Is Masturbation a sin?

[AlexDTX]

Hmm. Interesting. I can see the penetration angle but not the superficial touch aspect, of rubbing or stroking one's own flesh.
Also, the Bible does not say two women cannot lie together, only two men. Although Paul refers to 'unnatural acts' by women with women I believe. However, two women with one man (whom they are married to) does not seem unnatural an act at all. Perhaps he is referring to two women alone.

I definitely agree that sex should be a sacred expression of love reserved for those who are man and wife.

And I agree that one's spouse has the right to nix masturbation.

AphroditeGoneAwry,
It is not possible to list everything that is wrong in the Bible. The Mosaic Law was never meant to be a guide to righteousness. It had one purpose only: to show how high the standard of righteousness is and the impossibility of obtaining righteousness by works. This is why we need to be led by the Spirit, which could only occur with the new birth.

Jesus said,

He said to them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. (Matt. 19:8)
​

The only sexual relation that God ordained is between a husband and wife. Under the New Testament we do not live under the Mosaic Law (indeed it was never given by God to the gentiles), but the Law of Grace, since God only looks at the perfect work of Jesus given to us by faith. Grace proceeded the Mosaic Law.

Paul said to the Romans,

12 Why, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed on all men, for that all have sinned: 13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses... (Rom. 5:12 & 13).​

Nevertheless death reigned. In other words the consequence of sin remains. Likewise for us under the grace of God today. If we are not sensitive to what pleases God and what grieves Him, we can harden our hearts and suffer the consequences of sin in our lives. The danger of our hearts hardening is that we do not know our hearts are hardened. Just like a leper can not feel his body, the consequence is that he becomes mutilated and does not know it.

All carnality desensitizes us to the spirit. Be careful what you allow in your life.

 

[AlexDTX]

The idea that the hymen breaks during the first sex isn't really an accurate one.

http://www.yourtango.com/201172815/7-things-you-didnt-know-about-hymen

Her argument regarding the Hymen, KTS, doesn't mean it always breaks through intercourse, or that it will bleed excessively. Her point is that it is seal of virginity, and that it was understood in ancient times as such. The breaking of the seal is the covenant act between man and woman just as the circumcision of the penis was the covenant between Abraham and his descendants with Yahweh.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

Could you say why?

Well, because they become one flesh. The flesh between them is neither one's nor the other's, it belongs to both of them.

Also, husbands rule over their wives. Yes, with love! But they have the ultimate say as to how the one flesh shall be enjoyed.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

AphroditeGoneAwry,
It is not possible to list everything that is wrong in the Bible. The Mosaic Law was never meant to be a guide to righteousness. It had one purpose only: to show how high the standard of righteousness is and the impossibility of obtaining righteousness by works. This is why we need to be led by the Spirit, which could only occur with the new birth.

Jesus said,

He said to them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. (Matt. 19:8)
​

The only sexual relation that God ordained is between a husband and wife. Under the New Testament we do not live under the Mosaic Law (indeed it was never given by God to the gentiles), but the Law of Grace, since God only looks at the perfect work of Jesus given to us by faith. Grace proceeded the Mosaic Law.

Paul said to the Romans,

12 Why, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed on all men, for that all have sinned: 13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses... (Rom. 5:12 & 13).​

Nevertheless death reigned. In other words the consequence of sin remains. Likewise for us under the grace of God today. If we are not sensitive to what pleases God and what grieves Him, we can harden our hearts and suffer the consequences of sin in our lives. The danger of our hearts hardening is that we do not know our hearts are hardened. Just like a leper can not feel his body, the consequence is that he becomes mutilated and does not know it.

All carnality desensitizes us to the spirit. Be careful what you allow in your life.

Can you please summarize this into a main point you wish for me to understand? I do not think of the Bible as wrong.

It does please God when I pleasure myself. As long as I do not commit sin in so doing.

 

[bhsmte]

Can you please summarize this into a main point you wish for me to understand? I do not think of the Bible as wrong.

It does please God when I pleasure myself. As long as I do not commit sin in so doing.

How does it please God when you pleasure yourself?

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

How does it please God when you pleasure yourself?

It pleases Him to know that I am receiving pleasure which I currently cannot get any other way. He is pleased that I am enjoying my body and the gifts He is able to bestow.

And that is all I'm saying about it!

 

[bhsmte]

It pleases Him to know that I am receiving pleasure which I currently cannot get any other way. He is pleased that I am enjoying my body and the gifts He is able to bestow.

And that is all I'm saying about it!

Just curious.

 

[Matthias Rose]

Actions are not inherently sinful; but intentions may be. Can self-pleasuring lead us to a more integrated experience of spirit and flesh? Absolutely, in which case it is not sinful -- not taking us away from God. Can it distract us from the divine, spending our energy and time without love? Absolutely, in which case it is taking us away from God.

 

[pakicetus]

Can it distract us from the divine, spending our energy and time without love? Absolutely, in which case it is taking us away from God.

To be fair, not masturbating can also distract us from the divine.

 

[dayhiker]

Hi Kathryn,
I usually don't look at porn. I'm not married. Been single now for almost 8 yrs.

That's what I thank God for the pleasure I receive when I touch. Sexual pleasure is one of the best gifts from God as far as
I'm concern. So I often take time to thank Him for it.

Out of curiosity, Dayhiker, do you look at porn when you touch? I am assuming that you are not looking at porn "to the glory of God." But have to ask. : ) And, are you married?

 

[Kathryn Jensen]

It pleases Him to know that I am receiving pleasure which I currently cannot get any other way. He is pleased that I am enjoying my body and the gifts He is able to bestow.

I agree that masturbating when one is single might not be sin. It would not be sin if one is not lusting after another, which would include sexual fantasies for someone that is not one's spouse, with mental image or actual image (Matt 5:28). If a man or woman is married, then sex is about giving and masturbation is about self (all about self). I would argue that looking at lusting to porn while masturbating is adultery. Since the Bible forbids depriving sex (I Cor 7) except for a short time of prayer and fasting, there should not be a need for self pleasure when one has the pleasure of the spouse (God's design for sexual pleasure).

It's interesting that the reason we are told not to deprive is due to our LACK OF SELF CONTROL. So, God is dealing strictly on human terms. One of the Fruits of the Spirit (attributes and characteristics we display/have when we are living Godly lives) is self control. When we are walking with God, we should have self control (we are now empowered to do so). However, because of lack of self control, we should not refrain for any length of time (the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak). Of course, prolonged illness or geographical distance for prolonged periods of time could be exceptions. : )

I believe that there are enough Scriptures that confirm that we were created for the glory of God and for HIS pleasure. And that everything we do is for His glory, not ours. I think humanism has seeped too much into Western culture and the church combined with twisted Scriptures. God doesn't exist for our happiness and pleasure. We were created for fellowship with Him...not fellowship with self. And, of course, until our time on this earth ends, our focus should be on the eternal secuirty of those who are not spending eternity with God. 100 yearsish sacrifice compared to eternity is not very long. : ) Having said that, I do believe that what is not explicitly sin or sin specifically to an individual or unwise because of where it will lead, IS blessed by God. lol

It's just a tricky topic...

 

[Matthias Rose]

To be fair, not masturbating can also distract us from the divine.

Very true and a good point!

 

[bhsmte]

To be fair, not masturbating can also distract us from the divine.

How so?

 

[dayhiker]

I found pakicetus to have a valid point when I was young, because when the sperm had built up sex would dominate my thinking till I masturbated, then I could concentrate on what God wanted me to do. So in my 20s this became one of the reasons I was thankful to God for masturbation.

 

[Kylie]

Well, because they become one flesh. The flesh between them is neither one's nor the other's, it belongs to both of them.

I do not cease being an individual just because I am married. Your religion may make this claim, but it is most definitely NOT a claim I agree with.

Also, husbands rule over their wives. Yes, with love! But they have the ultimate say as to how the one flesh shall be enjoyed.

No one rules over me except me. My husband is not the boss of me.

 

[westen]

Nowhere does it state in the Bible that Christianity is supposed to cause people to stop being individuals. In fact, the most important thing of all, the eternal destiny of your own soul, is left to the individual.

Philippians 2:12
12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

 

[dayhiker]

The idea of oneness in marriage has always puzzled me. The view of this that makes the most sense to me is when a couple has a child, they are one in that child.
Clearly there also can become a oneness in that they know each other so well, that they can finish each others sentences. But this can be done with friends that have known each other for a while.
I remember making love to my wife and having an itch on my back and thinking if we were really one she would know to scratch my back about now. But it never happened. So clearly oneness at that level wasn't there. So my conclusion is that some people spiritualize this beyond that the Bible does. Its not that big a part of the Bible anyways as its only mentioned 3 times I think.

 

[Matthias Rose]

The idea of oneness in marriage has always puzzled me.

This can be experienced, DayHiker -- that itch scratching? It can happen.

The mystical union, the union of flesh, spirit, mind, heart, soul is not something that most people experience without bringing intention to it, but it is possible. It is an experience that we can have. Not just one flesh with each other, but a true triune union with God, a trinity of two partners and the Holy Spirit.

It is not practical to live fully in that state all the time, but one can get to the place where there is always some degree of union, and in those moments of full presence and connection... full union.

I don't know if this experience is what Jesus had in mind when he made his rather cryptic remark, but I suspect that it is, or I suspect that the experience is a reflection of a deeper truth that He understood in ways that we can only approximate.

 

[dayhiker]

So are you just saying it can happen or do you have experience with this happening, Matthias?

 

[Matthias Rose]

So are you just saying it can happen or do you have experience with this happening, Matthias?

Yes, I have experience with it happening. With my own wife; and as a sacred sexuality educator and intimacy coach, I help other couples deepen their intimacy toward and to the "one flesh" point. Depending on where people are coming from, what obstacles they might have to intimacy, this is not always an easy thing to accomplish.