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Man, are you mistaken about that! Was it just some sort of wild guess?Conversely, I am struck by the total unreality of what sworn initiates think it's about.
Being committed to churchianity is not the same as being committed to Christianity, but often passes for such.
You completely ignore question after question and specific after specific.QUOTE="Albion; I am surprised to read this, Rick, because it is undeniable that Masons who are members here of CF have answered question after question, and point after point, with plenty of specifics.
What you consistently refuse to include and address is compartmentalization, and that has been repeatedly made abundantly clear . Your allegations are as far from the truth as they possibly could be.Then they are usually told by the other party something like Masons are required to lie, or that they don't know what they are doing (although the non-Masons who have never experience any of it are experts for some reason that's never made entirely clear).
Look to yourselves for the blame. We're not hiding anything, Masons are.Engaging the Masons in a discussion or give-and-take is actually rare.
Oh, that's cute. As cute as the ritual costume gear you guys wear. I saw some employee in a hardware store wearing a gaudy mason symbol like an amulet, he had pins & rings... he obviously had his identity wrapped up tight in this....or is presented on a scary-looking website or printed in a book by some unknown author?
Sir, it is you who are mistaken and it was the entirety of your voluminous denials that is wild, but thanks for your experienced opinion.Man, are you mistaken about that! Was it just some sort of wild guess?
I don't think this is true. Try me.You completely ignore question after question and specific after specific.
And the ones you do bother with deflect from the theory, not addressing it.
Oh, that's cute. As cute as the ritual costume gear you guys wear.
A lapel pin or two and a ring. Is that why Masonry is to be avoided???he had pins & rings
For what it's worth, I agree. I disagree with you on a great many things, I suspect, but you seem very forthcoming and honest on this subject.I don't think this is true. Try me.
"All the?" Whom do you have in mind there?And what did they say that shows Masonry to be "satanic to the core?"
There are about 3,000,000 Masons in the USA alone, so I assume that there are quite a number of these people you are referring to--the "all the" people.
It doesn't prove that they do, either...or that they even exist.Just because most of the 3million you quote only rise to the 3rd rank to be called master masons, who pay dues and go to the dinner parties, doesnt mean that high ranked ones who run it all, arent satanic.
Be specific and I will be able to answer you.You do realize the majority dont know what its about? The gnostic parts, the anti Christian parts.
Try me before concluding that.Id post youtube links of past masons exposing it to be satanic, but youd just deny it.
Its all out there.
It's not about knowing what else an oath swearing initiate is gullible about.
First of all, you're guessing.QUOTE="circuitrider; You must not have met many Masons.
Yes, in the extreme. Either that or you think I am, as you prove next...Gullible?
Not buying it for religious second.I studied the fraternity for almost a decade before I joined. I read all of the Masonic material (and anti-masonic material) I could get my hands on
.I'm am an ordained United Methodist minister (Elder in Full Connection) with an undergrad degree in Biblical Studies, just short of a minor in New Testament Greek, and a Master of Divinity from an accredited seminary, as well as nearly 30 years pastoring churches. I taught for several years in the religious studies department of one of our UMC related colleges. Suffice it to say I know my Christian doctrine and I know the teachings of Freemasonry
With that statement alone you reveal yourself for what you are and how much you really know about what the criticisms actually say, specifically about the assault on Christianity that is brought into the churches by the builders (of the tower) who think they are going to be free (of judgement) masons when "The Craft" produces "The Great Work".What anti-Masons can't grasp is that quite a large number of Masons are highly educated Christian leaders who have researched the fraternity and found nothing to object to. And, in fact many Christian clergy have found Freemasonry to be valuable and worthy of participating in.
You are allowed to be derisive and dismissive because you have embedded yourself in the kingdom of this world.But, you couldn't accept that because you'd have to stop believing your silly pet conspiracy theory about a secret evil society.
LOL, they know everything already too, and we don't know any or never been ourselves, a Mason, so duh!...
If anyone wants to see video after video, a simple youtube search will return a trove of data. Also albert pikes book can be bought at amazon, or read online for free. Alot of websites show you the quotes about it being satanic, and how free masonry is a group that meddles in politics and power at the highest level.
Its all out there. Or you can listen to a free mason who's taken an oath to NEVER tell you wahts going on. They deny everything because they took an oath, an oath that says they should be killed if they reveal anything (im not certain if any have been killed, but its their oath so)
As if I haven't a million times just like I said and you again ignore, and now you try me to see if you can send me on a fool's errand.QUOTE="Albion, post: 73334297, member: 93831"]I don't think this is true. Try me.
You LOVE to deflect with oversimplification. You are the best at it I've seen yet. I fell for it over ten years ago when I was still new here, but I'm finally on to you now.A lapel pin or two and a ring. Is that why Masonry is to be avoided???
Again you deflect and redirect off topic.Since there isn't a particular costume and nothing very stunning in any case, I would like to have a real description from you as to what you are picturing in your mind's eye.
From what I have been seeing here, you have been posting a lot but addressing almost nothing specific about Masonry. So of course there has been no opportunity under those conditions for us to answer anything for you and other readers.As if I haven't a million times just like I said and you again ignore, and now you try me to see if you can send me on a fool's errand.
It's insulting, and you count it virtue.
Albion has done nothing to dissuade me. His ruses don't work on me because I know who I am.I admire Albion for the on going effort he makes to dissuade you of conspiracy theories around Freemasonry. Its clear you won't believe the unvarnished truth when given to you. Feel free to continue making stuff up. <eye roll>
Your observations are obviously selective, your conclusion is wild and without substantiation, and your whole post is Once Again completely off topic.From what I have been seeing here, you have been posting a lot but addressing almost nothing specific about Masonry. So of course there has been no opportunity under those conditions for us to answer anything for you and other readers.
Albion has done nothing to dissuade me. His ruses don't work on me because I know who I am.
I'm not a "builder" who rejects the cornerstone, and not free of God's judgement either.
Generic, general dismissals and denials do not make for good conversation imo. Pardon me if start ignoring you.
Were you accused of that? Is that even an issue?There is no attempt being made to recruit anyone.
Nonsense. You're embarrassing us now.And it is not in the least personal.
We've all heard your stuff many times before as well and we are simply aspiring to set the record straight according to what we know in addition to the compartmentalized lower initiates of a secret society. Nothing to see here, move along.We have heard all this stuff many times before and are aware that other people read these posts too and may have similar questions, depending on what hearsay they have picked up. We are simply aspiring to answer questions and set the record straight when mistaken ideas about Masonry are posted.
While that sounds noble and Christian on the surface, I don't see how your good intentions make a hundreds- of-years-old-secret society not satanic. The circumstantial evidence against rosy assumptions is a tsunami against your testimony of a lower-initiate position, assuming you are a lower initiate.What's more, I am quite willing to agree that SOME Christians probably ought not to become Masons. For example, if a person belongs to one of the churches that takes the view that it is wrong to pray while in the company of Christians who belong to other denominations, even if the prayer were the Lords Prayer. I would certainly not want them to defy the rules of their own church even if I disagree with those rules.
We're still waiting to hear a silly and outrageous claim except from a few who say they are masons. That wouldn't have anything to do with you, would it? Just like you said to me, this is not personal.But that doesn't have anything to do with all the silly and outrageous claims that people pick up about Masonry from who knows where.
It is not us who needs to be reminded what the topic is as my previous posts make abundantly clear, & as for you waiting...As for staying on topic, the topic questioned whether Masonry is "Satanic." We are waiting for any reason to think that it is.
You make these micro - pontifications as if nobody knows and it hasn't already been done and handed to you . It's been years since I've been able to take you seriously. And none of this is yet on topic.Anyone, pro or con, needs to have have specifics, not just the word Satanic, for any evaluation to take place.
the Torah Bans initiated people to live among the Israelites this means being a freemasonry is not compatiable with being achristians
from the Septuagint the Greek translation of the original Hebrew bible
Deut 23: 17 and there shall not be an initiated person of the sons of Israel.
Maybe I should get myself a copy of that Hebrew Bible, sir.
Thanks for that interesting information.
modern bibles that use the Masoretic OT translation don't have that verse
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