Is eating Pork wrong?

[sleepingdog]

I don't insist that they speak anything, although, Hebrew was what they spoke in biblical times.

Shouldn't it be called the Israeli Almanac then?

I am saying that I am going to use the original language used in scripture as my guide and I am going to discard anyone else's opinion. I think that is simple to understand.

I ahve never read Arthur Keostler so I really do not have an opinion.



They were born in Israel and they followed the Judaism religion. Jesus recruited the apostles and then died for us to usher in the New Covenant. At that time the apostles no longer followed Judaism and became Christian. The original authors of scripture called them Ἰουδαίων and so will I.


Gentiles were all that did not follow Judaism. During Jesus time there were many Romans and Greeks within Jerusalem so the term was interchangeable with them. However, in the OT many people that did not follow Judaism were called gentiles.


Use scripture instead of Webster's dictionary. It will serve you much better.

Hebrew in Biblical times for Israel,Yiddish for the modern Jews.

"Strictly speaking it is incorrect to call an ancient Israelite a "Jew"

What's so hard to understand about that?
You can't very well call Jews are Israel if they say it is incorrect...

Read post 105 on Yiddish by Arthur Koestler,who by the way is a Jew.

The Tradition of the elders was the Talmud in the time of Jesus,and the Talmud was formed in Babylon,why would Jesus and the Apostles follow something that was formed in Babylon?

Stephen S. Wise, deceased, and formerly Chief Rabbi of the United States stated, "The return from Babylon and the adoption of the Babylonian Talmud marked the end of Hebrewism and the beginning of Judaism. "

Matthew 15:2:Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

What you are doing is connecting Judaism with Israel which is an extremely false connection.

Judaism is not the religion of the Bible.

Jew in the NT simply means a geographic address or a Tribe.

You seem to imply that the only meaning it carries is Judaism...

Did you read the 1828 Webster's definition?

the denomination was given to all nations who were not Romans.

Jesus and the Apostles were not Romans,that would make them gentiles.
Or in YOUR modern sense non-Jews?

You do know words carry meanings and you seem to assume the modern meanings of words.

Jew=Judaism
Gentile=Non Jew

You should use other resources like a Strong's Exhaustive Concordance to help you along.....

 

[ptomwebster]

Another stupid rule that has no practical value in real life...

I find religion to be VERY impractical to modern life. :/

There is no logic behind this rule. Modern pork is no worse - or better - for you than beef or chicken or anything else processed we eat.

Do modern pigs have sweat glands? Did Christ's death on the cross give them sweat glands? Did Christ's death on the cross mean you don't need to have your children wash their hands before they eat? Take another look at the dietary laws and then think of the sanitation rules we have today. Not following God's dietary law is not a sin unto death but not following them might cause you to get sick. Remember they didn't have very good refrigerators back then.

 

[rogueriver]

Was not the handwriting of ordinances nailed to the cross?

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

(Eph 2:15) the law of commandments contained in ordinances
(Col 2:14) the handwriting of ordinances
(Hebrews 7:16) the law of a carnal commandment
(Hebrews 9:10) "carnal ordinances"

Then why are people still living as though they weren’t? It becomes then “touch not , taste not, handle not” after the commandments of men who pick and choose which outward ordinance to follow and then judge others with it. Glorying in the flesh keeps one from loving another because they judge others as sinners because of the particular outward ordinance that they follow and glory in.

Colossians 2: 20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?
23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

The Pharisees judged after the flesh. We are to judge what is within not what is without.

John 8:15 Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man.

 

[sleepingdog]

Was not the handwriting of ordinances nailed to the cross?

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

(Eph 2:15) the law of commandments contained in ordinances
(Col 2:14) the handwriting of ordinances
(Hebrews 7:16) the law of a carnal commandment
(Hebrews 9:10) "carnal ordinances"

Then why are people still living as though they weren’t? It becomes then “touch not , taste not, handle not” after the commandments of men who pick and choose which outward ordinance to follow and then judge others with it. Glorying in the flesh keeps one from loving another because they judge others as sinners because of the particular outward ordinance that they follow and glory in.

Colossians 2: 20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?
23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

The Pharisees judged after the flesh. We are to judge what is within not what is without.

John 8:15 Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man.

Regarding Colossians 2:14..
Read it with v 15

Colossians 2:14-15:14Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.


Where does it say Mosaic law?


Colossians 2:8:Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.


Jesus saved us from our sins by nailing the traditions of men,laws of men to the cross.


It is the laws of man that makes one disobey God?


Did Christ Cleanse Unclean Animals Or Clean Men? Parts 1,2,3 and 4



http://www.sheldonemrylibrary.com/8126a.mp3
http://www.sheldonemrylibrary.com/8126b.mp3
http://www.sheldonemrylibrary.com/8127a.mp3
http://www.sheldonemrylibrary.com/8127b.mp3

 

[Hentenza]

Hebrew in Biblical times for Israel,Yiddish for the modern Jews.

"Strictly speaking it is incorrect to call an ancient Israelite a "Jew"

What's so hard to understand about that?
You can't very well call Jews are Israel if they say it is incorrect...

Read post 105 on Yiddish by Arthur Koestler,who by the way is a Jew.

The Tradition of the elders was the Talmud in the time of Jesus,and the Talmud was formed in Babylon,why would Jesus and the Apostles follow something that was formed in Babylon?

Stephen S. Wise, deceased, and formerly Chief Rabbi of the United States stated, "The return from Babylon and the adoption of the Babylonian Talmud marked the end of Hebrewism and the beginning of Judaism. "

Matthew 15:2:Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

What you are doing is connecting Judaism with Israel which is an extremely false connection.

Judaism is not the religion of the Bible.

Jew in the NT simply means a geographic address or a Tribe.

You seem to imply that the only meaning it carries is Judaism...

Did you read the 1828 Webster's definition?

the denomination was given to all nations who were not Romans.

Jesus and the Apostles were not Romans,that would make them gentiles.
Or in YOUR modern sense non-Jews?

You do know words carry meanings and you seem to assume the modern meanings of words.

Jew=Judaism
Gentile=Non Jew

You should use other resources like a Strong's Exhaustive Concordance to help you along.....

Again, I am going to continue using the original language of scripture and I am not going to use your interpretation. I thought I made that clear.

BTW- I use a wide range of resources in my word studies not just Strong's.

 

[sleepingdog]

Again, I am going to continue using the original language of scripture and I am not going to use your interpretation. I thought I made that clear.

BTW- I use a wide range of resources in my word studies not just Strong's.

Oh,really? my interpretation is not simple,right?

Well give me your interpretation on why Jesus and the Apostles were ''gentiles'' while Paul was not?


the denomination was given to all nations who were not Romans.

What is so hard to understand about that?

Why would you do things when the Jews say it is incorrect?Israel spoke Hebrew,didn't they? Modern Jews speak Yiddish.

Are you going to continue to equate Jesus and the Apostles followed the Talmud,which was formed in Babylon?Are you going to continue to confuse the word Jew with Israel and Judaism?

If you really do use Strong's you would know what Jew means....


Read this carefully....

Stephen S. Wise, deceased, and formerly Chief Rabbi of the United States stated, "The return from Babylon and the adoption of the Babylonian Talmud marked the end of Hebrewism and the beginning of Judaism. "

I'm not sure you will have answers to this,we can go around again and again and I think you will only answer what suits you....

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Galatians 4:22-31

King James Version (KJV)



22For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
30Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. 31So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

The Covenant from Sinai is flesh, and puts in bondage.

But the New Covenant from above is Spirit, and is Free.

Except a man is born again from above, he shall in no way enter into the Kingdom of heaven.

 

[sleepingdog]

Galatians 4:22-31

King James Version (KJV)



22For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
30Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. 31So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

The Covenant from Sinai is flesh, and puts in bondage.

But the New Covenant from above is Spirit, and is Free.

Except a man is born again from above, he shall in no way enter into the Kingdom of heaven.

http://www.israelect.com/reference/ArnoldKennedy/'Born Again' or 'Begotten From Above'~.pdf - BORN AGAIN – OR “BORN FROM ABOVE”?

An examination from language to show that Jesus did not say, “Ye must be born again”. An examination of “Born-again-ism” with paragraphs on, “Whom did God beget”, “Abraham and Sarah -the origin” and what “formed from the womb” means.

 

[rogueriver]

Regarding Colossians 2:14..
Read it with v 15

Colossians 2:14-15:14Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.


Where does it say Mosaic law?


Colossians 2:8:Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.


Jesus saved us from our sins by nailing the traditions of men,laws of men to the cross.


It is the laws of man that makes one disobey God?

And where do men’s commandments and teachings come from? From their own wresting of the Scriptures. The conclusion of the law is to love each other out of a pure heart.

1 Timothy 1: 5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:

But some have turned aside unto “vain jangling” desiring to be teachers of the law but not understanding what they are truly saying nor of what they are affirming.

6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

Many forget: the law is not made for the righteous but for the lawless. The law is spiritual and is to be used “lawfully” in its spiritual context as a means of rebuke, correction and instruction to those who are contrary to sound doctrine.

Those who observe the external ordinances of the Law and judging others with them are minding the flesh (glorying in the flesh). This is “contrary to sound doctrine”. It is a show of the flesh so that others can see how “righteous” they are. The flesh profits nothing. The flesh in their lack of knowledge puffs up in pride.

9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

Remember the Pharisee who stood up in the temple to pray. He was so self-assured in his fleshly works of “righteousness” and judged others (the publican) who obviously was deficient in such things. Who was the one who went home justified?

Luke 18:
10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

http://www.israelect.com/reference/ArnoldKennedy/'Born Again' or 'Begotten From Above'~.pdf - BORN AGAIN – OR “BORN FROM ABOVE”?

An examination from language to show that Jesus did not say, “Ye must be born again”. An examination of “Born-again-ism” with paragraphs on, “Whom did God beget”, “Abraham and Sarah -the origin” and what “formed from the womb” means.

I have been born again, just as I have been born from above by the Holy Spirit of the Most High God.

If you accept the words of man as truth, over the Holy Scriptures, then you are a believer of men, and not a believer of Jesus Christ.

Jesus Christ is the very Word of God, to deny him is to deny the Father.

You would do well to put away from you all man made literature, and read only the Word of God, not doubting, but by Faith.

If you want to know the Truth, then ask God, and not man. That is, if you truly believe that God will hear you, and show you that Truth.

 

[Hentenza]

Well give me your interpretation on why Jesus and the Apostles were ''gentiles'' while Paul was not?

None were gentiles.

the denomination was given to all nations who were not Romans.

The denomination is used throughout scripture to identify the uncircumcised. In the OT is used for Babylonians, Assyrians, Philistines, and others.

What is so hard to understand about that?

Understand what?

Why would you do things when the Jews say it is incorrect?Israel spoke Hebrew,didn't they? Modern Jews speak Yiddish.

The scriptures use specific language. Since the authors wrote the text, and since the text is inspired by the Holy Spirit, then the original language takes precedence over any person's opinion.

Are you going to continue to equate Jesus and the Apostles followed the Talmud,which was formed in Babylon?

Jesus and the apostles quote repeatedly from the LXX so we know that they used it. As to which Hebrew version they used, that is not revealed in scripture.

Are you going to continue to confuse the word Jew with Israel and Judaism?

Your problem is with the original language of scripture not with me. I will continue to use the biblical language over anyone else interpretation.

If you really do use Strong's you would know what Jew means....


Read this carefully....

Stephen S. Wise, deceased, and formerly Chief Rabbi of the United States stated, "The return from Babylon and the adoption of the Babylonian Talmud marked the end of Hebrewism and the beginning of Judaism. "

So Stephen S. Wise, Chief Rabbi of the US, is supperior in knowledge than the writers of scripture? Read the bible carefully and do not believe everything else you read elsewhere. The bible calls the apostles and Jesus Jews so I will continue to use the biblical term.

Tell me, was Jesus the King of the Jews or not?

I'm not sure you will have answers to this,we can go around again and again and I think you will only answer what suits you....

That's the thing. I posted the original language which is the same in the TR, the Majority text, and Wescott and Hort. Why do you doubt the scriptures?

 

[sleepingdog]

None were gentiles.



The denomination is used throughout scripture to identify the uncircumcised. In the OT is used for Babylonians, Assyrians, Philistines, and others.



Understand what?



The scriptures use specific language. Since the authors wrote the text, and since the text is inspired by the Holy Spirit, then the original language takes precedence over any person's opinion.




Jesus and the apostles quote repeatedly from the LXX so we know that they used it. As to which Hebrew version they used, that is not revealed in scripture.



Your problem is with the original language of scripture not with me. I will continue to use the biblical language over anyone else interpretation.




So Stephen S. Wise, Chief Rabbi of the US, is supperior in knowledge than the writers of scripture? Read the bible carefully and do not believe everything else you read elsewhere. The bible calls the apostles and Jesus Jews so I will continue to use the biblical term.

Tell me, was Jesus the King of the Jews or not?



That's the thing. I posted the original language which is the same in the TR, the Majority text, and Wescott and Hort. Why do you doubt the scriptures?

They would have been gentiles AS THEY WERE NOT ROMANS!

In civil affairs, the denomination was given to all nations who were not Romans.

Were Jesus and the Apostles Romans??????YES or NO?


I didn't say Israel didn't speak Hebrew,I just say modern Jews speak Yiddish.

If you are saying Jesus quoted from the Septuagint,alright,but that was not Judaism,''the tradition of the elders'' was the Talmud.

Matthew 15:2:Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

Judaism is not the religion of the Bible.

Rabbi Ben Zion Bokser wrote, "This is not an uncommon impression and one finds it sometimes among Jews as well as Christians - that Judaism is the religion of the Hebrew Bible. It is, of course, a fallacious impression. . . Judaism is not the religion of the Bible" (Judaism and the Christian Predicament, New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1967, p. 59).

If you say Judaism IS the religion Israel followed then you are saying that Israel followed something formed in Babylon?

King of the Jews?
If you really were using a Strong's Exhaustive Concordance you would actually see what ''Jews'' means in each case...

2453. Ioudaios ee-oo-dah'-yos from 2448 (in the sense of 2455 as a country); Judaean, i.e. belonging to Jehudah:--Jew(-ess), of Judaea.

Matthew 4:25:And there followed him great multitudes of people from Galilee, and from Decapolis, and from Jerusalem, and from Judaea, and from beyond Jordan.

Matthew 2:5:And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,

Mark 1:5:And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.



Jew is a slang term,there were many peoples living in Judea,Just like there are many people living in the USA.

King of the Judaeans

 

[Hentenza]

I'm done. I am not going to continue going in circles with you. Good night.

 

[riverrat]

Hentenza wrote:

I'm done. I am not going to continue going in circles with you. Good night.

lol, I gave up several days ago!

 

[sleepingdog]

I'm done. I am not going to continue going in circles with you. Good night.

You do Know your the one who is going around in circles?

But,hey at least you got out of answering ''Were Jesus and the Apostles Romans?''

 

[Unix]

The Bible is not invented by humans, it's divine. Thousans of years ago there were no brain-scientists, so how come pigs - specifically - are forbidden as food? Pigs are intelligent and thefore suffer much more than many other animals, when slaughtered for man-food.

I find religion to be VERY impractical to modern life. :/

There is no logic behind this rule. Modern pork is no worse - or better - for you than beef or chicken or anything else processed we eat.

Excellent reasoning, ptomwebster!

Do modern pigs have sweat glands? Did Christ's death on the cross give them sweat glands? Did Christ's death on the cross mean you don't need to have your children wash their hands before they eat? Take another look at the dietary laws and then think of the sanitation rules we have today. Not following God's dietary law is not a sin unto death but not following them might cause you to get sick. Remember they didn't have very good refrigerators back then.

My metabolism can't handle meat all that well. Men have long intestines, approximately 12-13 meters, and that is equally long to the intestines of animals that live on a fruit-diet. Fruit is the most healthy diet for men.

I'm almost vegetarian not at all because of religion, I got the idea while I was atheist and wasn't thinking of the Bible passages and I certainly didn't read them, when I started.