Is it truly bad to sin?

[Melissa Suzanne]

You are correct, it is absolutely not what the bible teaches, it's what people want, because they want to sin and go to heaven to, so instead of actually having faith in Christ and following what he says to do they use his sacrifice for their own selfish wants... a ticket to sin....then have the audacity to actually teach the mess.

Fortunately there are those like yourself/others here that will not let them get away with teaching a dangerous false doctrine.



Weren't you asked to be specific on what you disagreed with, and then you would have your scripture?

Maybe I can help? Scripture for what exactly?

Thanks. well her argument was when you become a Christian you don't sin anymore and my argument is you still sin at times as sanctification is a process and that's what confession is for. I posted a couple verses but don't spend a ton of time on here so haven't posted many. I believe sanctification is an ongoing process until we die and we never reach complete perfection until then. We are perfect in the sense that we are covered, but we still have to strive to be more like Christ every day and there will always be mistakes in the process. That's my argument and what I believe. Many Christians believe you reach a point where you arrive and don't sin anymore, but I don't believe that. I believe confession is for practicing Christians as well as unbelievers.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Thanks. well her argument was when you become a Christian you don't sin anymore and my argument is you still sin at times as sanctification is a process and that's what confession is for. I posted a couple verses but don't spend a ton of time on here so haven't posted many. I believe sanctification is an ongoing process until we die and we never reach complete perfection until then. We are perfect in the sense that we are covered, but we still have to strive to be more like Christ every day and there will always be mistakes in the process. That's my argument and what j believe. Many Christian believe you reach a point where you arrive and don't sin anymore, but I don't believe that. I believe confession is for practicing Christians as well as unbelievers.

We may vary in that I think we are covered until we go over board with sin, don't care, no longer repent, or ask forgiveness....go back to sin as a lifestyle.

There is a distinct narrow path/wide road, one leads to destruction, the other to salvation.

 

[Alithis]

Thanks. well her argument was when you become a Christian you don't sin anymore and my argument is you still sin at times as sanctification is a process and that's what confession is for. I posted a couple verses but don't spend a ton of time on here so haven't posted many. I believe sanctification is an ongoing process until we die and we never reach complete perfection until then. We are perfect in the sense that we are covered, but we still have to strive to be more like Christ every day and there will always be mistakes in the process. That's my argument and what j believe. Many Christian believe you reach a point where you arrive and don't sin anymore, but I don't believe that. I believe confession is for practicing Christians as well as unbelievers.

but shes is correct ..when you are born again your dont "willfuly" do actions of sin..why on earth would you ?
it doesn't mean you do not have the ability to .free will was never removed . but you just wont you dont want to .your flesh might desire to but you don't live after the flesh any more NOW you live after the spirit .
if a person continues to do sins they know are sins then they display they are Not of god . john also says that rather plainly and painfully .they are some of the most avoided texts in the scripture it seems

 

[Alithis]

How do you know he knows?



God doesn't put crazies in the world, nor does he put people in abusive environments...we/the world do that.

And yes, it's splattered all over the bible sin is bad, seems to me you are simply trying to reason that away.

its Taoism being presented at the heart of it - a doctrine of devils.. questioning and undermining obvious truth . such a topic of is sin bad .. would never be raised/presented among a fellowship of people who love and follow jesus , after all you have to HATE sin to love Jesus you cant love both .

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

but shes is correct ..when you are born again your dont "willfuly" do actions of sin..why on earth would you ?
it doesn't mean you do not have the ability to .free will was never removed . but you just wont you dont want to .your flesh might desire to but you don't live after the flesh any more NOW you live after the spirit .
if a person continues to do sins they know are sins then they display they are Not of god . john also says that rather plainly and painfully .they are some of the most avoided texts in the scripture it seems

I don't say we willfully sin and want to. I say we sin at times because we're human and make mistakes. No Christ follower should want to sin. That's what forgiveness is for. The scripture says confess your sins so that you may be saved. It's a continual thing in the life of a Christian. So are you saying you believe when you become a Christian you don't sin anymore? And that you are sinless?

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

We may vary in that I think we are covered until we go over board with sin, don't care, no longer repent, or ask forgiveness....go back to sin as a lifestyle.

There is a distinct narrow path/wide road, one leads to destruction, the other to salvation.

That's what I believe. I don't know how we differ. I don't think willfully and blatantly sinning is okay. That's not what I said and it seems my words are being misinterpreted. I don't believe in the whole popular belief that grace is an excuse to sin. By no means. Romans is clear. All I said was we will make mistakes. We as Christians are being sanctified and it is a process. But I don't believe that Christians can say they don't sin at all. That's what forgiveness is for. Again it's not willfull sin, it's because you are growing and make mistakes in the process.

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

That's what I believe. I don't know how we differ. I don't think willfully and blatantly sinning is okay. That's not what I said and it seems my words are being misinterpreted. I don't believe in the whole popular belief that grace is an excuse to sin. By no means. Romans is clear. All I said was we will make mistakes. We as Christians are being sanctified and it is a process. But I don't believe that Christians can say they don't sin at all. That's what forgiveness is for. Again it's not willfull sin, it's because you are growing and make mistakes in the process.

How do you think we differ? Because nothing I have said contradicts what you just said. I agree with all of that and pretty much just said what you did.

 

[1stcenturylady]

That is certainly true. I would say that my main argument regarding evil, however, has to do with God having free will. If God has always had free will, then has He not also always been able to choose evil? Likewise, because God has always existed, other concepts have also always existed due to their being traits of God (for example love, holiness, righteousness, gentleness, etc.), and we know that they are unchanging. Because God has always existed and is unchanging, these traits that are aspects of Him have always existed as well. That also means that if God has always been able to do whatever He wants, then He has always had the option of choosing to do what is opposite His nature, which would be evil (but He never will, thank God!)

Edit: When I speak of concepts being eternal because they are traits of God, please note that I am in no way implying that evil is a concept because it is a trait of God! The way I worded it may have lead someone to misunderstood the meaning of what I was saying

I disagree. God is so perfect and so holy, I don't think He is capable of evil at all. Otherwise, what power would we have being filled with His Spirit?

1 John 3:9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

but shes is correct ..when you are born again your dont "willfuly" do actions of sin..why on earth would you ?
it doesn't mean you do not have the ability to .free will was never removed . but you just wont you dont want to .your flesh might desire to but you don't live after the flesh any more NOW you live after the spirit .
if a person continues to do sins they know are sins then they display they are Not of god . john also says that rather plainly and painfully .they are some of the most avoided texts in the scripture it seems

So let me get this straight, you claim that you don't ever sin? Never? And if not then what is confession for?

 

[1stcenturylady]

That's what I believe. I don't know how we differ. I don't think willfully and blatantly sinning is okay. That's not what I said and it seems my words are being misinterpreted. I don't believe in the whole popular belief that grace is an excuse to sin. By no means. Romans is clear. All I said was we will make mistakes. We as Christians are being sanctified and it is a process. But I don't believe that Christians can say they don't sin at all. That's what forgiveness is for. Again it's not willfull sin, it's because you are growing and make mistakes in the process.

Yes, those are called transgressions. They are totally different than willful sins. You know when you commit a willful sin, and a Christian does not commit them. In the Old Testament, their punishment was death - not sacrifice. However, transgressions are "unintentional." (Leviticus 5:15). That is why in the Lord's Prayer we are not told to pray for forgiveness of our sins, but of transgressions, and in the same way we forgive others their unintentional transgressions against us. Yes, they are both "sins" in the broad sense, but are very different in the eyes of God and how He sees them, and how He acts accordingly.

 

[1stcenturylady]

So let me get this straight, you claim that you don't ever sin? Never? And if not then what is confession for?

Transgressions.

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

Yes, those are called transgressions. They are totally different than willful sins. You know when you commit a willful sin, and a Christian does not commit them. In the Old Testament, their punishment was death - not sacrifice. However, transgressions are "unintentional." (Leviticus 5:15). That is why in the Lord's Prayer we are not told to pray for forgiveness of our sins, but of transgressions, and in the same way we forgive others their unintentional transgressions against us. Yes, they are both "sins" in the broad sense, but are very different in the eyes of God and how He sees them, and how He acts accordingly.

Well, sin is sin, and Jesus died for all of it. You know in all of my comments I never said willful sins. So you are pretty much arguing with me for no reason. Whatever you call your present sins they are sin. What I really hate is Christians that act like they are holier then thou instead of acting in the humility of Jesus. We all are imperfect and in need of Jesus' cleansing grace. That's why we confess on a regular basis. You have not arrived yet. No one has. Until Jesus comes back, there is still room for growing and learning. You still sin, as everyone else does.

 

[1stcenturylady]

they are some of the most avoided texts in the scripture it seems

Boy, you got that right!!! Even my AoG pastor where I used to go to still uses 1 John 1:8 instead of 1 John 3:9 for a Christian!!! Can you believe it? He's suppose to have the Spirit. I guess God took a vacation day that Sunday.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Well, sin is sin, and Jesus died for all of it. You know in all of my comments I never said willful sins. So you are pretty much arguing with me for no reason. Whatever you call your present sins they are sin. What I really hate is Christians that act like they are holier then thou instead of acting in the humility of Jesus. We all are imperfect and in need of Jesus' cleansing grace. That's why we confess on a regular basis. You have not arrived yet. No one has. Until Jesus comes back, there is still room for growing and learning. You still sin, as everyone else does.

There you go again with one of those erroneous phrases. "Sin is sin." "Past, present and future sins." "Jesus covers our sins."

WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!

Don't you even want to learn anything besides your teachers false doctrines? Do yourself a favor and look up what Alithis and I are telling you in scripture against what your teachers are spoon feeding you.

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

Transgressions.

Transgression is the same translation as sin. Transgression means sin. Sin is sin. It's the only reason we must confess to him. You know, we obviously disagree, and you are perfectly entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with you, and I'm not going to talk to you about this anymore. The Bible also talks about foolish talk and squabbles and I don't see the significance of continuing to argue with you. Goodbye.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Transgression is the same translation as sin. Transgression means sin. Sin is sin. It's the only reason we must confess to him. You know, we obviously disagree, and you are perfectly entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with you, and I'm not going to talk to you about this anymore. The Bible also talks about foolish talk and squabbles and I don't see the significance of continuing to argue with you. Goodbye.

1 Corinthians 14:38.

Only the TRUTH will set you free. False teachings can drag you where you don't want to go. Especially if you are not humble enough to accept correction that can free you.

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

There you go again with one of those erroneous phrases. "Sin is sin." "Past, present and future sins." "Jesus covers our sins."

WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!

Don't you even want to learn anything besides your teachers false doctrines? Do yourself a favor and look up what Alithis and I are telling you in scripture against what your teachers are spoon feeding you.

You are taking my words out of context and putting them together to make it look like I believe in false doctrines.

Well, I want to quote another verse that says "By their fruit you will recognize them". In our whole conversation I have not seen any love or kindness. The way you are going about it is completely ungodly. Actions speak louder than words. If anything turns me off at all it's Bible thumping people who take the Bible out of context and show no love. Engaging in accusatory and rude arguments is not pleasing to God and even though you quote the Bible, I don't see his loving kindness. I'm not accusing you of not being a Christian but am suggesting can you maybe accept the fact that even though you are a Christian, you have some faults like all Christians do? The gospel can best be shown through our lives, not our words. And if we're rude and accusatory with our words we're not showing love.

 

[Melissa Suzanne]

1 Corinthians 14:38.

Only the TRUTH will set you free. False teachings can drag you where you don't want to go. Especially if you are not humble enough to accept correction that can free you.

I don't believe in false teachings. Goodbye.

 

[1stcenturylady]

You are taking my words out of context and putting them together to make it look like I believe in false doctrines.

Well, I want to quote another verse that says "By their fruit you will recognize them". In our whole conversation I have not seen any love or kindness. The way you are going about it is completely ungodly. Actions speak louder than words. If anything turns me off at all it's Bible thumping people who take the Bible out of context and show no love. Engaging in accusatory and rude arguments is not pleasing to God and even though you quote the Bible, I don't see his loving kindness. I'm not accusing you of not being a Christian but am suggesting can you maybe accept the fact that even though you are a Christian, you have some faults like all Christians do? The gospel can best be shown through our lives, not our words. And if we're rude and accusatory with our words we're not showing love.

39 But He answered and said to them, “An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah."

Just one of many such slurs Jesus spoke to the Pharisees. You are a Pharisee, and don't want to change.

 

[1stcenturylady]

I don't believe in false teachings. Goodbye.

YOU QUOTE THEM.