Illegal Immigration

[Meshavrischika]

Im against Illegal Immigration to.

What i hate is when the Pro-Illegal Immigration forces always pull the race card on a Anti-Illegal Immigration person. I have heard many times Anti-Illegal Immigration person being called Racist.

IT DOES NOT HAVE TO DO WITH RACE.

I dont care if the Illegal Alien is Black,White,Asian, Hispanic, or Indian. It does not matter. I will treat them the same.

The Illegal Aliens are a drain to the economy. They cause the Tax payers (which im not one since im not old enough) to pay more taxes. I heard by 2050 there will be a 60 MILLION INCREASE IN POPULATION in California. And i heard one of the reason is Illegal Immigration.

"Next thing im going to say has to do with Race and may sound Racist but its not"

Its a given fact that Hispanics have more babies then other Races. So when an Illegal Alien comes to America many of the times they have kids. The sites i was reading which was talking about this said that the main race that is going to populate the fastest in California are Hispanics. And each site i read about this said something about Caucasians being the minority race in California and Hispanics being the majority Race in California by 2050.

So Illegal Immigration is a drain to the economy because since they cause the Population to increase at a faster rate then usual. This will cause us to have to build bigger cities which has to be paid by the money of the Tax Payers US Citizens. Now in the later part of the 19th Century we had a lot of Immigrants coming over here. Most were LEGAL IMMIGRANTS. Because of this a lot of them were living in slums so America had to expand there cities. Now Legal Immigration has dwindled but now we also have to deal with Illegal Immigration. Illegal Immigration is unfair. Im for Legal Immigration and what Illegals are doing are cutting in line of the Legal Immigrants who are obeying the laws. Illegal Aliens bring Poverty to America.

Now an argument of Pro-Illegal Immigration is that the Illegal Aliens have families and are just trying to support them. That may be true but that is not excuse to break the law. They are leeching off of our Health Care to

Example: By saying its ok for a person to break the law because they have families to support is NOT rational thinking. By saying this we should not lock up Drug dealers who are selling Illegal Drugs to get money for there family. Or maybe we should not punish a poor man stealing from a store because he had a family to feed. A Law is a law. Laws are meant to be Enforced. Illegals also try to avoid government Authorities (like cops and Border Patrol agents). Another sign that they know they are breaking the law and that they are criminals. A criminal who has a family should be treated the same as other criminals who don't have a family. The Illegals and there supporters are using Emotion as a tool for there side.

Oh, to be 16 and know everything again.

IDK. That's the most intelligent thing I've heard from a 16 year old in years. I agree with him.

 

[The Nihilist]

IDK. That's the most intelligent thing I've heard from a 16 year old in years. I agree with him.

Really? Because he said that because hispanics have too many babies, the population will grow too fast and drain the economy. This is ludicrous, and represents what is at best an inadequate understanding of population and economic growth. Mormons have lots of kids, and they've managed to have not destroyed Utah yet. But then, I guess they're all white and speak English.

 

[stan1980]

Really? Because he said that because hispanics have too many babies, the population will grow too fast and drain the economy. This is ludicrous, and represents what is at best an inadequate understanding of population and economic growth. Mormons have lots of kids, and they've managed to have not destroyed Utah yet. But then, I guess they're all white and speak English.

Agreed!

 

[Meshavrischika]

Really? Because he said that because hispanics have too many babies, the population will grow too fast and drain the economy. This is ludicrous, and represents what is at best an inadequate understanding of population and economic growth. Mormons have lots of kids, and they've managed to have not destroyed Utah yet. But then, I guess they're all white and speak English.

eh. I'm pretty much in opposition to the major religious choices that certain groups make that promote these behaviors. I don't think the drain is ludicrous. whether they be white or black or purple or green it doesn't matter. you want so much to make it about race, and not so much to make it about the issue.

 

[stan1980]

The fact is your country was built on immigrants. My own country's economy would collapse if immigrants were removed. Population growth does NOT mean a drain on the economy.

 

[Meshavrischika]

The fact is your country was built on immigrants. My own country's economy would collapse if immigrants were removed. Population growth does NOT mean a drain on the economy.

immigrants breaking no law. there is now a law in place. come here legally and IMO you're welcome.

population growth from an undocumented source that does not pay taxes is a drain. sorry. I worked in a hospital. I SAW the drain. everyone gripes about cost of healthcare... well... that's one MAJOR reason. Then the STATE pays the hospitals SOME of the money.

 

[stan1980]

immigrants breaking no law. there is now a law in place. come here legally and IMO you're welcome.

population growth from an undocumented source that does not pay taxes is a drain. sorry. I worked in a hospital. I SAW the drain. everyone gripes about cost of healthcare... well... that's one MAJOR reason. Then the STATE pays the hospitals SOME of the money.

That's why there is a case for relaxing immigration laws, so that there are less illegal immigrants and they aren't a drain on the economy. As you can guess, i'm not a major fan of maintaining the status quo which tight immigration laws attempts to achieve.

In the UK, we have recently had large numbers of eastern european migrants enter our country and despite what is sometimes said, it hasn't been a drain on our economy as far as i can tell. They are in fact doing the jobs that a lot of British nationals aren't prepared to do.

 

[Meshavrischika]

That's why there is a case for relaxing immigration laws, so that there are less illegal immigrants and they aren't a drain on the economy. As you can guess, i'm not a major fan of maintaining the status quo which tight immigration laws attempts to achieve.

In the UK, we have recently had large numbers of eastern european migrants enter our country and despite what is sometimes said, it hasn't been a drain on our economy as far as i can tell. They are in fact doing the jobs that a lot of British nationals aren't prepared to do.

unskilled workers don't always necessarily improve a country. Sure. Let's get a balance in... but that's not who's mostly interseted in coming. It's not about status quo... It's about not allowing this place to KEEP turning into a nanny state where the few take care of the many. It's out of hand already.

again that they're taking jobs no one wants thing. i've already stated that's just not true in many cases

 

[stan1980]

unskilled workers don't always necessarily improve a country. Sure. Let's get a balance in... but that's not who's mostly interseted in coming. It's not about status quo... It's about not allowing this place to KEEP turning into a nanny state where the few take care of the many. It's out of hand already.

again that they're taking jobs no one wants thing. i've already stated that's just not true in many cases

Well i can't speak for your country, but over here, immigrant workers and British nationals generally aren't competing for the same jobs. Of course there are exceptions, but the skills and education levels of immigrants are different to those born in the UK. I'm thinking that is true of the US too.

After all the years of immigration in the US, you would be hard pressed to prove that immigration isn't a positive thing. Or do you think there is some magic point where the door should be closed? If so, when?

Incidentally, i think you have the wrong end of the stick regarding your definition of "nanny state".

 

[Meshavrischika]

Well i can't speak for your country, but over here, immigrant workers and British nationals generally aren't competing for the same jobs. Of course there are exceptions, but the skills and education levels of immigrants are different to those born in the UK. I'm thinking that is true of the US too.

After all the years of immigration in the US, you would be hard pressed to prove that immigration isn't a positive thing. Or do you think there is some magic point where the door should be closed? If so, when?

Incidentally, i think you have the wrong end of the stick regarding your definition of "nanny state".

wrong end of the stick? (sinus infection... very fuzzy)

 

[stan1980]

wrong end of the stick? (sinus infection... very fuzzy)

Sorry, it must be an English term. It means a misunderstanding.

 

[Meshavrischika]

just a different idea of what is and what is not okay interference from the fed govt.

it's not okay to rob me blind to pay for those who come here to milk the system, and don't contribute

it's barely okay to try to pass some laws to protect my interests

personally i think the federal govt should have a budget like a public library and all the power should go to the states.

 

[Futuwwa]

As for the drain on the welfare system, there is a very simple solution to it: Require anyone who tries to get welfare of any sort to prove their identity! In Finland you have to do it even for the smallest medical operation.

 

[Meshavrischika]

As for the drain on the welfare system, there is a very simple solution to it: Require anyone who tries to get welfare of any sort to prove their identity! In Finland you have to do it even for the smallest medical operation.

here you're called a racist if you suggest that or you're "denying the children" and other such drivel

 

[stan1980]

just a different idea of what is and what is not okay interference from the fed govt.

it's not okay to rob me blind to pay for those who come here to milk the system, and don't contribute

it's barely okay to try to pass some laws to protect my interests

personally i think the federal govt should have a budget like a public library and all the power should go to the states.

Okay, but you said you wanted to keep your country from becoming a nanny state. In the context of this thread, that would imply that you wouldn't want your government putting limitations on immigration.

Back to the issue, do immigrants contribute more than they cost? I think your country is living proof that that they do.

 

[Meshavrischika]

Okay, but you said you wanted to keep your country from becoming a nanny state. In the context of this thread, that would imply that you wouldn't want your government putting limitations on immigration.

Back to the issue, do immigrants contribute more than they cost? I think your country is living proof that that they do.

I want the state to be able to. Not the feds. Each state to his own. I dont' consider blocking illegal immigration as a "nanny function" but a security function anyway.

Eh. I'd disagree. But then I live in a state where there are millions of them, so maybe my view is colored.

 

[Maxwell511]

Well i can't speak for your country, but over here, immigrant workers and British nationals generally aren't competing for the same jobs. Of course there are exceptions, but the skills and education levels of immigrants are different to those born in the UK. I'm thinking that is true of the US too.

Most of the Polish here that I talk to are college educated. That just don't seem to mind serving people coffee and the like.

 

[Verv]

Everyone desires a better life and I cannot criticize people who pursue that. Who wouldn't?

However, doing it through such a means that is illegal can be rough.

I have, however, met Mexicans who immigrated entirely legally. They said it took them roughly 5 years of waiting for their applications to go through. I would imagine it is similar for a lot of people but this was pre-9/11.

The opportunities offered in 1st world nations are so great that who would not want tog o there? Even living as an illegal you have so many more basic rights and a higher standard of living.

I think the American system is broken for immigration but in the end, people cannot justify violating the sovereign laws of a nation.

 

[stan1980]

Does anyone else think there is racial connotations in suggesting immigrants are a drain on the economy? I've never seen it proven that immigration costs a country more than it gains. Sure, some immigrants will try and bleed the system dry, just like many of your own citizens will, but i think in general you'll find immigrants are hard working and an asset to a country, just like most citizens of your own country are.

To suggest that Hispanics, Blacks, Asians, Whites or whatever will be or are a drain on the economy smacks of racism to me.

 

[Maxwell511]

Does anyone else think there is racial connotations in suggesting immigrants are a drain on the economy?

If you an immigrant you cannot do anything right. You're either a drain on the economy or are stealing jobs.