Is not Voting a sin even if there are not Good Candidates?

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Really? So when I brush my teeth in the morning, I am sinning? I mean, if we're going to be literal here....

Do you really want an honest answer ?

 

[createdtoworship]

I answered the question precisely as given in scripture.

Oh, do you want an interpretation?

Sure, one can brush his teeth in sin, if his purpose is nestled in glorifying his flesh rather than glorifying God.

do you brush your teeth to glorify God? Or beautify, the flesh?

I guess we are all in sin

 

[createdtoworship]

tomorrow pro-family leaders, christian leaders, etc, will meet with trump.

While trump is a moderate to loose conservative, He will hear our the requests of these groups.

depending I hope, on the percentage that vote for him, his constituents will hopefully be heard and aided.

(please pray for that meeting)

Here is a note from AFA president that met with trump first hand....

"
Franklin Graham prayed to open the event. Dr. Ben Carson spoke and told us about the Donald Trump he had come to appreciate. Gov. Mike Huckabee served as moderator and sat across from Mr. Trump. Trump entertained questions from the likes of Dr. David Jeremiah, Dr. James Dobson, Tony Perkins, Kelly Shackelford and Sammy Rodriguez. The questions were about religious freedom, Israel, potential Supreme Court nominees and abortion. I thought his strongest answers were about the type of judges he would appoint. I believe he fully understands the importance of this issue and said all his judges would be vetted by the Federalist Society -- a stalwart conservative organization. To me, this may be the most important issue of this campaign from the perspective of AFA and our supporters. After all, the next president will likely appoint two or more Supreme Court justices in the next four years. As we have seen over the last few years, it doesn't matter how many good laws are passed if the courts are going to strike them down.

Trump's weakness is that he did not clearly state his views in answer to the questions asked by Perkins and Shackelford about when religious freedom and the LGBT movement come into conflict, other than to say that these matters will be decided by the courts. He repeatedly said he was for religious freedom and his fallback position was that he would appoint judges who would defend religious freedom.

Mr. Trump also said he was tired of the political correctness surrounding matters of our Christian heritage and used Christmas an an example. He said companies want to profit of Christmas but then don't want to use the word "Christmas." He said he says "Merry Christmas" and thinks the PC crowd just wants to change the greeting to something more generic because it's another attempt to diminish the role of Christianity in America. (This made me wonder if he's been reading the AFA Journal. Ha!)

Trump answered Dr. Jeremiah's question about Israel saying he would be a strong supporter of the nation of Israel and never understood Jewish Americans who vote for Democrats who don't support Israel. Trump also understands the threat to our country by Islamic jihadism. He has taken a lot of heat from the liberal media for criticizing the problems within Islam.

On a personal note, I met several people who have known Donald Trump personally for several years and said he is not the brash, arrogant, sometimes rude person he appears to be on television. I will say without the media cameras in his face, he was pleasant, relaxed, funny and more thoughtful.

I think it was admirable and honorable for Trump to meet with Christian leaders. He is not our enemy. I believe he has instincts that are reverent and patriotic. He's 69 years old and remembers an America that was once a great country but has lost her way. But he also comes from a very secular world and that way of thinking is a part of who he is. In some ways, he strikes me as an enigma, a man still searching for spiritual answers in his life. But that's just my opinion. I will say this, he is listening to some great men of God that I have a lot of respect for, and that's a good thing.

To conclude, who but the Lord knows what lies ahead for Donald Trump? He wasn't my first choice for president but the majority of GOP voters chose him. Now either he or Hillary Clinton will be the next president of the United States of America. So if one of them shows genuine interest in understanding Christians better and says he will be our friend, I believe we should tell him what we think and where we stand. To use a sports word, I think he's coachable.

I'm glad I came to New York. It was worth it. I would ask you to pray for Mr. Trump and our country."

 

[bhsmte]

Here is a note from AFA president that met with trump first hand....

"
Franklin Graham prayed to open the event. Dr. Ben Carson spoke and told us about the Donald Trump he had come to appreciate. Gov. Mike Huckabee served as moderator and sat across from Mr. Trump. Trump entertained questions from the likes of Dr. David Jeremiah, Dr. James Dobson, Tony Perkins, Kelly Shackelford and Sammy Rodriguez. The questions were about religious freedom, Israel, potential Supreme Court nominees and abortion. I thought his strongest answers were about the type of judges he would appoint. I believe he fully understands the importance of this issue and said all his judges would be vetted by the Federalist Society -- a stalwart conservative organization. To me, this may be the most important issue of this campaign from the perspective of AFA and our supporters. After all, the next president will likely appoint two or more Supreme Court justices in the next four years. As we have seen over the last few years, it doesn't matter how many good laws are passed if the courts are going to strike them down.

Trump's weakness is that he did not clearly state his views in answer to the questions asked by Perkins and Shackelford about when religious freedom and the LGBT movement come into conflict, other than to say that these matters will be decided by the courts. He repeatedly said he was for religious freedom and his fallback position was that he would appoint judges who would defend religious freedom.

Mr. Trump also said he was tired of the political correctness surrounding matters of our Christian heritage and used Christmas an an example. He said companies want to profit of Christmas but then don't want to use the word "Christmas." He said he says "Merry Christmas" and thinks the PC crowd just wants to change the greeting to something more generic because it's another attempt to diminish the role of Christianity in America. (This made me wonder if he's been reading the AFA Journal. Ha!)

Trump answered Dr. Jeremiah's question about Israel saying he would be a strong supporter of the nation of Israel and never understood Jewish Americans who vote for Democrats who don't support Israel. Trump also understands the threat to our country by Islamic jihadism. He has taken a lot of heat from the liberal media for criticizing the problems within Islam.

On a personal note, I met several people who have known Donald Trump personally for several years and said he is not the brash, arrogant, sometimes rude person he appears to be on television. I will say without the media cameras in his face, he was pleasant, relaxed, funny and more thoughtful.

I think it was admirable and honorable for Trump to meet with Christian leaders. He is not our enemy. I believe he has instincts that are reverent and patriotic. He's 69 years old and remembers an America that was once a great country but has lost her way. But he also comes from a very secular world and that way of thinking is a part of who he is. In some ways, he strikes me as an enigma, a man still searching for spiritual answers in his life. But that's just my opinion. I will say this, he is listening to some great men of God that I have a lot of respect for, and that's a good thing.

To conclude, who but the Lord knows what lies ahead for Donald Trump? He wasn't my first choice for president but the majority of GOP voters chose him. Now either he or Hillary Clinton will be the next president of the United States of America. So if one of them shows genuine interest in understanding Christians better and says he will be our friend, I believe we should tell him what we think and where we stand. To use a sports word, I think he's coachable.

I'm glad I came to New York. It was worth it. I would ask you to pray for Mr. Trump and our country."

Good for Donny.

 

[createdtoworship]

Good for Donny.

what part is good,

I started another thread on this topic alone:

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...istian-leadership-meeting-with-trump.7953061/

 

[RDKirk]

do you brush your teeth to glorify God? Or beautify, the flesh?

I guess we are all in sin

I am entering a period in my life where I'm able to devote more time to serving the Body of Christ. At the same time, I'm entering a period of my life where the ravages of advancing age on my flesh are clearly reducing my ability to serve, and will reduce it much more quickly if I fail to exercise wise stewardship of my body.

I'm not concerned about impressing anyone with my appearance--I'm not "looking for a new love, baby, a new love, baby, a new love, baby." But I do need to steward my body properly to get the most use out of it.

 

[createdtoworship]

about that time to vote, and do our christian civic duty.

another month or so.

thats it.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

about that time to vote, and do our christian civic duty.

another month or so.

thats it.

Did you see the movie "Dead Code" on television or otherwise lately?

quote from the movie "This is an odd game. The only way to win is not to play."

Likewise playing with or loving the world and its ways is a lose-lose for believers, like rooting for LION A or LION B in the arena where they are devouring Christians. To root for either one or any of the LIONS is sinful.

 

[createdtoworship]

Did you see the movie "Dead Code" on television or otherwise lately?

quote from the movie "This is an odd game. The only way to win is not to play."

Likewise playing with or loving the world and its ways is a lose-lose for believers, like rooting for LION A or LION B in the arena where they are devouring Christians. To root for either one or any of the LIONS is sinful.

so heavenly focussed that your no earthly good?

we are to be lights on a hill.

not hidden under a bushel.

(it's biblical)

 

[createdtoworship]

This election we must brush our teeth. I mean, to prevent truth decay....well. you know what I mean.

“Registering to vote and voting in the general election on November 8 is critically important,” said AFA president Tim Wildmon. “It is a constitutional privilege, and it is our moral responsibility, when possible, to elect God-fearing men and women.”

If you’re not registered to vote, there’s still time. Many state election laws allow for voter registration as late as 30 days – some even later – prior to the election. This is also important if you have recently moved because your voting precinct is tied to your current residence.

While most attention has been on the U.S. presidential race, there are also elections for local, state, and other federal level offices. Voter turnout is especially important this election because of an increasing antagonistic spirit stemming from the presidential primaries, a reality that many leaders believe puts conservative candidates at greater risk.

Liberty in the balance

Franklin Graham, during his Decision America Tour 2016, has repeatedly said, “I want to challenge Christians to boldly live out their faith and to pray for our nation and its leaders. I want to encourage Christians to get out and vote, and to cast their ballots for candidates who uphold biblical principles.”

America’s constitutional principles are literally hanging in the balance. One of those critical principles is religious liberty. The First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution guarantees the fundamental right to religious liberty. Yet, the politically correct secular agenda is vigorously attempting to redefine the freedom of religious expression to worship only in the confines of a church building, but this limitation is unconstitutional.

Why is this so important? Prior to ratification of the First Amendment in 1791, each colony granted legal standing to only one religion – either Congregational or Anglican. Christians not belonging to the government (colony) sponsored church often encountered severe discrimination.

For example, court records in Virginia describe how Baptists were imprisoned for praying. Their worship services were disrupted by dissenters, and some were beaten or shot for practicing their faith.

Recent Supreme Court rulings have eliminated and eroded religious liberty related to marriage and sanctity of human life. The pendulum of state-sanctioned religious discrimination is in full swing, returning toward the discriminatory times of early, colonial days.

Line up at the polls

The next president will likely nominate at least three justices to serve on the U.S. Supreme Court. These justices and other federally appointed judges will arguably shape the judicial landscape for the next 40 years.

Christians should exercise their religious liberty and influence civil government before it’s too late. Just as Nehemiah appealed to King Artaxerxes of Persia to restore the ruins of Jerusalem and the Temple (Ezra 7), so should there be people of influence today who work with civic leaders to restore righteousness in our nation.

Such a restoration includes identifying and working with leaders who endorse biblical beliefs, values, and convictions – including religious liberty and the sanctity of human life. Could God use a non-believer to restore righteousness to a nation? Yes. King Artaxerxes was a non-believer.

Deciding which candidate to support in an election is a matter between the voter and God. In making that decision, it is essential that Christians pray for wisdom and discernment and let their decision be based on faith because “everything that does not come from faith is sin” (Romans 14:23)."

non copywrite, quote from AFA.net:

http://www.afa.net/the-stand/election/2016/07/register-to-vote-defend-religious-liberty/

 

[createdtoworship]

This election we must brush our teeth. I mean, to prevent truth decay....well. you know what I mean.

“Registering to vote and voting in the general election on November 8 is critically important,” said AFA president Tim Wildmon. “It is a constitutional privilege, and it is our moral responsibility, when possible, to elect God-fearing men and women.”

If you’re not registered to vote, there’s still time. Many state election laws allow for voter registration as late as 30 days – some even later – prior to the election. This is also important if you have recently moved because your voting precinct is tied to your current residence.

While most attention has been on the U.S. presidential race, there are also elections for local, state, and other federal level offices. Voter turnout is especially important this election because of an increasing antagonistic spirit stemming from the presidential primaries, a reality that many leaders believe puts conservative candidates at greater risk.

Liberty in the balance

Franklin Graham, during his Decision America Tour 2016, has repeatedly said, “I want to challenge Christians to boldly live out their faith and to pray for our nation and its leaders. I want to encourage Christians to get out and vote, and to cast their ballots for candidates who uphold biblical principles.”

America’s constitutional principles are literally hanging in the balance. One of those critical principles is religious liberty. The First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution guarantees the fundamental right to religious liberty. Yet, the politically correct secular agenda is vigorously attempting to redefine the freedom of religious expression to worship only in the confines of a church building, but this limitation is unconstitutional.

Why is this so important? Prior to ratification of the First Amendment in 1791, each colony granted legal standing to only one religion – either Congregational or Anglican. Christians not belonging to the government (colony) sponsored church often encountered severe discrimination.

For example, court records in Virginia describe how Baptists were imprisoned for praying. Their worship services were disrupted by dissenters, and some were beaten or shot for practicing their faith.

Recent Supreme Court rulings have eliminated and eroded religious liberty related to marriage and sanctity of human life. The pendulum of state-sanctioned religious discrimination is in full swing, returning toward the discriminatory times of early, colonial days.

Line up at the polls

The next president will likely nominate at least three justices to serve on the U.S. Supreme Court. These justices and other federally appointed judges will arguably shape the judicial landscape for the next 40 years.

Christians should exercise their religious liberty and influence civil government before it’s too late. Just as Nehemiah appealed to King Artaxerxes of Persia to restore the ruins of Jerusalem and the Temple (Ezra 7), so should there be people of influence today who work with civic leaders to restore righteousness in our nation.

Such a restoration includes identifying and working with leaders who endorse biblical beliefs, values, and convictions – including religious liberty and the sanctity of human life. Could God use a non-believer to restore righteousness to a nation? Yes. King Artaxerxes was a non-believer.

Deciding which candidate to support in an election is a matter between the voter and God. In making that decision, it is essential that Christians pray for wisdom and discernment and let their decision be based on faith because “everything that does not come from faith is sin” (Romans 14:23)."

non copywrite, quote from AFA.net:

http://www.afa.net/the-stand/election/2016/07/register-to-vote-defend-religious-liberty/

I am doing my responsibility to vote, even if I don't personally like the best candidate.

it's a matter of who is more righteous. Both are sinners, but one is less of one, and we MUST vote for that one, regardless of how other emotions are tied up into it.

 

[smaneck]

This election we must brush our teeth. I mean, to prevent truth decay....well. you know what I mean.

If you are trying to prevent 'truth decay' this article won't help. It is so full of distortions I don't knwo whereto begin.

Franklin Graham, during his Decision America Tour 2016, has repeatedly said, “I want to challenge Christians to boldly live out their faith and to pray for our nation and its leaders. I want to encourage Christians to get out and vote, and to cast their ballots for candidates who uphold biblical principles.”

Like the hatred Franklin Graham spews?

Why is this so important? Prior to ratification of the First Amendment in 1791, each colony granted legal standing to only one religion – either Congregational or Anglican. Christians not belonging to the government (colony) sponsored church often encountered severe discrimination.

Uh, no. Maryland started out as a Catholic colony, Rhode Island was founded by a Unitarian, Pennsylvania by a Quaker. New York was probably the most pluralistic colony with New Jersey a close second.

Recent Supreme Court rulings have eliminated and eroded religious liberty related to marriage and sanctity of human life.

Really? Tell me what Supreme Court decision forced Christians to have abortions or perform gay marriages?

Christians should exercise their religious liberty and influence civil government before it’s too late. Just as Nehemiah appealed to King Artaxerxes of Persia to restore the ruins of Jerusalem and the Temple (Ezra 7), so should there be people of influence today who work with civic leaders to restore righteousness in our nation.

So the issue is not religious liberty but the ability to impose your religious beliefs on others.

Such a restoration includes identifying and working with leaders who endorse biblical beliefs, values, and convictions – including religious liberty and the sanctity of human life. Could God use a non-believer to restore righteousness to a nation? Yes. King Artaxerxes was a non-believer.

See, here is the difference. The Persian kings were happy to see their subjects pray for the welfare of the emperor to the god of their choice and for that reason patronized all the religions within their realm. And no, Artaxerxes was not a non-believer he was a Zoroastrian. All the Persian emperors were, but they didn't impose their religion on others. But the AFA wants to tell non-Christians who they can marry and thinks the government is in a better position to decide what should happen to a fetus than the mother and her doctor.

 

[createdtoworship]

If you are trying to prevent 'truth decay' this article won't help. It is so full of distortions I don't knwo whereto begin.



Like the hatred Franklin Graham spews?



Uh, no. Maryland started out as a Catholic colony, Rhode Island was founded by a Unitarian, Pennsylvania by a Quaker. New York was probably the most pluralistic colony with New Jersey a close second.



Really? Tell me what Supreme Court decision forced Christians to have abortions or perform gay marriages?



So the issue is not religious liberty but the ability to impose your religious beliefs on others.



See, here is the difference. The Persian kings were happy to see their subjects pray for the welfare of the emperor to the god of their choice and for that reason patronized all the religions within their realm. And no, Artaxerxes was not a non-believer he was a Zoroastrian. All the Persian emperors were, but they didn't impose their religion on others. But the AFA wants to tell non-Christians who they can marry and thinks the government is in a better position to decide what should happen to a fetus than the mother and her doctor.

evidence?

 

[Inkfingers]

I am doing my responsibility to vote, even if I don't personally like the best candidate.

it's a matter of who is more righteous. Both are sinners, but one is less of one, and we MUST vote for that one, regardless of how other emotions are tied up into it.

Do you really believe that God wants to give your vote to the ungoldy - those in open rebellion against Him?

 

[Uncle Tommy]

No.

 

[smaneck]

evidence?

Be specific. What do you want evidence of? One thing at a time, please.

 

[smaneck]

Both are sinners, but one is less of one, and we MUST vote for that one, regardless of how other emotions are tied up into it.

Really? And who is less righteous than a guy who goes around bragging about assaulting women and trying to jump into bed with married women when he himself has been married only a few months?

 

[RDKirk]

so heavenly focussed that your no earthly good?

we are to be lights on a hill.

not hidden under a bushel.

(it's biblical)

What, do you only leave your house on November 2?

Otherwise why do you go to the absurd extreme of equating "not voting" with not doing anything at all as an active Christian in society?

Do you realize how many Christians in the world don't vote in their countries? Yet, they are actively bringing in new Christians at a greater rate per Christian than do Christians in America who think themselves virtuous for voting "right" in an election where everyone is serving Satan.

 

[RDKirk]

Rhode Island was founded by a Unitarian

No, Roger Williams was a Baptist--in fact, he founded the first Baptist congregation in America.

And Williams was a very staunch Calvinist operating soon after the Thirty Years War and at the same time as the English Civil War.

As such, he was also a "Separatist" as the English Anglicans called them. His Calvinist beliefs (as well as the experience of oppression unpopular Christian sects historically suffered under nationally established religions) caused him to believe that governments should not be involved in the work of God to elect those He chooses to save. His view was that when governments get involved, the pews become packed with those seeking social advantage rather than those elect by God.

Thus, he founded Rhode Island as a colony of total religious freedom so that those who were baptized would be those who were the elect, not the social advantage seekers, and certainly not those coerced by government.

 

[Albion]

Really? And who is less righteous than a guy who goes around bragging about assaulting women and trying to jump into bed with married women when he himself has been married only a few months?

Let's recap for you--illegally kept a separate email server in her own home, lied about it, destroyed evidence, took bribes in exchange for helping to send uranium to Russia, lied to the families of consular staff in Libya about a "video" having cost their loved ones their lives, refused to turn over subpoenaed evidence, lied about it, made racist, sexist, and anti-Semitic remarks in the presence of her staff, threatened the women victimized by her husband...

...do we need to go much further before deciding that, yes, it's relatively easy to find someone "less righteous" than "a guy who?"