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Incense

Do you use incense in prayer and worship?

  • No! Incense is of SATAN!!!!!!

  • No, it is uncessary and therefore I don't use it

  • No, though I should

  • Yes, I use stick incense

  • Yes, I use cone incense

  • Yes, I use granulated incense

  • What is this... "incense" you speak of?

  • Christians use incense?

  • Other, and I'll bother to explain


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MKJ

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I said other, because I don't use it at home, but we do at my church. I was not sure which the poll meant. I think they use the crumbly kind.

I like it, and the main reason I don't use it at home is because I have two young kids who are not trustworthy with fire-making implements in the house.

Sometimes I buy stick incense from India, but I don't use it for prayer as it was made by Hindus and that seems odd. I just use it to cover up dog emanations.:o

Is it important for worship? Well, I think engaging the senses is important if possible. I read an article today saying that the scent used in a store can increase sales by 50%. Scent powerfully evokes memory. Smelling church incense always puts me in a very particular frame of mind that I associate with worship.
 
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Mary of Bethany

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Well, I just got some stick incense from www.desertfathersincense.com since as nice as the cheapo stuff I've been- wait. That's it, it ISN'T good at all. :p

Quality will be nice.

Sent from my iPod touch using Forum Runner

I use her stick incense also. I like it a lot.

Mary
 
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Philothei

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I do.
Myrrh_incense.jpg
jasmine_incense.jpg


Forgive me...


I like the rose and the "cypress tree" one but can go for anything really :) :thumbsup::liturgy::liturgy::liturgy::liturgy: And thanks for reminding me I will cense to day as I will not go for the supplication service :)

:angel::angel::angel::angel:
 
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simonthezealot

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OrthodoxyUSA

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Set down the incense and walk away slowly... John Chrysostom explains: "You must worship 'in truth'; as former things were types, such as circumcision, and whole burnt offerings, and victims, and incense, they now no longer exist, but all is 'truth.'" (John Chrysostom, Homily 33 on the Gospel of John, at John 4:24)

And yet his liturgical rubrics call for the use of incense.

Hmmm...

Forgive me...
 
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simonthezealot

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Maybe you'll listen to Arnobius? Unlikely though.

Arnobius (flourished about A.D. 284-305) tells us:
Having shown briefly how impious and infamous are the opinions which you have formed about your gods, we have now to speak of their temples, their images also, and sacrifices, and of the other things which are nailed and closely related to them. For you are here in the habit of fastening upon us a very serious charge of impiety because we do not rear temples for the ceremonies of worship, do not set up statues and images of any god, do not build altars, do not offer the blood of creatures slain in sacrifices, incense, nor sacrificial meal, and finally, do not bring wine flowing in libations from sacred bowls; which, indeed, we neglect to build and do, not as though we cherish impious and wicked dispositions, or have conceived any madly desperate feeling of contempt for the gods, but because we think and believe that they — if only they are true gods, and are called by this exalted name — either scorn such honours, if they give way to scorn, or endure them with anger, if they are roused by feelings of rage.​
- Arnobius, Against the Heathen, Book 6, Section 1
 
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simonthezealot

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Here you can see Chrysostom shows prayer replacing incense, iow the acknowledgment that incense was a type...

The psalmist therefore asks for his prayer to become like that sacrifice defiled by no blemish of the offerer, like that pure and holy incense. Now, by his asking he also teaches us to offer prayers that are pure and fragrant. Hence he is also the one who touched on the stench of prayer in saying, "Because my iniquities rose up over my head, they weighed me down like a heavy load. My wounds were putrid and foul-smelling." As, then, the incense even of itself is fine and sweet-smelling, but gives particular evidence of its fragrance at the time when it is mixed with the fire, so too is prayer fine of itself but becomes finer and more sweet-smelling when offered with ardor and a glowing spirit, when the soul becomes a censer and lights a burning fire. I mean, the incense would not be added unless the brazier had previously been lit, or the coals set alight. Do likewise in the case of your own mind: first light it with enthusiasm, and then offer your prayer.​
- John Chrysostom, Commentary on the Psalms, at Psalm 141:2
 
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simonthezealot

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Again prayer has replaced incense...(Spirit and truth)

We see it in John Cassian (lived about A.D. 360 – 435):
Wherefore we ought to pray often but briefly, lest if we are long about it our crafty foe may succeed in implanting something in our heart. For that is the true sacrifice, as "the sacrifice of God is a broken spirit." This is the salutary offering, these are pure drink offerings, that is the "sacrifice of righteousness," the "sacrifice of praise," these are true and fat victims, "holocausts full of marrow," which are offered by contrite and humble hearts, and which those who practise this control and fervour of spirit, of which we have spoken, with effectual power can sing: "Let my prayer be set forth in Your sight as the incense: let the lifting up of my hands be an evening sacrifice."
 
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Incariol

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Feel free to share where Chrysostom authors the call for incense.

*humming pleasantly*

" While the Alleluia is being chanted, the deacon, taking the censer and incense, approaches the priest, and taking a blessing from him, censeth the Holy Table round about, and the whole altar, and the priest ( but, some cense during the epistle reading ) And the priest saith this prayer:
"

" The deacon having put away the censer in the usual place, receiveth the Gospel from the priest, and goeth out through the holy doors, a candle preceeding him, and goeth forth and standeth on the ambo, or on the appointed place.
Deacon: Bless, master, the bringer of the good tidings of the Holy, Apostle and Evangelist N.
"

" The deacon, taking the censer and placing incense therein, approacheth the priest, (in current practice, he censeth while the priest is saying the secret prayer, or the priest, if he serve alone, censeth immediately after the secret prayer) and taking a blessing from him, censeth round about the whole table, and the whole altar, and the whole altar and the priest, and he sayeth the 50th Psalm and the troparia of compunction, and whatsoever he may wish, together with the priest.

And the priest goeth to the table of oblation, the deacon preceding, and the deacon or priest censeth the holy things, praying secretly:
Deacon: O God cleanse me, a sinner. Thrice

Deacon: Lift up, Master.
"


" Then taking the holy diskos, he placeth it upon the deacon's head, with all attentiveness and reverence, the deacon also having the censer in one of his fingers. The priest himself, taketh the holy chalice in his hands and they come out by the North door, the candle-bearers going before them, and they make the circuit of the temple while praying:
The Great Entrance
Deacon: The Orthodox episcopate of the Russian Church; our lord the Very Most Reverend N., Metropolitan of Eastern America and New York, the First Hierarch of the Russian Church Abroad; and our lord the Most Reverend Bishop N., may the Lord God remember in His kingdom, always, now and ever, and unto the ages of ages.
"

" Then taking the veils from the holy diskos and the holy chalice, he layeth them to one side of the altar (in current practice, each is unfolded, and placed on the right and left side of the holy table, over the red cloth and under the cross on each side.) And taking the aer from the deacon's shoulder, and having censed it, he covereth the Holy Gifts therewith, saying:
Priest: The noble Joseph, having taken Thy most pure Body down from the Tree and wrapped It in pure linen and covered It with spices, laid It in a new tomb.
"

" And having returned the censer, and having lowered his phelonion, and having bowed his head, he saith to the Deacon:
Priest: Remember me, brother and concelebrant.
And the deacon saith to him:
Deacon: May the Lord God remember thy priesthood in His Kingdom.
"

" And taking the censer, the priest censeth thrice before the Holy Table and exclaimeth:
Priest: Especially for our most holy, most pure, most blessed, glorious Lady Theotokos and Ever-Virgin Mary:
"


" Then the deacon censeth the Holy Table round about, and remembereth whomsoever he will, both of the living and of the dead.
Priest: Again we pray Thee; Remember, O Lord, all the Orthodox episcopate that rightly divide the word of Thy truth, all the priesthood, the diaconate in Christ, and every sacred rank. Again we offer unto Thee this rational service for the whole world; for the Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church; for them that abide in purity and an honorable life; for the much suffering Orthodox Russian people; for this land, its rulers and armed forces. Grant them, O Lord, peaceful governance, that in their calm we, also, may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
"

" And the priest turneth back to the Holy Table, and censeth it thrice, saying secretly:
Priest: Be thou exalted, O God, above the heavens, and Thy glory above all the earth.
"

" And he goeth to the holy table of oblation and placeth thereon the Holy Things. And as he goeth, the deacon censeth the Holy Things, and then giveth the priest the censer, who censeth the Holy Things thrice.
And the deacon, having uncrossed his orarion and placed it upon his right shoulder, goeth out by the North door, and standing in the usual place saith:

The Litany of Thanksgiving
Deacon: Aright! Having partaken of the divine, holy, most pure, immortal, heavenly, life-creating, fearful Mysteries of Christ, let us duly give thanks unto the Lord.
"

St. John Chrysostom seems to have rather liked incense.
 
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brinny

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Again prayer has replaced incense...(Spirit and truth)

We see it in John Cassian (lived about A.D. 360 – 435):
Wherefore we ought to pray often but briefly, lest if we are long about it our crafty foe may succeed in implanting something in our heart. For that is the true sacrifice, as "the sacrifice of God is a broken spirit." This is the salutary offering, these are pure drink offerings, that is the "sacrifice of righteousness," the "sacrifice of praise," these are true and fat victims, "holocausts full of marrow," which are offered by contrite and humble hearts, and which those who practise this control and fervour of spirit, of which we have spoken, with effectual power can sing: "Let my prayer be set forth in Your sight as the incense: let the lifting up of my hands be an evening sacrifice."

Amen.
 
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Kristos

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Didn't we go through this already. SJC is talking about worshiping in spirit and truth, which is participation in the heavenly worship, which according to scripture includes incense. There isn't any middle ground - it's right there in black and white. Maybe a better question would be when and why did protestant deem it necessary to STOP using incense in contradiction to the scriptures.
 
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brinny

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Didn't we go through this already. SJC is talking about worshiping in spirit and truth, which is participation in the heavenly worship, which according to scripture includes incense. There isn't any middle ground - it's right there in black and white. Maybe a better question would be when and why did protestant deem it necessary to STOP using incense in contradiction to the scriptures.

i believe he is saying that our fervent, whole-hearted prayers ARE incense to God.
 
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Incariol

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i believe he is saying that our fervent, whole-hearted prayers ARE incense to God.

Is anyone disagreeing? :confused:
Does that preclude the use of incense in Christian devotions? :confused:

I think not.

And Kristos is right, the Apocalypse mentions incense repeatedly.
 
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brinny

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Is anyone disagreeing? :confused:
Does that preclude the use of incense in Christian devotions? :confused:

I think not.

And Kristos is right, the Apocalypse mentions incense repeatedly.

certainly not. There are times i use candles.....not incense yet because i don't like the smell of it and it's associated with covering up the smell of marijuana where i live :sorry:
 
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