Is it really a choice?

[jtahalele]

we are born sinners, we have no choice there; but we do have a choice as to whether or not we will accept God's gift of life.

Adam and Eve had the choice regarding sin. They chose to allow sin to enter the world (Genesis 3). Sometimes the choices we make affect others other than ourselves. They can't choose the result of the other person's actions, but they have the choice on how to respond to it. I like this quote by Mat Kearney, "It's not the circumstances that determine who you're gonna be, but how you deal with these problems and pains that come your way"

 

[elephunky]

It seems to me that for you it's not whether or not it's a choice or whether a consequence makes something a choice or not. You just don't like the outcome. If you don't like it, why not choose the path that has a better outcome (ie. belief in Christ)? Although you may already be a Christian. I don't want to come across as arrogant or pushy to you. I'm just stating my observations and thoughts on the issue.

Dude, I already have accepted Christ and believe that I was created by God.

I just often feel trapped, suffocated by other christians and feel like i have to remove half my personality to be a "good christian"

 

[daydreamergurl15]

Dude, I already have accepted Christ and believe that I was created by God.

I just often feel trapped, suffocated by other christians and feel like i have to remove half my personality to be a "good christian"

I don't know of any "good" Christians but my question to you is this, when you read the bible, do you feel that you have to change your opinions/position on some things just to be more like Christ?

 

[elephunky]

Not really.

 

[Rick Otto]

Dude, I already have accepted Christ and believe that I was created by God.

I just often feel trapped, suffocated by other christians and feel like i have to remove half my personality to be a "good christian"

Been there, done that, got the... oh, sorry. Now I'm only usin' half of my personality! That virus is contagious...
"Churchitis"?

 

[daydreamergurl15]

Not really.

I don't know if that is encouraging or scary. For I can't image us, once being a slave to sin, coming to Christ, reading His words and not changing our positions on certain things. But then again, some of us (I being one of them) needed a LOT more change and still being worked on by the Holy Spirit to becoming more like Christ.

But anyway, if any of that change is being found in you, I pray it's because you are changing because of the words in scripture than anyone pressuring you to be someone else.

 

[elephunky]

I dont need to change my position on things because they match with what they should be.

I dont go to church because of pressure taht gets put on me to be a certain way. I dont proclaim to be a Christian either, thast not to say taht peopel dont get told that I beleive in God and Jesus.

 

[daydreamergurl15]

Hmmmm, well, may God be with you.

 

[elephunky]

He is

 

[jtahalele]

Dude, I already have accepted Christ and believe that I was created by God.

I just often feel trapped, suffocated by other christians and feel like i have to remove half my personality to be a "good christian"

Thanks for the clarification . What part of yourself do you feel like you have to remove?

These verses may help: 1John 2:15-17.

 

[jtahalele]

What is your view on living for Christ? Does the way you live line up with how Christ says we should live?

 

[elephunky]

Thanks for the clarification . What part of yourself do you feel like you have to remove?

These verses may help: 1John 2:15-17.

Oh you know, my taste in music, my taste in movies, my taste in humor, pretty much my taste in everything. The part of me that is a bit of a rocker, the part of me that likes tattoos and piercings, the part of me that can have fun with a bunch of drunk people without being drunk, the part of me that is happy to let people chose waht they want to believe, and all thsoe interesting parts of me.

 

[elephunky]

What is your view on living for Christ? Does the way you live line up with how Christ says we should live?

I feel like im on trial here...

I try to follow his guidance

 

[Poverello78]

dGirl,

It seems to me that, for one, you're too worried about what other people think. There is, of course, nothing wrong with wanting to be accepted by others--to have fellowship with like-minded people--but perhaps you're looking for acceptance from a crowd that simply isn't your own. You don't need to fulfill anyone's expectations of you and you should be secure in what you understand to be true, while at the same time remaining open to learn more. Your life and the decisions you make are ultimately between you and God, and I have the feeling you know this. If other people are upset with the way you believe, the way you relate to God and understand life, that is no ones fault but their own.

On the flip-side of that coin, it appears that you are experiencing a degree of real conviction on some matters. If this is true, and your convictions are not solely a matter of social acceptance, then God is probably trying to tell you something about those matters. However, the social acceptance aspect can very easily veil the truth of what God is saying; It's very easy, but also very destructive, to blame true conviction on the perceived judgments and hypocrisy of others. It's the very nature of pride to blame circumstances rather than admit to a real lack within your own character.

I think the key to your success will be a realization that you need not take anything personally. Train yourself to recognize that when someone tries to impose a standard on you, they are actually manifesting their own inner turmoil which really has nothing to do with you at all; You simply happen to be the most convenient object for projection. At the same time, if there are people who genuinely care about you and ought to have a place in your life to love and support you, you are doing yourself an injustice by being defensive and fearful. There are always two sides to the story.

For the record, I struggle with the same things and am not even close to a perfect practitioner of what I'm now sharing with you.

I hope this is helpful.

 

[elephunky]

dGirl,

It seems to me that, for one, you're too worried about what other people think. There is, of course, nothing wrong with wanting to be accepted by others--to have fellowship with like-minded people--but perhaps you're looking for acceptance from a crowd that simply isn't your own. You don't need to fulfill anyone's expectations of you and you should be secure in what you understand to be true, while at the same time remaining open to learn more. Your life and the decisions you make are ultimately between you and God, and I have the feeling you know this. If other people are upset with the way you believe, the way you relate to God and understand life, that is no ones fault but their own.

On the flip-side of that coin, it appears that you are experiencing a degree of real conviction on some matters. If this is true, and your convictions are not solely a matter of social acceptance, then God is probably trying to tell you something about those matters. However, the social acceptance aspect can very easily veil the truth of what God is saying; It's very easy, but also very destructive, to blame true conviction on the perceived judgments and hypocrisy of others. It's the very nature of pride to blame circumstances rather than admit to a real lack within your own character.

I think the key to your success will be a realization that you need not take anything personally. Train yourself to recognize that when someone tries to impose a standard on you, they are actually manifesting their own inner turmoil which really has nothing to do with you at all; You simply happen to be the most convenient object for projection. At the same time, if there are people who genuinely care about you and ought to have a place in your life to love and support you, you are doing yourself an injustice by being defensive and fearful. There are always two sides to the story.

For the record, I struggle with the same things and am not even close to a perfect practitioner of what I'm now sharing with you.

I hope this is helpful.

Its not that i care what other people think, its the fact I have people telling me who I should be, how I should be acting, what I should like etc. Im not one for trying to fit in, i like being different, I like being an individual. As far as im concerned if people dont like it then just dontt alk to me. Which doesnt work well in church and christian groups now does it?

 

[Poverello78]

Its not that i care what other people think, its the fact I have people telling me who I should be, how I should be acting, what I should like etc. Im not one for trying to fit in, i like being different, I like being an individual. As far as im concerned if people dont like it then just dontt alk to me. Which doesnt work well in church and christian groups now does it?

It depends on the Church and the group, I suppose.

I guess my question now is simply this: If you don't care about what other people think, why are you expressing negativity about what other people think?

I'm not saying this to be mean but, whatever your answer may be, it's unarguable that any negative feelings you have about how you're apparently being treated is a direct result of insecurity and a desire to be accepted. That is, if you were completely secure in who you are, and had no desire to be accepted by anyone, all the judgments against you on earth would simply be "like water off your back".

Think about it for a moment, if you will. The judgments and demands you feel are made on you by your Church are triggering some sort of negative and painful response from within you; That negative response, though you may feel it's caused by those who judge you, is actually caused by something within yourself which you have the power to change.

We cannot blame our circumstances for our reactions to them, it's both proud and self-destructive. In this case, it's also unloving.

I hope you're not offended by my blunt honesty. I have a hard time beating around the bush.

 

[elephunky]

It depends on the Church and the group, I suppose.

I guess my question now is simply this: If you don't care about what other people think, why are you expressing negativity about what other people think?

I'm not saying this to be mean but, whatever your answer may be, it's unarguable that any negative feelings you have about how you're apparently being treated is a direct result of insecurity and a desire to be accepted. If you were completely secure in who you are, and had no desire to be accepted by anyone, all the judgments against you on earth would simply be "like water off your back".

Think about it for a moment, if you will. The judgments and demands you feel are made on you by your Church are triggering some sort of negative and painful response from within you; That negative response, though you may feel it's caused by those who judge you, is actually caused by something within yourself which you have the power to change.

We cannot blame our circumstances for our reactions to them, it's both proud and self-destructive. In this case, it's also unloving.

I hope you're not offended by my blunt honesty. I have a hard time beating around the bush.

First - lol

Secondly - The negative feeligns I have about this is not about me wanting to be accepted in their eyes, I dont wanna fit in with them. I want them to say, thats Donna, and leave me alone. Im tired of people telling me how I should be all the tiemand expect me to have a personlaity transplant just cos its what they want. they EXPECT. And waht annoys me the most is a majority of them are Christians, not non christians, christians.

Its not like im a rapist that beleives in god and knows she needs to change but wont. If i needed to change, id be talking to God about it.

Circumstance? what circumstance are we referring to here? the bit where im minding my own business and someone comes alonga nd tries to turn me into what they think i should be?

 

[Rick Otto]

quote=Poverello78; It's the very nature of pride to blame circumstances rather than admit to a real lack within your own character.

"Heavy Potatoes" we used to say... weighty truth.

I think the key to your success will be a realization that you need not take anything personally. Train yourself to recognize that when someone tries to impose a standard on you, they are actually manifesting their own inner turmoil which really has nothing to do with you at all; You simply happen to be the most convenient object for projection.

Poverello, this is professional level life-coaching. Are you schooled in counseling or did you stop drinkin' fluorodated water, or... ?(lol)
I've only read 3 or 4 of your posts & enjoyed 'em all. Glad you showed up.
Maybe some of your sanity will rub off on us.

At the same time, if there are people who genuinely care about you and ought to have a place in your life to love and support you, you are doing yourself an injustice by being defensive and fearful. There are always two sides to the story.

Great advice, but she doesn't seem scared on account of God, rather pensive about fellowshipping in a 'hostile' environment.
Totaly common sense as I see it, but I'm bettin' she gets the essential love & support she needs, it just this particular subculture.
Maybe I'm quibbling.

For the record, I struggle with the same things and am not even close to a perfect practitioner of what I'm now sharing with you.

I hope this is helpful.

It was for me. I'm takin' notes on both content & style, Poverello.

 

[elephunky]

...riiiiight. Obviously havent heard a single thing i have said.

 

[Rick Otto]

lol