if you think about telling a lie..

[forGod1]

is it the same as saying it?

 

[Autumnleaf]

no.

 

[Max Shade]

no.

Agreed, making a decision is entirely different than considering all possibilities.

 

[saved24]

.....as long as you don't want to lie, and you may want to tell the Lord sorry for even considering it, I would. God bless.

 

[Forealzchola]

Nope. it might be temptation....but if it is not executed it is not a sin and surely not the same. People debate sinning all the time...the battle is standing strong and choosing not to execute or do it ( the act of committing sin)

 

[football5680]

No. We can't control what we think about but we can control what we say and what we do.

 

[Quasicentennial]

If you are protesting for a pay rate increase in your job then being dishonest in your job, or even making mistakes or forgetting something like missing an important customer then protesting is like a nice compliment of everything that you are not supposed to do wrong more than once in your job:.
For example, I am a part-time casual walker that delivers two different real estate leaflets, about 1000 each to 2000 houses every two weeks and the pay rate is only $5 dollars per 100 so 1000 x $5 = 50 dollars and when I deliver both leaflets to letterboxes in any neighboring suburb that's 100 dollars, only problem is it takes 10 hours to deliver 1000 leaflets ie. 100 houses per hour:.
That's like getting paid $5 dollars an hour and I want $10 dollars per 100 so I can get $200:.
So far, not getting much luck as I have been a walker for 4 years now so whenever it rains most of the day,or two days in a row, I don't bother to deliver all the leaflets, say in one week only half is delivered and in another week none is delivered and I always mobile phone text message my boss that "all leaflets have been delivered" -
and I get away with it simply because of my Google Map experience to know every street using my 7 inch tablet as I carry it with me together with my car, and where every letterbox, apart from NO JUNKMAIL ones, all leaflets are properly delivered on fine weather days .;'*';.

 

[thatforumguy77]

Thou shalt not think of a lie. Nope, doesn't sound right.

I think the warning about sins being committed while still in our thoughts were more or less limited only to lust and adultery. But in principle, we must understand that this warning is to preserve our spiritual purity. If the thought of lying has invaded your every waking thought and tempts you constantly with the thought of lying... well then, that is different than simply thinking a lie unintentionally.

When in doubt: always consult the list of the fruits of the Spirit (and the sins of the flesh). If you practice these good fruits, then you are safe. For in those, there is no law. That said, self-control is a fruit of the Spirit.

 

[writtenword]

It is not a sin to wrestle with temptation.

 

[DiscipleHeLovesToo]

is it the same as saying it?

Mat 5:27-28 KJV
(27) Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
(28) But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.


if you think about having sexual relations with another man's wife enough to begin to lust for her, is it the same as adultery? according to Jesus, yes.

while we can't keep every evil thought out of our minds completely, there is a difference between having a thought come up and immediately casting it down, and letting yourself seriously consider it.

God sees sin differently from most people; people generally regard sin as wrong actions, but God regards sin as unbelief. You know God has said that He hates lies. if you have a thought come up that you could lie and maybe it would benefit you somehow and you immediately reject it knowing that you would be choosing to not believe God if you did lie, there is no sin from His perspective because you never stopped believing Him. but if you consider all the possible outcomes of lying, if you regard the thought to lie as something worth thinking about while knowing that God hates lies, you have stopped believing God already, and you have sinned even if you eventually decide not to lie - and from God's perspective, your sin is no less than if you went ahead and lied. all wrong actions were paid for by Jesus, unbelief has not been paid for; and it is not believing that Jesus paid the price for all wrong actions that causes people to reject His payment for their own 'sins' (wrong actions).

so it's not having a thought about lying that is sin, it is considering lying knowing that God hates lies, even if you decide not to lie.

 

[Fireinfolding]

Rahab is a cool example

 

[DiscipleHeLovesToo]

actually, Rahab is a very difficult example, as it may seem to some that she was actually rewarded for lying to protect the israelite spies. but the mercy she received was not due to the lies she told, but because she believed God in that He had already given the israelites the city of Jericho and the lands it ruled:

Jos 2:9-11 KJV
(9) And she said unto the men, I know that the LORD hath given you the land, and that your terror is fallen upon us, and that all the inhabitants of the land faint because of you.
(10) For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that were on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.
(11) And as soon as we had heard these things, our hearts did melt, neither did there remain any more courage in any man, because of you: for the LORD your God, he is God in heaven above, and in earth beneath.


who knows what miracle of deliverance God would have wrought had she told the truth and stood with the israelite spies after their capture - we might have another account like the 'burning fiery furnace' or the 'lion's den' - God does not need lies to bring about His purposes or protect those who believe Him and trust Him.

 

[Fireinfolding]

NT speaks on the twofold doings of Rahab in relation to the spies.

She is commended for her faith actually

 

[DiscipleHeLovesToo]

not trying to debate, but rather clarify what i was trying to communicate: Rahab was commended for her faith (believing that the God of the israelites was THE One True God); not her lies about where the spies were actually located:

Jos 2:11 KJV
(11) And as soon as we had heard these things, our hearts did melt, neither did there remain any more courage in any man, because of you: for the LORD your God, he is God in heaven above, and in earth beneath.

 

[DiscipleHeLovesToo]

let's look at another instance in scripture where the Lord is reported to have actually partnered with a lying spirit to defeat Ahab:

1Ki 22:13-28 KJV
(13) And the messenger that was gone to call Micaiah spake unto him, saying, Behold now, the words of the prophets declare good unto the king with one mouth: let thy word, I pray thee, be like the word of one of them, and speak that which is good.
(14) And Micaiah said, As the LORD liveth, what the LORD saith unto me, that will I speak.
(15) So he came to the king. And the king said unto him, Micaiah, shall we go against Ramothgilead to battle, or shall we forbear? And he answered him, Go, and prosper: for the LORD shall deliver it into the hand of the king.
(16) And the king said unto him, How many times shall I adjure thee that thou tell me nothing but that which is true in the name of the LORD?
(17) And he said, I saw all Israel scattered upon the hills, as sheep that have not a shepherd: and the LORD said, These have no master: let them return every man to his house in peace.
(18) And the king of Israel said unto Jehoshaphat, Did I not tell thee that he would prophesy no good concerning me, but evil?
(19) And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left.
(20) And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner.
(21) And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him.
(22) And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.
(23) Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.
(24) But Zedekiah the son of Chenaanah went near, and smote Micaiah on the cheek, and said, Which way went the Spirit of the LORD from me to speak unto thee?
(25) And Micaiah said, Behold, thou shalt see in that day, when thou shalt go into an inner chamber to hide thyself.
(26) And the king of Israel said, Take Micaiah, and carry him back unto Amon the governor of the city, and to Joash the king's son;
(27) And say, Thus saith the king, Put this fellow in the prison, and feed him with bread of affliction and with water of affliction, until I come in peace.
(28) And Micaiah said, If thou return at all in peace, the LORD hath not spoken by me. And he said, Hearken, O people, every one of you.

notice what Micaiah said at first:

(14) And Micaiah said, As the LORD liveth, what the LORD saith unto me, that will I speak.

now notice what he says next:

(15) So he came to the king. And the king said unto him, Micaiah, shall we go against Ramothgilead to battle, or shall we forbear? And he answered him, Go, and prosper: for the LORD shall deliver it into the hand of the king.

this is an outright lie - nowhere in scripture is there any indication that the Lord said that Ahab would prosper at Ramothgilead - Micaiah has established that he himself is a lying prophet by this statement, and everything else he says must be examined to see if it harmonizes with the rest of scripture, or is another lie.

there are many places in scripture where the Lord is quoted as speaking directly; in all of these places the writer says plainly 'and the Lord said' or some form of this - but here the writer of 1Kings does not say this, but instead merely relays what Micaiah said.

if God had partnered with a lying spirit, then God would have compromised the integrity of His own word, as He makes it clear in many other scriptures that He does not lie, and that He hates a liar and all lies - indeed, even Jesus said the devil is a liar, differentiating the devil from God by the fact that the devil is a liar, and God is not a liar nor has any part in lies

Pro 6:16-19 KJV
(16) These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
(17) A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
(18) An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
(19) A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

 

[jsimms615]

no, it is not

 

[Fireinfolding]

not trying to debate, but rather clarify what i was trying to communicate: Rahab was commended for her faith (believing that the God of the israelites was THE One True God); not her lies about where the spies were actually located:

Jos 2:11 KJV
(11) And as soon as we had heard these things, our hearts did melt, neither did there remain any more courage in any man, because of you: for the LORD your God, he is God in heaven above, and in earth beneath.

Just look up Rahab in the NT, by faith is in relation to the messengers.

Faith works by love and love worketh no harm to another

Most especially not working harm against messengers (or spies sent out by two's) of the living God (which they were).

Even as Jesus sent his messengers out by two's

Like Obadiah, who also hid the prophets of the Lord

Being lowered in a basket by another is also shown in Paul the apostle. Shown in Rahab and shown in Paul.

Theres what is called a "traitor" in the arena of "spies" or betrayal.

 

[DiscipleHeLovesToo]

Heb 11:31 KJV
(31) By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.

no mention here of her lies about the location of the spies; she is in the great faith chapter of Hebrews because she believed God

Jas 2:25 KJV
(25) Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

no mention here of her lies about the location of the spies; her works that justified her were to receive the messengers, and then send them out of the city safely - this would be the perfect place for scripture to say that her lies about their whereabouts was a work of faith, indicating that it was part of God's plan

 

[Fireinfolding]

What Rahab said

Josh 2:3 And the king of Jericho sent unto Rahab, saying, Bring forth the men that are come to thee, which are entered into thine house: for they be come to search out all the country.

Josh 2:4 And the woman took the two men, and hid them, and said thus, There came men unto me, but I wist not whence they were:

Josh 2:5 And it came to pass about the time of shutting of the gate, when it was dark, that the men went out: whither the men went I wot not: pursue after them quickly; for ye shall overtake them.


She didnt speak the truth in words, but she did nothing against the truth (or the messengers thereof). She was commended for her faith (which itself works by love) but also worketh no ill toward thy neighbor.

Heb 11:31 By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.

Josh 6:25 And Joshua saved Rahab the harlot alive, and her father's household, and all that she had; and she dwelleth in Israel even unto this day; because she hid the messengers, which Joshua sent to spy out Jericho.

James 2:25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

These two also

John 2:14 Then she let them down by a cord through the window: for her house was upon the town wall, and she dwelt upon the wall.

Someone is lowering Paul too

2Cr 11:32-33 In Damascus the governor under Aretas the king kept the city of the Damascenes with a garrison, desirous to apprehend me: And through a window in a basket was I let down by the wall, and escaped his hands.

Doesnt say after (whoever lowered him) if they dimed Paul out when the garrison caught up and enquired, but I bet they followed Rahabs example and did likewise.

 

[Fireinfolding]

Isaac also said that Rebekah was his sister (like his father Abraham did of Sarah), at least Sarah was Abrahams half sister but Rebekah was not Isaac's