Is evidence of aliens evidence for evolution or something else?

[stevevw]

I think it's probably something like soul or spirit. It's God's breath and God doesn't breathe in an atmosphere. So it's probably the thing that makes humans different from animals or something like that imo.

Yeah I agree. But then some think that animals can have a degree of consciousness or that everything is conscious. Perhaps there is levels of consciousness and humans are at the pinnacle that we can have a relationship with God.

 

[JohnPaul88]

I recently watched a special on TV called "Under Investigation" produced by 60 Minutes Australia. They had experts on the panel as well as eye witness military pilots testimony and data from surveillance devices across a range of equipment. This was evidence released by the US government recently admitting that there are what they now call "Unidentified Arial Objects". They admit they are solid objects that defy our current technology.

So that got me thinking if they are more advanced intelligent alien life where did they come from. Did they evolve or are they part of Gods creation. How would a creationist rationalize this into creation theory. How would a Christian rationalize this into redemption.

If aliens did evolve which I think would be fairly probable if evolution happened without any divine guidance then does this disprove creation theory. Or maybe these aliens are very smart but lack the image of God or that its part of Satan's ploy to fool the world before his coming.

There is no such thing as Aliens unless you are talking about foreigners from another country or illegal aliens crossing the borders into the US everyday.

God created man in his image, if such things existed it would be said in the Bible.

 

[stevevw]

There is no such thing as Aliens unless you are talking about foreigners from another country or illegal aliens crossing the borders into the US everyday.

God created man in his image, if such things existed it would be said in the Bible.

Thats one of the reasons I started the thread. I wanted to guage peoples views about what the implications would be if we actually found alien life and what that would mean for belief and well as evolution. So its a thought experiement so it doesn't mean there are aliens one way or another but rather discuss the possibilities and implications.

I tend to agree that aliens would be mentioned in the Bible. But that is why I posed the idea that what is thought to be aliens is actually angels and that this would be a good way for Satan to reveal himself to the world.

Or another idea is that there is a form of alien life on other planets but its not conscious intelligent and moral life but some advanced animal without a soul in the case of evolution.

Once again I am not saying this is the case but posing the idea.

But I agree that its hard to reconcile Biblically.

 

[Cis.jd]

Did they evolve or are they part of Gods creation. How would a creationist rationalize this into creation theory. How would a Christian rationalize this into redemption.

If aliens did evolve which I think would be fairly probable if evolution happened without any divine guidance then does this disprove creation theory. Or maybe these aliens are very smart but lack the image of God or that its part of Satan's ploy to fool the world before his coming.

Maybe. We don't know everything because the Bible was never meant to be about the cosmos, it was just meant to help man in his relationship with God and maybe also with handling things in his/her personal life. It is for spirituality, not science nor politics.

I don't see how Aliens connect to evolution at all.

Some people theorize aliens are the fallen angels. When angels fell, they entered our physical universe and since they where not made in the image of God, their physical form became the aliens we've imagined.. and since they where cut from grace, they have no power so they rely on their intelligence/knowledge to build their own technology. Most people who believe/theorized this also think that all the pagan gods in history where their offspring as recorded in Genesis 6:2.

Gen 6:2 has been interpreted by some people to be aliens. There is no way at this time to know if they are right or not, so it shouldn't matter at all. The Apostle's Creed is what you should base your beliefs when written on paper.

 

[JohnPaul88]

Thats one of the reasons I started the thread. I wanted to guage peoples views about what the implications would be if we actually found alien life and what that would mean for belief and well as evolution. So its a thought experiement so it doesn't mean there are aliens one way or another but rather discuss the possibilities and implications.

I tend to agree that aliens would be mentioned in the Bible. But that is why I posed the idea that what is thought to be aliens is actually angels and that this would be a good way for Satan to reveal himself to the world.

Or another idea is that there is a form of alien life on other planets but its not conscious intelligent and moral life but some advanced animal without a soul in the case of evolution.

Once again I am not saying this is the case but posing the idea.

But I agree that its hard to reconcile Biblically.

God gave us all freewill, I choose not to believe in such things, just in God, Christ and his creation on Earth.

Peace be with you brother.

 

[Leaf473]

Thats one of the reasons I started the thread. I wanted to guage peoples views about what the implications would be if we actually found alien life and what that would mean for belief and well as evolution. So its a thought experiement so it doesn't mean there are aliens one way or another but rather discuss the possibilities and implications.

I tend to agree that aliens would be mentioned in the Bible. But that is why I posed the idea that what is thought to be aliens is actually angels and that this would be a good way for Satan to reveal himself to the world.

Or another idea is that there is a form of alien life on other planets but its not conscious intelligent and moral life but some advanced animal without a soul in the case of evolution.

Once again I am not saying this is the case but posing the idea.

But I agree that its hard to reconcile Biblically.

I have a friend, lifelong christian, who says that the day they find intelligent life on other planets is the day he becomes an atheist.

To me, that doesn't seem like it has to be a necessary conclusion.

Two examples from history of the Bible and discoveries come to my mind:

The Bible doesn't talk about the Earth being a sphere and rotating. People routinely accept that today.

When European explorers encountered people in the south Pacific Islands who went around naked and unashamed, they figured those people must not be descendants of Adam and Eve. If they were, they would know they were naked.

Christianity is very adaptable, though there is often resistance at the beginning.

Great discussion!

 

[Daniel Marsh]

I recently watched a special on TV called "Under Investigation" produced by 60 Minutes Australia. They had experts on the panel as well as eye witness military pilots testimony and data from surveillance devices across a range of equipment. This was evidence released by the US government recently admitting that there are what they now call "Unidentified Arial Objects". They admit they are solid objects that defy our current technology.

So that got me thinking if they are more advanced intelligent alien life where did they come from. Did they evolve or are they part of Gods creation. How would a creationist rationalize this into creation theory. How would a Christian rationalize this into redemption.

If aliens did evolve which I think would be fairly probable if evolution happened without any divine guidance then does this disprove creation theory. Or maybe these aliens are very smart but lack the image of God or that its part of Satan's ploy to fool the world before his coming.

Their report is based on the myth of Project Blue Book. I was in military intelligence and had access to all manuals. The USAF never produced such a document or study. Project Blue Book was fabercated by UFO compiracy nuts.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

Isn't it a bit early for speculations? An "unidentified aerial object" doesn't give much information to base a theory on. We don't even know whether there is life in/on those objects.

Some of the made up stories had those craft taking off at angles and speeds that would destroy brains of any living being on them.
Yes, comerical piolts had seen someing that could not be explained, nor verified.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

But the technology to have such objects is only something intelligent beings would have. Its either human made or made by some other intelligent being. Natural occurrences have been ruled out because the objects have been scientifically verified as solid. They move with intention so something is going on and the tech is far beyond what we could have even the Chinese.

Military says these types of sightings have been going on for years, they have just become more frequent. So I don't think any nation could have such tech as to achieve this level you would also be advanced is most other ways and we see no evidence of this from any Nation. But then maybe some nation has hidden their tech for years. Its hard to say. I was only pestering about it, that's why I asked the questions.

If I was from another planet, I would take one look and run home real fast.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

Yes that's a possibility if we think of what some claim with quantum physics. Another possibility is Nick Bostrom Simulation hypothesis - Wikipedia which Elon Musk thinks is a good possibility. This is based on future humans becoming so advanced that they create life like simulations which we are experiencing now. They could play all sorts of tricks on us.
What is the simulation hypothesis? Why some think life is a simulated reality

Why not. What if there are conscious beings like us out there. Do they also need redemption. If so I cannot imagine Christ being crucified twice or more on different planets. I don't think distant beings could hear the message of redemption from earth.

I think its important that Christ came and resurrected on earth. We have the history and relevance that connects us. That's why I think if there are aliens then maybe they are just very smart animals without a soul.

Maybe creatures on other planets have not sinned. If they did, I see no reason to believe that Jesus would not have died for them on their planet.

I do have dreams of aliens visiting earth. Maybe you all have read the thread.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

Hi @stevevw



So what? Humans aren't intelligent beings? Look, the other day there was a report on my news about a UFO. Turns out it was a weather balloon and that it's reflectiveness with the sun shining on it, much like the moon, it looked as some super brilliant round object in the sky. Now, you take something like that and it hits some upward level strong wind forces and it quickly seems to move one way and then almost immediately moves just as quickly in some other direction because it happens to have found a confluence of winds blowing in different directions. We see the same thing happen in sea currents at particular places in the oceans. Where the currents collide and things floating on them just go in all different directions.

So, I'm not saying that this does answer every example that has ever been witnessed. But I am saying, that there may be fairly normal explanations for some of these sightings that, because we don't know exactly what's going on in the atmosphere where the objects are, seem weird to us. What I know, is that as yet, we don't have any factual, verifiable evidence that somewhere out there is a planet of living human-like creatures.

But as I said, there are certainly some that make us go "Hmmm", but as yet, no proof that any of it isn't some phenomenon created by some object of earthly origin.

God bless,
Ted

When Stealth aircraft were being tested, they were reported as being UFO's. Some even claimed they were demons in disguise.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

C.S. Lewis wrote a book(s) on life on other planets, but I don't remember what the book(s) were.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

What exactly is your documentation from Military sources? Newspapers are useless to me because they have reported my death many times from various events.

I agree many sightings have a natural explanation. But what makes this different is that

1) the Military has always denied UFO's period and now they have finally admitted there is something they cannot explain which cannot be attributed to anything natural.
2) that they have hard evidence from radar and other measuring devices and that they are solid and around 2 or 3 meters. Solid items unless very light cannot float with the wind.
3) that pilots have had near misses with them (500 meters) and seen them up close. Numerous independent sightings describing the same thing which was also recorded on their instruments and on the instruments from the aircraft carriers at the same time.

They described these objects as being like a metallic cube inside a translucent sphere. Now I know there's some nutters out there and it may be mass hallucination or it may be some some advanced tech from some nation and any of this doesn't prove there are aliens.

IMO I am a skeptic of UFO's and also think there is no intelligent life in the universe but this has got me very interested and a bit rattled as I think its unprecedented.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

At what speeds are human like bodies damaged or killed?

Yes I also think there are other possibilities to explore. But unlike " LIght" these objects are solid. The radars lock on them like they are something solid moving. But in thinking about what you said it brings up the fact that if even if they travelled at the speed of light it would still take a very long time, too long for human like beings to survive that journey.

So perhaps if they are real they would have to have some sort of tech that allowed for faster than the speed of light travel or an ability to being able to defy the laws of the classical laws of physics such as to do with quantum physics.

They may not have contacted us because they don't want to at this stage. They may know that they can never be captured even if detected and its interesting that most sightings are over military air space. So they may be wanting to understand our tech.

On the other hand if they are advanced in tech you would think they already know what our tech capabilities are so you would think they either realize we are no threat and make contact.

So if it is some other phenomena then its very strange. Maybe some nation has developed quantum travel of some sort. But what strikes me as unusual is that the objects are solid and move beyond our capability and that pilots have seen them from close up and described them.

Still you are right that we cannot discount unknown natural causes that we just don't understand just like people thought strange occurrances were from beyond this world in the past.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

I do not see any relationships to the topic.
Six Things Everyone Should Know About Quantum Physics



LAW 4: Quantisation
Things come in bite-size chunks
Reality guide: The essential laws of quantum physics | New Scientist

Yes I also think there are other possibilities to explore. But unlike " LIght" these objects are solid. The radars lock on them like they are something solid moving. But in thinking about what you said it brings up the fact that if even if they travelled at the speed of light it would still take a very long time, too long for human like beings to survive that journey.

So perhaps if they are real they would have to have some sort of tech that allowed for faster than the speed of light travel or an ability to being able to defy the laws of the classical laws of physics such as to do with quantum physics.

They may not have contacted us because they don't want to at this stage. They may know that they can never be captured even if detected and its interesting that most sightings are over military air space. So they may be wanting to understand our tech.

On the other hand if they are advanced in tech you would think they already know what our tech capabilities are so you would think they either realize we are no threat and make contact.

So if it is some other phenomena then its very strange. Maybe some nation has developed quantum travel of some sort. But what strikes me as unusual is that the objects are solid and move beyond our capability and that pilots have seen them from close up and described them.

Still you are right that we cannot discount unknown natural causes that we just don't understand just like people thought strange occurrances were from beyond this world in the past.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Consider this.
I believe in the concept of Theistic Evolution. Part of that belief is this:

Gen 1:11-12 God said, “Let the earth bring forth [plant life] And the earth brought forth [plant life] ...
Gen 1: 24 God said, “Let the earth bring forth [animal life] ...
​

The key words are "let the earth bring forth." So where exactly did life come from? Literally, God commanded the earth (dirt) to bring forth plant and animal life. God made the earth into a life generating machine. A life factory. And so that is what happened:

• The dirt was empowered by the Word of God to generate life.
• An "earth beast-man" (not Adam) evolved from the beasts of verse 24.
• The Divine Majesty or Council saw these beast men and said (in verse 26) "let us make man" (that man beast that evolved from verse 24) "in Our image." These are the ancient "man-like" creatures we find in archeology. He took what was already there (beast men) and made them into the image of the divine. This act of God is seen as a huge leap in the evolution of "earth man."
• Long after the events of the sixth day, God made Eden, Adam, and then Eve. This is the "God man." This was long after the events of the sixth day when "earth beast-man" was made into the image of the divine council.
• After the events of the Garden, "God man" (Adam and Eve) were tossed out of Eden and began to mix with the "earth men' from Gen 1:24-26. So here we are now.

I said all this as a backdrop to the possible existence of extra-terrestrial beings.
Let me suggest that when God created other planets in the universe, these planets also possessed the power to generate life - just like earth. Consider what would happen if these planets generated beast-men just like the earth. However, God did not intervene into the evolution of these "beast men". IOWs God did not "make" them "into Our image"? Where would natural evolution have taken these "beast men"? The answer may be what many people claim to have seen in recent years.
So, to answer the OP. Consider that these ETs may be the hyper evolved "beast" creatures from other planets. Essentially, they may be what the "earth beast-man" of Gen 1:24-26 could have evolved into if the "gods" had not made them into Their image.
Peace.
Just thoughts and possibilities.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

Have any planets like earth been discovered?

It's possible intelligent life has been produced many times throughout the universe. Or it's also possible that the conditions to produce life are so exact that even with millions of possible planets it's only happened on one.

For me the key idea is that God breathed into Adam his breath, and that's what made Adam a human. Has God done that on other planets? Who knows?

Great thread topic. Peace be with you!

 

[Daniel Marsh]

I have enjoyed the speculation, good discussion all.

 

[Leaf473]

Have any planets like earth been discovered?

I don't think so. Do you know of any?

 

[Leaf473]

C.S. Lewis wrote a book(s) on life on other planets, but I don't remember what the book(s) were.

You might be thinking of the Ransom trilogy.

Like the author of this web page, I read Perelandra first.
Perelandra: Re-awakening the Spiritual Imagination - Official Site | CSLewis.com