Is it just me? [moved from Ministry]

[dayhiker]

In reading the thread, the post that I find so many people don't do is take time to heal, to deal with their own issues. It takes time to deal with issues. God's work isn't an over night work but a healing that does to the depths of our soul and will last for an eternity.

dayhiker

 

[Nadiine]

Am I being too judgmental, why do I have issues with separated Christians dating and having sex with new girlfriends/boyfriends before their marriages are even dissolved?

I am seeing this more and more here, and it makes me sad every single time. Especially the ones who are SO mad at their exes that they seem to think that the new one is justified, because "she loves me SO MUCH BETTER!" Why are Christians finding it so easy to justify it? Have we lost that much of the love of God's righteousness?

PEOPLE!! It's ADULTERY!! While you are still legally and morally married to someone DON'T HAVE SEX WITH SOMEONE ELSE!!! IT doesnt' matter that you're so much happier with this person, or that they're so much more understanding, or that they don't beat or mistreat you, or they do the funky sex with you that your first husband woulnd't, or they give you so much more love. It. Is. Sin.

Yannow what, nevermind the Scriptural issues with it, why not take this time to get your own emotional stability back? Spend some time BY yourself, be single for a while, let your heart heal! Running to a rebound love is NOT going to help you reconcile the hurts your ex caused you. Especially if you have kids! Let your KIDS heal over losing their mother/father first before you shove another one into their heads.

Ugh. Just had to vent.

I hear you.

I'll tell you what this is a result of.
Not walking closely with God - OR, not knowing God at all.

Prophecy tells us that in the last days, there will be a great falling
away from the faith. I believe we've been in this period of time for
awhile now and people are making their choices in serving self over
God.

Also, this is why we're told to be "renewing our minds" in the Word of
God. When we read scripture and pray, we're continuing to get newly
"reprogrammed" into God's principles and holiness.
What's happening today is that many are ignoring their bibles,
refusing to go to church, & then wondering why they live carnally.

Their minds are renewed daily in this world in all it's trash & filth -
then they compare themselves with the world instead of with Christ
who holds the proper standard of righteousness.

If we're in the world, we will be overtaken by it eventually.

I think this is what you're seeing happen.

(ps that isn't being too judgmental)

 

[Nadiine]

In reading the thread, the post that I find so many people don't do is take time to heal, to deal with their own issues. It takes time to deal with issues. God's work isn't an over night work but a healing that does to the depths of our soul and will last for an eternity.

dayhiker

how can God work in people who have strayed from Him & refuse
His instruction?
The source is not following God in the first place as I view this.

 

[HuntingMan]

Beware of the false prophets who come to you
in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. .
you will know them by their fruit. .
Matt. 7:14-15

I really like your sig, Nadiine....wish Id thought of that one

 

[HuntingMan]

The Church predicted this would happen with the advent of modernism and social liberalism.

Now we have people who say re-marriage isn't a sin, homosexuality is a gift from God, 2 men or women can get married, motherhood is a curse, and the murder of the unborn is a human right. What you talk about is an after-effect of all these heresies that have come into play. It began all the way 2000 years ago beginning with Gnosticism and it continues on till this day(and probably till the end when the Day of Judgment comes)

Oh brother.
I should have figured youd be in this thread pushing this same unscriptural rhetoric as in the other.

Remarriage is NOT SIN, poster.
Christ was speaking to Jews about casting away an INNOCENT (for EVERY cause) wife TO MARRY another....THAT is the context from which He speaks and THAT is why He gives exception and Paul also can give concession in the matter and not be contradicting themselves.
Casting away an innocent wife TO marry someone else...THAT is sin....and THAT is why Christ said "EXCEPT FOR."..something you apparently either decide not to read or cannot figure out.

I am hereby challenging you here and now to start a thread for formal debate in this matter as Im tired of seeing your silly posts all over this forum making claims that you cannot support.

 

[Nadiine]

Oh brother.
I should have figured youd be in this thread pushing this same unscriptural rhetoric as in the other.

Remarriage is NOT SIN, poster.
Christ was speaking to Jews about casting away an INNOCENT (for EVERY cause) wife TO MARRY another....THAT is the context from which He speaks and THAT is why He gives exception and Paul also can give concession in the matter and not be contradicting themselves.

I am hereby challenging you here and now to start a thread for formal debate in this matter as Im tired of seeing your silly posts all over this forum making claims that you cannot support.

Where did the OP give ANY specifics on what the divorce situations
all were?

Are you now going to say ALL people in ALL divorces are able to
have sex BEFORE they even remarry the next person?

The OP is stating people who claim to be Christians are having
sex DURING their separations - they aren't even divorced yet.
And they aren't even remarried to the next partner.

If you think this is fine, then by all means show me where this is
fine in scripture.

 

[HuntingMan]

Rural then. Okay, either you're incredibly lucky, sheltered, or maybe just a little naive. Not to be snarky, but you might really be one of the lucky ones to never see it face to face.

Regardless, whatever sin is going on, it's deplorable that it's becoming so easy for Christians to accept these kinds of behaviours. Christian musicians coming out of the closet, divorce and remarriage WITHIN Christian churches, the alarming number of young Christian girls having babies and/or abortions. Rob, Brother, I think you've hit on the very clear reasons for much of the decline of morality we used to hold so dearly.

If youre talking about two TRUE believers divorcing, I agree that its quite unacceptable. Two TRUE followers of Jesus Christ OUGHT to be living in such a manner that they can certainly make a marriage work regardless of their differences.

But as believers we are to 'let the unbeliever leave' if they so choose....even if its for a frivolous cause. Pauls words show us that WE are called to peace...we are not to fight or cause some war if the unbeliever has chosen to depart. That isnt on our heads and we arent in bondage to that union if they do decide to depart.

 

[Nadiine]

Better to look in the mirror than to look out the window.

We're to exhort those who claim to be in the same family of God
to live honourably, and who's to say the OP DOESN"T look into a
mirror.

In fact, the more I look out the window the more it makes me want
to stick closer to the Lord and stay serious in my walk.

We ARE our brother's keepers and are to care and exhort
God's standards AS believers.
And we CAN judge sin and wrongdoing going on in the church.

 

[HuntingMan]

Where did the OP give ANY specifics on what the divorce situations
all were?

Are you now going to say ALL people in ALL divorces are able to
have sex BEFORE they even remarry the next person?

The OP is stating people who claim to be Christians are having
sex DURING their separations - they aren't even divorced yet.
And they aren't even remarried to the next partner.

If you think this is fine, then by all means show me where this is
fine in scripture.

You might want to READ posts before your fingers start clacking wildly, N.

I did not even remotely respond to the OP in ANY way in that post you quoted
As per usual, you seem to just need a enemy to argue against...even if you dont know what theyve said

 

[Nadiine]

If youre talking about two TRUE believers divorcing, I agree that its quite unacceptable. Two TRUE followers of Jesus Christ OUGHT to be living in such a manner that they can certainly make a marriage work regardless of their differences.

But as believers we are to 'let the unbeliever leave' if they so choose....even if its for a frivolous cause. Pauls words show us that WE are called to peace...we are not to fight or cause some war if the unbeliever has chosen to depart. That isnt on our heads and we arent in bondage to that union if they do decide to depart.

The issue is the premarital sex - sex with other partners before
a divorce is even final.

This is already showing that people have spiritual issues going on
aside from whatever the divorce situation (ie. if it's biblically
lawful or not).

 

[HuntingMan]

Am I being too judgmental, why do I have issues with separated Christians dating and having sex with new girlfriends/boyfriends before their marriages are even dissolved?

I am seeing this more and more here, and it makes me sad every single time. Especially the ones who are SO mad at their exes that they seem to think that the new one is justified, because "she loves me SO MUCH BETTER!" Why are Christians finding it so easy to justify it? Have we lost that much of the love of God's righteousness?

PEOPLE!! It's ADULTERY!! While you are still legally and morally married to someone DON'T HAVE SEX WITH SOMEONE ELSE!!! IT doesnt' matter that you're so much happier with this person, or that they're so much more understanding, or that they don't beat or mistreat you, or they do the funky sex with you that your first husband woulnd't, or they give you so much more love. It. Is. Sin.

Yannow what, nevermind the Scriptural issues with it, why not take this time to get your own emotional stability back? Spend some time BY yourself, be single for a while, let your heart heal! Running to a rebound love is NOT going to help you reconcile the hurts your ex caused you. Especially if you have kids! Let your KIDS heal over losing their mother/father first before you shove another one into their heads.

Ugh. Just had to vent.

Since nadiine as decided to distort my post I suppose Ill have to comment to the OP at this point so Im not maligned by Nadiine here.

NO person who is still under a covenant of marriage ought to be having sex with another person who is not their spouse.

There, nadiine...lets see if you can twist THAT around to try to make me look bad

 

[Nadiine]

You might want to READ posts before your fingers start clacking wildly, N.

I did not even remotely respond to the OP in ANY way in that post you quoted
As per usual, you seem to just need a enemy to argue against...even if you dont know what theyve said

already getting personal? not surprising.

The person you went after was responding to the OP and there was
nothing wrong w/ his statement; it was a general observation of
the result of the immorality that has crept into the church.

 

[Nadiine]

Since nadiine as decided to distort my post I suppose Ill have to comment to the OP at this point so Im not maligned by Nadiine here.

NO person who is still under a covenant of marriage ought to be having sex with another person who is not their spouse.

There, nadiine...lets see if you can twist THAT around to try to make me look bad

I twisted NOTHING - you jumped on someone that made a valid
observation on the moral condition of many people who claim Christianity today - in reply to an OP that gave NO details on the divorce circumstances.

So let's drop the attacks now K?

 

[Zebra1552]

Oh brother.
I should have figured youd be in this thread pushing this same unscriptural rhetoric as in the other.

Remarriage is NOT SIN, poster.
Christ was speaking to Jews about casting away an INNOCENT (for EVERY cause) wife TO MARRY another....THAT is the context from which He speaks and THAT is why He gives exception and Paul also can give concession in the matter and not be contradicting themselves.
Casting away an innocent wife TO marry someone else...THAT is sin....and THAT is why Christ said "EXCEPT FOR."..something you apparently either decide not to read or cannot figure out.

I am hereby challenging you here and now to start a thread for formal debate in this matter as Im tired of seeing your silly posts all over this forum making claims that you cannot support.

Mat 19:4 And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,
Mat 19:5 and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'?
Mat 19:6 "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."
Mat 19:7 They *said to Him, "Why then did Moses command to GIVE HER A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY?"
Mat 19:8 He *said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart Moses permitted you to divorce your wives; but from the beginning it has not been this way.
Mat 19:9 "And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery."

That's pretty clear. Whoever divorces and remarries, except for cases of unfaithfulness, commits adultery. Jesus is clear- when someone is married, they become one. To rip that apart and become one with another person? That leads to quite divided interests, especially when children are in the equation. It makes perfect sense to follow the traditional reading of this, even more so when you factor psychological reasons in.

 

[HuntingMan]

The issue is the premarital sex - sex with other partners before
a divorce is even final.

I dont care where this thread STARTED at poster...its VERY clear that SOME comments in here are directed AT remarriage and THAT is what *I* was posting in regards to.
Its not my problem if you fail to READ what is WRITTEN before your hands start chattering away at your keyboard.

This is already showing that people have spiritual issues going on
aside from whatever the divorce situation (ie. if it's biblically
lawful or not).

We ALL have spiritual issues going on from the day we become self aware, sister. Please dont even pretend to act like you are above sin or making poor decisions in your own life.
People make mistakes.
Some are also battered and torn down by a husband for so long that they do end up jumping into sexual relations where they ought not to. Of course its sin and hopefully they will admit that fact and stop doing it...NO ONE should be having sex until they are under a covenant of marriage with the person....but again lets NOT pretend that WE are innocent of committing sin and that WE could NEVER fall into a sin if we had been tormenting by a spouse for so long that when someone actually tried to show us compassion that we stumbled for a spell.

I understand that some here are concerned about sin. Where Im concerned myself is where some here might be actually finding some speck to pull out of someone elses eye when Im quite sure that NONE of us are beyond sin.
We OUGHT to be helping one another instead of finding ways to condemn....but then Ive seen so many on this forum who seemingly start out their days looking for ways to condemn that I often wonder what is in their own lives that they might be transferring over....

 

[HuntingMan]

I twisted NOTHING - you jumped on someone that made a valid
observation on the moral condition of many people who claim Christianity today - in reply to an OP that gave NO details on the divorce circumstances.

So let's drop the attacks now K?

Yeah, you DID twist MY intent.as you have been doing since you realized we might not agree on something.
*I* was responding to comments pertaining to REmarriage as is quite evidence in *MY* post...
I suggest you go find someone else to argue with before a moderator is needed here.

 

[HuntingMan]

Mat 19:4 And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,
Mat 19:5 and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'?
Mat 19:6 "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."
Mat 19:7 They *said to Him, "Why then did Moses command to GIVE HER A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY?"
Mat 19:8 He *said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart Moses permitted you to divorce your wives; but from the beginning it has not been this way.
Mat 19:9 "And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery."

That's pretty clear. Whoever divorces and remarries, except for cases of unfaithfulness, commits adultery. Jesus is clear- when someone is married, they become one. To rip that apart and become one with another person? That leads to quite divided interests, especially when children are in the equation. It makes perfect sense to follow the traditional reading of this, even more so when you factor psychological reasons in.

Jesus is dealing with Jews such as Herod and Herodias who met, fell in lust and then conspired to put away their spouses without cause to have each other...THAT is the context of His words to the Jews.
I realize that some false doctrines like to run to absolutes but Im sorry that only ends in error.

Tell me this, GC.....who was lying here..Mark or Matthew....or maybe Jesus was ?

Mar 8:11-13 KJV And the Pharisees came forth, and began to question with him, seeking of him a sign from heaven, tempting him. (12) And he sighed deeply in his spirit, and saith, Why doth this generation seek after a sign? verily I say unto you, There shall no sign be given unto this generation. (13) And he left them, and entering into the ship again departed to the other side.

versus...

The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew them a sign from heaven. He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red. And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times? A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.
(Mat 16:1-4 KJV)

Tells us.. was Mark lying in his ABSOLUTE statement that NO SIGN would be given ?
Or is Matthew the liar when he says that no sign EXCEPT the one would be given ?

Mark offers NO exception....NO SIGN is listed at all.
Matthew shows that a sign WILL be given...that of Jonah.
So tell us which account is the accurate one if you please.


The facts from the WHOLE show us that a sign WAS given....the sign of Jonah even tho Mark does not provide that data.
So please understand if I reject the idea that I have to ONLY use Christs word in a couple passages about divorce and remarriage and instead do what I have to do about Marks account of this sign and look to the WHOLE of Gods word for my information.

Hyper-Calvinists do just what a few do here and run to a select few verses to create fallacies and error.

READERS SEE->Click->>> Comparing Hyper-marital doctrines to Hyper-Calvinism

The WHOLE truth is in the WHOLE bible....not 3 pet passages.

.

 

[HuntingMan]

already getting personal? not surprising.

The person you went after was responding to the OP and there was
nothing wrong w/ his statement; it was a general observation of
the result of the immorality that has crept into the church.

Sorry but I can READ, nadiine. That particular statement was directed SOLELY at remarriage in general. That poster has already made their views quite clear on the matter.
You need to stick to what you know rather than what you think you know just to get an argument going here.
You jumped the gun because you saw my screenname here....simple as that.

 

[Nadiine]

Yeah, you DID twist MY intent.as you have been doing since you realized we might not agree on something.
*I* was responding to comments pertaining to REmarriage as is quite evidence in *MY* post...
I suggest you go find someone else to argue with before a moderator is needed here.

he still wasn't wrong about THAT tho. It's written right out in
scripture. YOu read into his post what you wanted to read in to go
after him. (most likely becuz you disagree on the remarriage issue
from another thread).

Thankfully the OP isn't about divorce & remarriage details, so the thread
hopefully won't get hijacked into that mess.

 

[Nadiine]

Sorry but I can READ, nadiine. That particular statement was directed SOLELY at remarriage in general. That poster has already made their views quite clear on the matter.
You need to stick to what you know rather than what you think you know just to get an argument going here.
You jumped the gun because you saw my screenname here....simple as that.

who's arguing HM???
can't YOU just drop it??