Is it immoral to eat bacon?

[Ultima4257]

Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

Revelation 2:20, the words of Jesus Christ the LORD

Interesting verse, I may not have heard of that one. Considering what this says it seems you are correct.

 

[Itagaki]

Interesting verse, I may not have heard of that one. Considering what this says it seems you are correct.

Yeah. Paul and Jesus were sometimes at odds.

Like I said, look at Paul's view of marriage. He hated it and wanted everyone to be celibate eunuchs, not even men or women. Glad that is NOT God's view!

 

[Ultima4257]

You know what, I think I posted the wrong verse here. Sorry about that, this wasn't the one I was thinking of.

Okay I was partially right, it was a little further down. 1 Corinthians 7: Now about virgins: I have no command from the Lord, but I give a judgment as one who by the Lord’s mercy is trustworthy. 26 Because of the present crisis, I think that it is good for a man to remain as he is. 27 Are you pledged to a woman? Do not seek to be released. Are you free from such a commitment? Do not look for a wife. 28 But if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. But those who marry will face many troubles in this life, and I want to spare you this.
29 What I mean, brothers and sisters, is that the time is short. From now on those who have wives should live as if they do not; 30 those who mourn, as if they did not; those who are happy, as if they were not; those who buy something, as if it were not theirs to keep; 31 those who use the things of the world, as if not engrossed in them. For this world in its present form is passing away.
32 I would like you to be free from concern. An unmarried man is concerned about the Lord’s affairs —how he can please the Lord.33 But a married man is concerned about the affairs of this world—how he can please his wife— 34 and his interests are divided. An unmarried woman or virgin is concerned about the Lord’s affairs: Her aim is to be devoted to the Lord in both body and spirit. But a married woman is concerned about the affairs of this world—how she can please her husband. 35 I am saying this for your own good, not to restrict you, but that you may live in a right way in undivided devotion to the Lord.
36 If anyone is worried that he might not be acting honorably toward the virgin he is engaged to, and if his passions are too strong[b] and he feels he ought to marry, he should do as he wants. He is not sinning. They should get married. 37 But the man who has settled the matter in his own mind, who is under no compulsion but has control over his own will, and who has made up his mind not to marry the virgin—this man also does the right thing. 38 So then, he who marries the virgin does right, but he who does not marry her does better.[c]
39 A woman is bound to her husband as long as he lives. But if her husband dies, she is free to marry anyone she wishes, but he must belong to the Lord. 40In my judgment, she is happier if she stays as she is—and I think that I too have the Spirit of God. If you read this verse it sounds like Paul is stating that in his opinion it would be better to remain unmarried, thus he could serve the Lord better and because the time were short and very trying, he wanted to keep people free from concern as much as possible since they could focus more on God. I don't think he hated marriage per say, his mind was just more focused on the work of the kingdom.

 

[Itagaki]

Bad advice.

Aside from advising widows to stay single. That is good advice.

 

[Ark100]

1 Corinthians 10:23-32

The Believer’s Freedom


23 “I have the right to do anything,” you say—but not everything is beneficial. “I have the right to do anything”—but not everything is constructive.
24 No one should seek their own good, but the good of others.
25 Eat anything sold in the meat market without raising questions of conscience,
26 for, “The earth is the Lord’s, and everything in it.”[f]
27 If an unbeliever invites you to a meal and you want to go, eat whatever is put before you without raising questions of conscience.
28 But if someone says to you, “This has been offered in sacrifice,” then do not eat it, both for the sake of the one who told you and for the sake of conscience.
29 I am referring to the other person’s conscience, not yours. For why is my freedom being judged by another’s conscience?
30 If I take part in the meal with thankfulness, why am I denounced because of something I thank God for?
31 So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God.
32 Do not cause anyone to stumble, whether Jews, Greeks or the church of God

 

[seeingeyes]

I prefer not to.

I'm not like that.

Listen man, I don't know who treated you so badly. I don't know what sort of anti-marriage, anti-happiness, anti-bacon, anti-church poisoned your view of Christ. But let me be the first to apologize. Those folks were probably me before I got hit upside the head with God's grace. It breaks my heart to think of how many I chased away from the crazy love of God. (God forgive me, and I hope you can, too.)

But since I know what the view looks like from there, I can tell you this: if you spend your life trying to correct them on everything they are quibbling about, then you will be as much a slave to their law as they are. Don't let them turn you into a child of hell, even as you oppose them.

Seek first the kingdom of God. Turn your eyes to your Father. Let Him sort us out. Be at peace. None of us are out of His grasp, God can even save a Christian. I would know.

 

[Ark100]

He condemned marriage and said it's better to be single. God never said that. He even told people to eat meat offered to idols. Jesus outright condemned that in Revelation.

Where did paul tell people to eat meat offered to idols? Which verse in the bible?

 

[Itagaki]

He condemned marriage and said it's better to be single. God never said that. He even told people to eat meat offered to idols. Jesus outright condemned that in Revelation.

Where did paul tell people to eat meat offered to idols? Which verse in the bible?

Don't remember off-hand, but I'm pretty sure it's in corinthians (1st one). You need to read your bible more often. I'm guessing... chapter... (?) 8...??

Wonder how close I am? lol

 

[Ark100]

I think you really misunderstood Apostle Paul on his view regarding staying single and getting married. I think its best to read and digest what an ancient Apostle said and meant before concluding or judging them on what The Lord put in their mouth.

1 Corinthians 7:1-9

7 Now for the matters you wrote about: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.”
(Apostle Paul was talking specifically about the matter they wrote him which was what was happening in that area or church at the time he wrote that passage. How do you know they were not all engaging in sexual immorality which The Lord opposes?)

2 But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband.
(He made this clear what a married man should which is to have sex ONLY with their own wives and not with other women and young girls. Same thing was said to the women as well)

3 The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband.
(So if Apostle Paul said this, what makes you think he meant no one should marry? How come this part is always left out when some people claim Apostle Paul is against marriage and condemns it?)

4 The wife does not have authority over her own body but yields it to her husband. In the same way, the husband does not have authority over his own body but yields it to his wife.
(This is biblical truth, its nothing but the truth, which is why God created man for woman and woman for man. What would be the point of being joined together as husband and wife if one cannot yield their body to the other in harmony?)

5 Do not deprive each other except perhaps by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.
(Truth and nothing but the truth. We know what happens to a lot of marriages when many women don't put out, same with men. The other party gets tempted and starts looking elsewhere for satisfaction because they are not getting some at home)

6 I say this as a concession, not as a command.
(Apostle Paul specifically mentioned that everything he said he said it as a concession not a command. He does not own anyone and is not God. He responded to their letter and request. Concession is a thing that is granted esp in response to demand. As an apostle he had to lead, advice and respond.

7 I wish that all of you were as I am. But each of you has your own gift from God; one has this gift, another has that.
('I WISH' is not a command. I could turn to my friend and tell her that I wish she could sing or act like me, it does not mean I will make her or command her to. Apostle Paul wished because he was happy being a single man. He knew he could not be tempted by the enemy to fornicate or have immoral sex. That is why he pointed out that everyone has their own gift from God. No man is the same. Some men are happy to be monks and some are happy married. That is how God designed each person)

8 Now to the unmarried[a] and the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I do.
(It is good does not mean a command. Its an advice to the people being spoken to. For all we know, they were all committing adultery even while married, and doing all sorts of things which were sins unto God)

9 But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.
(And this concludes his message which really does emphasise what he was going on about. If you can't control yourself, MARRY...whats the point of burning with passion and committing immoral acts. Better to marry than burn with passion. So in conclusion, aPOSTLE paul did not encourage anyone to not marry neither did he command or force them. God has the final say in everything, and none of the apostles claimed to be God or acted like one. They only did what The Lord sent them to do.)

 

[Itagaki]

I think you really misunderstood Apostle Paul on his view regarding staying single and getting married. I think its best to read and digest what an ancient Apostle said and meant before concluding or judging them on what The Lord put in their mouth.

7 I wish that all of you were as I am. But each of you has your own gift from God; one has this gift, another has that.
('I WISH' is not a command. I could turn to my friend and tell her that I wish she could sing or act like me, it does not mean I will make her or command her to. Apostle Paul wished because he was happy being a single man. He knew he could not be tempted by the enemy to fornicate or have immoral sex. That is why he pointed out that everyone has their own gift from God. No man is the same. Some men are happy to be monks and some are happy married. That is how God designed each person)

8 Now to the unmarried[a] and the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I do.
(It is good does not mean a command. Its an advice to the people being spoken to. For all we know, they were all committing adultery even while married, and doing all sorts of things which were sins unto God)

9 But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.
(And this concludes his message which really does emphasise what he was going on about. If you can't control yourself, MARRY...whats the point of burning with passion and committing immoral acts. Better to marry than burn with passion. So in conclusion, aPOSTLE paul did not encourage anyone to not marry neither did he command or force them. God has the final say in everything, and none of the apostles claimed to be God or acted like one. They only did what The Lord sent them to do.)

It's his opinion, not God's. And it is bad advice.

Ensnaring people with gnostic ideas about how evil sex is helps no one, save the few less than 1% of the world's populace that is asexual.

This advice is not useful to most people living in our world and should be treated as such. If I told you to do something obviously foolish and harmful, then my advice ought to not be followed.

Even dragging God into this is a bit foolish, since God already said all He wanted to in Genesis 2.

And marrying just to have sex is TERRIBLE advice! Not even Christians would advise anyone to do that!!

 

[Ark100]

I will not argue with you, but I think you need to ask for the infilling of The Holy Spirit, so you can understand more about what you read in the bible, and not just read at face value therefore discerning with foolish wisdom of the world.
What paul said, he said to the people who wrote the letter.
Lastly, Paul was talking about weak people regarding the eating of food sacrificed to idols...He said some people are so weak that whatever they do, even if its okay because of what Christ has done for us.., then they would still feel they are committing sins. Which brings us to your original question. Do you think you might be a weak Christian?
Good-luck.

 

[ChrisHolland619]

I can't tell if the OP is being serious or not.

 

[Itagaki]

I will not argue with you, but I think you need to ask for the infilling of The Holy Spirit, so you can understand more about what you read in the bible, and not just read at face value therefore discerning with foolish wisdom of the world.
What paul said, he said to the people who wrote the letter.
Lastly, Paul was talking about weak people regarding the eating of food sacrificed to idols...He said some people are so weak that whatever they do, even if its okay because of what Christ has done for us.., then they would still feel they are committing sins. Which brings us to your original question. Do you think you might be a weak Christian?
Good-luck.

Good.

But I hear you saying, "pray so that you can understand it exactly as I do." Which we both know will never happen because I'm not you. And last I checked, I already have that infilling, thanks.

My original question was, is it immoral to consume swine?

That has nothing to do with your question.

It depends upon your definition of what is a "weak Christian". I can't answer a question until I know exactly what it is you are asking.

 

[emmliy]

we are all weak

 

[TheDag]

If you want to follow the 10 Commandments, you must honour Shabbat, or you're breaking it.

I know for a fact no one on here keeps it, so why do they try to make others follow their laws? Hypocrites.

Please provide your evidence for this claim. once again making false accusations. Ever heard about not bearing false witness?

Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

Revelation 2:20, the words of Jesus Christ the LORD

no this is not the word of God if you do not accept Paul's writings as the word of God. no double standards please. What do you use to describe that again? hypocrite i believe!

Observing Shabbat is the Fourth Commandment. Do you keep the Shabbat? It's Friday sundown until Saturday sundown. No work, shopping or leaving your home is allowed, by Jewish Law. Ask any Rabbi.

In the Bible, you were stoned if you even did yard work on Shabbat.

Judaism 101: Shabbat

well then Jesus was a sinner and therefore could not pay the price for our sins. you really are arguing for the sake of arguing aren't you!

 

[TheDag]

acts 10:9

one of the most out of context quoted scriptures in the bible. i prefer to use the bibles interpretation of this dream rather than assuming it actually has to do with declaring food clean or unclean.

 

[Itagaki]

Is Australia becoming more fundamentalist these days?

 

[Steve Petersen]

Is it immoral to eat human flesh?

 

[emmliy]

live my god

 

[Angelfrog]

Food for thought indeed. Needs careful chewing over- wouldn't want to make any comments that are rasher than ones before.

Whether my bacon eating is immoral or not probably depends on whether I'm sitting in my kitchen chowing down on a bacon sarnie- or sitting stark naked in a shopping trolley in the middle of the supermarket while I scoff a few rashers of best Danish.

I may have to keep my clothes on next time, then.