Is divorce sin

[Leanna]

I'm not sure that anyone is ever really without their own sin when a marriage ends. However, it's expected that none of us are perfect and are ever going to make the best decisions all of the time. My personal opinion is that in many cases, the "greater" burden of sin would fall on the one seeking divorce. However, it is also my personal opinion that that isn't neccessarily true in cases where there has been infidelity. Divorce is always a sin, no matter the reasons for it. However, I don't see anything that leads me to believe that God isn't understanding when one person is terribly wronged by another. He has some pretty strong words to speak concerning adulterous people.

I just think that there are many ways a person can be terribly wronged, and that adultery isn't the only way. I think I get turned off by the many people who say "Well, I've been divorced twice but my wives both cheated on me so its okay." It is still not okay. WHY did they cheat on you, and what did you do to love your wife? And yet on the other hand if the man is beating his wife we tell her "You are allowed to get counseling but not a divorce because the Bible says you can only get divorced if he cheats on you."

 

[oldrooster]

I just think that there are many ways a person can be terribly wronged, and that adultery isn't the only way. I think I get turned off by the many people who say "Well, I've been divorced twice but my wives both cheated on me so its okay." It is still not okay. WHY did they cheat on you, and what did you do to love your wife? And yet on the other hand if the man is beating his wife we tell her "You are allowed to get counseling but not a divorce because the Bible says you can only get divorced if he cheats on you."

Cheating is wrong period, I dont care what the other person did, adultery gets you a quick ticket out of my door. I could care less what your reasons were...

 

[johan777]

Cheating is wrong period, I dont care what the other person did, adultery gets you a quick ticket out of my door. I could care less what your reasons were...

It's the same with God, it doesn't matter what my excuses are. He has HIS "rules" of life.It is my choice if I want to adhere to it. It is not about sin. It is about what God did for me and how I respond to His grace and love

 

[Jenna]

if not sinning is the highest priority in life, then it must make for a very boring time - what with all the worrying about maintaining that holier than thou attitude that's indicitive of those who view all actions in terms of sinning and not sinning. divorce is a fact of life. when people get divorced, religious pretentions is usually the last thing on their minds.

No, "not sinning" is not the first priority of life, loving God is. Now, how are ways that we love God? I would say that one of them is definitely doing what He says is good, and abstaining from things that He says are sinful. I don't think that is a "holier than thou" attitude at all. Of course divorce happens, and it is a fact of life. It's because people don't do as God says. If they did, then there wouldn't be any call for it. So, instead of berrating people for trying to please God, it would be best to acknowledge that there are good reasons for the "rules" that God has given us.

 

[Jenna]

I just think that there are many ways a person can be terribly wronged, and that adultery isn't the only way. I think I get turned off by the many people who say "Well, I've been divorced twice but my wives both cheated on me so its okay." It is still not okay. WHY did they cheat on you, and what did you do to love your wife? And yet on the other hand if the man is beating his wife we tell her "You are allowed to get counseling but not a divorce because the Bible says you can only get divorced if he cheats on you."

Like I said earlier, I don't believe that anyone from an ended marriage is without fault. None of us do what is right all of the time, and treat each other like we should all the time. However, we are all responsible for our actions, even when we are encouraged or discouraged by a spouse. No matter how much a person neglects or whatever, it does not warrant adultery. Ultimately, the person who steps out is at fault for their behavior, even if the other spouse should have done more to heal the unhealthy relationship.

 

[johan777]

Oldrooster

The bible gives times that it is permissable, then it is not a sin. When you have a spouse cheat on you then we will talk. If you are not married at all, your opinion has little merit....

So, you have to have an experience to be qualified to offer your opinion? Maybe so in an earthly sense. Fortunately, people don't have to follow my advice, but we all should follow God's instructions. I cannot decide on the basis of my experience what is right or wrong.

Johan

 

[Leanna]

I was in no way trying to indicate that I think it is the other spouses's fault if the other one cheats. I was trying to point out that I have heard too many times Christians say "well, she cheated on you so you are OK to get a divorce." Why is that relationship so much farther beyond repair that one in which a husband is abusive? Why do we open the door and not consider that maybe the marriage is still worth saving?

Hey, I know all of you are just going to say "because the Bible says you can get divorced in adultery, but it doesn't say you can get divorced in an abusive relationship" and maybe that's the end all for you. But I don't understand why. Why should an abusive relationship be more mendable than one that went through adultery? And if it isn't about whether it has gone past the point of no return, what IS it about?

Its not just abusive relationships that I am thinking of. There are many marriages that just because the other hasn't cheated on them, they can't get a divorce according to the "infallible Bible" people. SO MANY WORSE situations.

 

[mghalpern]

Sounds like you might like to divorce based upon what every reason you see fit. I am one of those crazy "infallible Bible" people you refer to. Yes, I take it very seriously. You can get divorced for whatever reason you like, reason or no reason, the choice is yours. In this day and age, there isn't a court in America that will stop you. This isn't about our legal system, our feelings, what people think, it's about the heart of God as it lines up with His Word. I have said it before, we are so stuck on ourselves that we compromise so much of what God says, and wants for our lives. When our emotions are in a tailspin, it is no time to make healthy decisions. This could be caused by an affair, abuse, unhappiness, etc. When will be realize that God didn't promise us a rose garden and that everything that happens in our lives can be used for our good to glorify Christ. Most of the time, when we are confronted with painful and/or uncomfortable situations, God is using it as a way to shape our character. Remember: Character matters! I'm not suggesting that anyone has to remain in the same house with someone when their life is in danger. I'm not saying that God hasn't provided "a way out of our marriage" when infidelity occurs. What I am saying is check your heart and know that it is pure before our Heavenly Father, before you make a decision to leave/divorce a spouse.

 

[Leanna]

Sounds like you might like to divorce based upon what every reason you see fit. I am one of those crazy "infallible Bible" people you refer to. Yes, I take it very seriously. You can get divorced for whatever reason you like, reason or no reason, the choice is yours. In this day and age, there isn't a court in America that will stop you.

I don't want to get divorced. For God's sake man don't jump to conclusions, maybe do a little research and you would have a better understanding for my questions. Oh well.

Most of the time, when we are confronted with painful and/or uncomfortable situations, God is using it as a way to shape our character.
Remember: Character matters! I'm not suggesting that anyone has to remain in the same house with someone when their life is in danger.

But you are saying that they can't get divorced.

Are you for real? God is shaping a woman's character by allowing abuse? What kind of God do we serve?

What I am saying is check your heart and know that it is pure before our Heavenly Father, before you make a decision to leave/divorce a spouse.

So now we are allowed to use more than the Bible to make our decision? We also use our hearts and heads? What a novel idea.

Hey, I knew I would get attacked when I posted. But I think its worth it. I think Christian often stop thinking. They pull one obscure verse out of the Bible and that's that. I think the Bible is brilliant and we should live by it. I think when in doubt err on the side of caution. DEFINITELY! All the time I see these posts asking about divorce and I see the responses time and time again "well, he did cheat, so you can" without further consideration for whether that marriage is worth saving or giving it a try. Then there are these posts "my husband sexually abused my daughter for 10 years and I just found out" and we tell them that under no condition are they permitted a divorce. Maybe that man can get counseling and things can really change, and he can reach God, IF SO PRAISE GOD. But maybe not. We need to use our heads and not only the Bible. I have serious doubts about all subjects in the Bible that are only mentioned in one verse, but that is a discussion for another area of the forum.

 

[bkg]

Hey, I knew I would get attacked when I posted. But I think its worth it. I think Christian often stop thinking. They pull one obscure verse out of the Bible and that's that. I think the Bible is brilliant and we should live by it. I think when in doubt err on the side of caution. DEFINITELY! All the time I see these posts asking about divorce and I see the responses time and time again "well, he did cheat, so you can" without further consideration for whether that marriage is worth saving or giving it a try. Then there are these posts "my husband sexually abused my daughter for 10 years and I just found out" and we tell them that under no condition are they permitted a divorce. Maybe that man can get counseling and things can really change, and he can reach God, IF SO PRAISE GOD. But maybe not. We need to use our heads and not only the Bible. I have serious doubts about all subjects in the Bible that are only mentioned in one verse, but that is a discussion for another area of the forum.

I think you have great points on emotional topics. But I have to side with Michael on this one. It's like the abortion issue - emotionally charged. And we as humans cannot understand God's reasons, but we have to either accept the Bible as a whole or reject it as a whole. I don't think that Christ ever gave anyone the lee-way to say "I'll take this w/ a side of that and hold the other thing"...

Divorce is emotional - for both sides. And you will always be able to find an "exception" or emotional issue that will cause everyone to say "hmmm... maybe you have a point". But is that what it's all about? NO! It's about Glorifying God - not finding "happiness".

Separation may be an option for those abusive situations, but I just haven't seen anything that indicates that Christ gave a list of reasons one can get a divorce. Never.

Regardless of the side we are on, it's a great discussion.

 

[mghalpern]

I don't want to get divorced. For God's sake man don't jump to conclusions, maybe do a little research and you would have a better understanding for my questions. Oh well.

But you are saying that they can't get divorced.



Are you for real? God is shaping a woman's character by allowing abuse? What kind of God do we serve?



So now we are allowed to use more than the Bible to make our decision? We also use our hearts and heads? What a novel idea.



Hey, I knew I would get attacked when I posted. But I think its worth it. I think Christian often stop thinking. They pull one obscure verse out of the Bible and that's that. I think the Bible is brilliant and we should live by it. I think when in doubt err on the side of caution. DEFINITELY! All the time I see these posts asking about divorce and I see the responses time and time again "well, he did cheat, so you can" without further consideration for whether that marriage is worth saving or giving it a try. Then there are these posts "my husband sexually abused my daughter for 10 years and I just found out" and we tell them that under no condition are they permitted a divorce. Maybe that man can get counseling and things can really change, and he can reach God, IF SO PRAISE GOD. But maybe not. We need to use our heads and not only the Bible. I have serious doubts about all subjects in the Bible that are only mentioned in one verse, but that is a discussion for another area of the forum.

When is said “you” I meant “a person,” “anybody,” not you personally. Sorry. I’m not sure what you are referring to when you suggest I should do a little research to better understand your questions. I didn’t realize you were asking anything. I thought that you were making statements. Again, I wasn’t speaking directly to you, but speaking in general about your comments.



I didn’t state, nor did I imply in any way that God uses abuse to shape anyone’s character. He (God) didn’t send the abuser or force the abuse, but he will use any and all situations in our lives to shape us. He didn’t send airplanes crashing into the WTCs either, yet people were faced with choices on how they responded and He uses both good and bad occurrences in our lives to make us more into His image everyday; if we’ll allow Him.



When I referred to “checking your heart,” I wasn’t speaking about emotions or thoughts. I am saying that our spirit ought to line up with the Holy Spirit if we are to make Godly/Biblical decisions.



I haven’t stopped thinking about anything. I am a consummate thinker. I am also not pulling “one obscure Bible verse” out of context to make any of my points. Like bkg said, you can’t pick and choose what portions of the Bible you would like to live by. You either take it in its entirety, or forget the whole thing. God said it or He didn’t. Can’t have it both ways because we want to fit it into our thinking. I’m afraid to quote Jeremiah 29:11 for the fear of referencing an obscure Bible verse to support MY position, and be thought of as someone who can’t think for himself.



Oh well…here goes anyway…Isaiah 55:8-9 "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD. "As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.

 

[johan777]

How does God look on Adultery?
Adultery is serious stuff. It is very sobering to see how seriously God sees adultery, having sexual relations with another person's spouse:

Gen. 20:3 "But God came to Abimelech in a dream one night and said to him, 'You are as good as dead because of the woman you have taken; she is a married woman.' ​

In our day adultery is looked on by most as cheating, not sin, perhaps grounds for divorce, but not criminal.



However,God sees it as a sin punishable by death (Gen.20:3) and a sin against God himself (Gen. 20:6).

On the other hand, does God forgive an adulterer, the sinning party. Oh, YES.

Heb 10:12,14 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, (ALL sins) "he sat down at the right hand of God." (That happened more than 2000 years ago) For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

To the women that was caught in adultery Jesus said:
"I don't condemn you either. Go home, and from now on do not sin any more." (John 8:11)

To make matters worse. Jesus also said" Mat 5:27,28 "You have heard that it was said, 'You must not commit adultery.' But I say to you, anyone who stares at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

My point? We are all guilty, but God, in Jesus forgave us. Should we not also forgive the adulterous spouse? Jesus also said" Mat 6:14,15 For if you forgive people their offenses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive people their offenses, your Father will not forgive your offenses."

Offended brother and sister, FORGIVE and don't divorce your spouse!

 

[oldrooster]

How does God look on Adultery?
Adultery is serious stuff. It is very sobering to see how seriously God sees adultery, having sexual relations with another person's spouse:

Gen. 20:3 "But God came to Abimelech in a dream one night and said to him, 'You are as good as dead because of the woman you have taken; she is a married woman.' ​

In our day adultery is looked on by most as cheating, not sin, perhaps grounds for divorce, but not criminal.



However,God sees it as a sin punishable by death (Gen.20:3) and a sin against God himself (Gen. 20:6).

On the other hand, does God forgive an adulterer, the sinning party. Oh, YES.

Heb 10:12,14 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, (ALL sins) "he sat down at the right hand of God." (That happened more than 2000 years ago) For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

To the women that was caught in adultery Jesus said:
"I don't condemn you either. Go home, and from now on do not sin any more." (John 8:11)

To make matters worse. Jesus also said" Mat 5:27,28 "You have heard that it was said, 'You must not commit adultery.' But I say to you, anyone who stares at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

My point? We are all guilty, but God, in Jesus forgave us. Should we not also forgive the adulterous spouse? Jesus also said" Mat 6:14,15 For if you forgive people their offenses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive people their offenses, your Father will not forgive your offenses."

Offended brother and sister, FORGIVE and don't divorce your spouse!

Have you ever had a spouse that cheated on you ?

 

[johan777]

Have you ever had a spouse that cheated on you ?

That question is not relevant. What is , is what God has to say on the subject.

 

[mghalpern]

That question is not relevant. What is , is what God has to say on the subject.

I agree johan777. Not to sound cold hearted, but the last question asked of you proves that people most often respond this crisis in their lives emotionally (I speak from experience), not spiritually. I too am guilty of emotional responses or I wouldn't be separated from my wife at this time, so I know the negative repercussions of emotional responses. When a pilot is flying at 35000 feet through dark clouds s/he is completely disoriented. If s/he relies on her/his "feelings" s/he will only end up with crashing the plane and everyone will die. This is why a pilot has to completely rely upon the instruments to fly safely and get everyone to their destination. Likewise, we have instruments (the Word of God and His Holy Spirit) that we must follow if we are to reach our destination safely. We cannot, nor were we designed to do this in our own strength. When we are weak, He is strong. If we are not pouring over His Word, spending quality time in prayer and fellowship with other believers, and diligently seeking to glorify our Heavenly Father, we will not accomplish God's will for our life...we will continue to let our emotions drive/guide us instead of being Spirit driven/guided...Michael

 

[daisypromise]

Hi
I am new here so forgive me if it is inappropriate to post on this topic.
I am divorced.
I trusted God for the healing of my marriage for a very long time - mostly on the basis of God's word about love rather than on marriage scriptures. I now do not know now where my ex is neither does he know where I am.
If adultery, as it was in the past, was punishable by death then divorce and remarriage would never have been an issue. The other spouse would have been widowed rather than divorce. It is therefore more difficult to apply scripture from the OT about divorce to adultery. Divorce in OT times surely would have taken place for different reasons. IMHO the OT gives no reasons for divorce as acceptable. In the NT punishment by death comes to an end - Jesus pays our penalty and frees the woman caught in the act of adultery from stoning.
This leaves us now with the issue of is divorce acceptable due to adultery and then, is remarriage acceptable. Personally, I think the bible says divorce is allowable when adultery is involved (it does not make it the best course of action though - the greatest way is love). I also think it is acceptable when a non-believer chooses to leave the believer. Whether or not re-marriage is OK I am not so sure.
I would never know if my ex died either.
These situations are very painful and take a long time to come through. I would advise people (no one specific here)not to make any major choices until the emotions are more settled.
Am I standing for the healing of my marriage now? To be honest, no. I know God can do anything and have yet to know what the final outcome will be.

love Sara xx

 

[johan777]

Hi Sara

Welcome to CF and I am glad that you found your way to post here.

I think the bible says divorce is allowable when adultery is involved (it does not make it the best course of action though - the greatest way is love). I also think it is acceptable when a non-believer chooses to leave the believer. Whether or not re-marriage is OK I am not so sure.
I would never know if my ex died either.
These situations are very painful and take a long time to come through. I would advise people (no one specific here)not to make any major choices until the emotions are more settled.
Am I standing for the healing of my marriage now? To be honest, no. I know God can do anything and have yet to know what the final outcome will be.

I hear your heart and I know that now one other than the one going through divorce will know the pain, hurt, loneliness, etc. Also, you can do everything possible, but if the other party does not respond, there is nothing you can do.

Fortunately, there is no sin "too big" for God to forgive. Everyone whose sin has been forgiven, no matter what can still approach God's throne with confidence. Heb 10:19 - 23 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holy place by the blood of Jesus, by the way which he dedicated for us, a new and living way, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; 0:21 and having a great priest over the house of God; let us draw near with a true heart in fulness of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience: and having our body washed with pure water, let us hold fast the confession of our hope that it waver not; for he is faithful that promised.

Johan

 

[Desert Fox]

Divorce is clearly a sin in all cases. It does not match up with what God wants for our lives.

 

[Mayzoo]

I have just read this thread today in its entirety. I have only one comment to add...and this one comment is in regard to Leanna's comment:

"Why should an abusive relationship be more mendable than one that went through adultery?"



I think her point may have gotten lost in the vastness of both the volume and emotions in this thread. IMHO ALL marriages are equally deserving of being saved no matter the transgression; however, not all slighted spouses can continue in their marriages. That does not mean they have not forgiven....I think it means they cannot open themselves up to be so deeply hurt again.



God commands that we forgive our transgressors; however, he does not command we forget, nor does he command that we make ourselves susceptible to the same offense (in general) again and again.

 

[bkg]

God commands that we forgive our transgressors; however, he does not command we forget, nor does he command that we make ourselves susceptible to the same offense (in general) again and again.

That one I might take issue with.

Jesus told Peter to forgive 7x70 times (arguably, per day). The inference there is that we should forgive and put that incident behind us (wipe it clean, perhaps) and then open ourselves up to that person again. If that wasn't the case, there would be no reason to forgive more than 1, 2 or the 3 times that many people set their limits at.

This is especially true in a marriage realationsihp, I think. And while I'm not condoning abuse or infidelity, by any stretch of the word, I think there is something bigger at stake here - God's words.

however, not all slighted spouses can continue in their marriages. That does not mean they have not forgiven....I think it means they cannot open themselves up to be so deeply hurt again.

Two very important things here - The first is a question, why is it that "not all slighted spouses can continue in their marriage"? That's an incorrect statement. The truth isn't about what they "can" or "cannot" due, because ALL is possible with God. The issue is what they "want" to do. And flesh wants rarely line up with the word of God.

Secondly, if a person cannot open themselves up again - that implies in ALL relationships, which we also know is not true.

If a person cannot open themselves back up to their spouse, I would argue that true forgiveness has not happened.
bkg