I believe O Lord and I confess...") in the western rite. Again - absolutely nothing wrong with it. I love those prayers and I still remember joyfully praying them on the day of my chrismation: "accept me today as a communicant of thy mystical supper" (I had only prayed the confession beforehand, but refrained from praying that I be accepted at the eucharistic altar while I was a catechumen, since I wasn't going to commune. So saying them for the first time was wonderful). Nonetheless, I wish an equally beautiful prayer was found from a western saint, it seems more appropriate for the western rite

 

[ArmyMatt]

GOARCH has the text of St Basil on their website, but I don't see what you're referring to. It looks essentially the same to St John to my eyes, but wikipedia and orthowiki say what you're saying too, that St Basil indicates the change has already happened. Are there different texts for St Basil's liturgy perhaps? Or a translation difference?

For when He was about to go forth to His voluntary, ever memorable, and life-giving death, on the night on which He was delivered up for the life of the world, He took bread in His holy and pure hands, and presenting it to You, God and Father, and offering thanks, blessing, sanctifying, and breaking it:

He gave it to His holy disciples and apostles saying: Take, eat, this is my body which is broken for you and for the forgiveness of sins.

People: Amen.

Priest: Likewise, He took the cup of the fruit of vine, and having mingled it, offering thanks, blessing, and sanctifying it.

Priest: He gave it to His holy disciples and apostles saying: Drink of this all of you. This is my blood of the new Covenant, shed for you and for many, for the forgiveness of sins.

People: Amen.

Priest: Do this in remembrance of me. For as often as you eat this Bread and drink this Cup, you proclaim my death, and you confess my resurrection. Therefore, Master, we also, remembering His saving passion and life giving cross, His three; day burial and resurrection from the dead, His ascension into heaven, and enthronement at Your right hand, God and Father, and His glorious and awesome second coming.

Priest: We offer to You these gifts from Your own gifts in all and for all.

People: We praise You, we bless You, we give thanks to You, and we pray to You, Lord our God.

Priest: Therefore, most holy Master, we also, Your sinful and unworthy servants, whom You have made worthy to serve at Your holy altar, not because of our own righteousness (for we have not done anything good upon the earth), but because of Your mercy and compassion, which You have so richly poured upon us, we dare to approach Your holy altar, and bring forth the symbols of the holy Body and Blood of Your Christ. We pray to You and call upon You, O Holy of Holies, that by the favor of Your goodness, Your Holy Spirit may come upon us and upon the gifts here presented, to bless, sanctify, and make this bread to be the precious Body of our Lord and God and Savior Jesus Christ.

He blesses the holy Bread.

Deacon: Amen.

Priest: And this cup to be the precious Blood of our Lord and God and Savior Jesus Christ.

He blesses the holy Cup.

Deacon: Amen.

He blesses them both.

Priest: Shed for the life and salvation of the world.

Deacon: Amen. Amen. Amen.

Priest: And unite us all to one another who become partakers of the one Bread and the Cup in the communion of the one Holy Spirit. Grant that none of us may partake of the holy Body and Blood of Your Christ to judgment or condemnation; but, that we may find mercy and grace with all the saints who through the ages have pleased You: forefathers, fathers, patriarchs, prophets, apostles, preachers, evangelists, martyrs, confessors, teachers, and every righteous spirit made perfect in faith.​

it should read to bless, sanctify, and to show, not bless, sanctify, and make.

 

[Not David]

I'm confused. When do the bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ?

 

[ArmyMatt]

I'm confused. When do the bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ?

during the Liturgy

 

[prodromos]

I'm confused. When do the bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ?

When the Holy Spirit changes them.

 

[All4Christ]

I'm confused. When do the bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ?

St Ambrose taught that the consecration is by the words of our Lord Jesus.

You perhaps say: 'My bread is usual.' But the bread is bread before the words of the sacraments; when consecration has been added, from bread it becomes the flesh of Christ. So let us confirm this, how it is possible that what is bread is the body of Christ. By what words, then, is the consecration and by whose expressions? By those of the Lord Jesus. For all the rest that are said in the preceding are said by the priest: praise to God, prayer is offered, there is a petition for the people, for kings, for the rest. When it comes to performing a venerable sacrament, then the priest uses not his own expressions, but he uses the expressions of Christ. Thus the expression of Christ performs this sacrament." St. Ambrose Of Milan, "The Sacraments" Book 4, Ch.4:14.

St Justin Martyr says it is by the Eucharistic prayer set down to us by Jesus.

We call this food Eucharist; and no one else is permitted to partake of it, except one who believes our teaching to be true and who has been washed in the washing which is for the remission of sins and for regeneration [Baptism], and is thereby living as Christ has enjoined. For not as common bread nor common drink do we receive these; but since Jesus Christ our Savior was made incarnate by the word of God and had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so too, as we have been taught, the food which has been made into the Eucharist by the Eucharistic prayer set down by Him, and by the change of which our blood and flesh is nourished, is both the flesh and blood of that incarnate Jesus. ST. JUSTIN MARTYR (c. 150 AD) (First Apology 66)

St Athanasius sums it up well:

You shall see the Levites bringing loaves and a cup of wine, and placing them on the table. So long as the prayers of supplication and entreaties have not been made, there is only bread and wine. But after the great and wonderful prayers have been completed, then the bread is become the Body, and the wine the Blood, of our Lord Jesus Christ... Let us approach the celebration of the mysteries. This bread and this wine, so long as the prayers and supplications have not taken place, remain simply what they are. But after the great prayers and holy supplications have been sent forth, the Word comes down into the bread and wine -- and thus is His Body confected. ST. ATHANASIUS (c. 295 - 373 A.D.) (Sermon to the Newly Baptized, from Eutyches)

The testament of the church fathers consistently teaches that before the Eucharistic prayers, it is bread and wine. After the prayers, it is the Body and Blood of Christ. The exact moment doesn’t really need to be defined.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I would also add, that there is a reason St Basil doesn't include the line, "Making the change by Thy Holy Spirit."

 

[All4Christ]

I would also add, that there is a reason St Basil doesn't include the line, "Making the change by Thy Holy Spirit."

Based on the teachings of the Church Fathers, seems like the epiklesis is really a pronouncement that the change has happened and that it is the body and blood of Christ. It doesn’t seem to mean that “the bread and wine will change right now [upon the epiklesis prayer]”. Would you consider that to be accurate?

St Cyril seems to point more towards the epiklesis being the point of transformation, but most seem to say that the epiklesis is a confirmation of what happened.

Then, having sanctified ourselves by these spiritual songs, we call upon the benevolent God to send out the Holy Spirit upon the gifts which have been laid out: that He may make the bread the Body of Christ, and the wine the Blood of Christ; for whatsoever the Holy Spirit touches, that is sanctified and changed.(St. Cyril, 23 [Mystagogic 5], 7)