If you Love Me - KEEP My Commandments

[klutedavid]

Isaiah is writing in Isaiah 66:23 and his readers are reading. Exegesis includes the rule that you must strive to understand what the author intended his readers to think by the way he is writing. What did Isaiah think "From year to year" and from "new moon to new moon" and "from Sabbath to Sabbath" meant to his readers?

That part is incredibly easy.

Hello Bob.

You said.

Isaiah is writing in Isaiah 66:23 and his readers are reading. Exegesis includes the rule that you must strive to understand what the author intended his readers to think by the way he is writing. What did Isaiah think "From year to year" and from "new moon to new moon" and "from Sabbath to Sabbath" meant to his readers?
That part is incredibly easy.

Not sure if you understand the verse you quoted Bob, you may think your reading of this verse is correct, but you are mistaken.

Here is the verse you quoted below.

Isaiah 66:23
"And it shall be from new moon to new moon, and from sabbath to sabbath, all mankind will come to bow down before Me, says the Lord.

There are two holy days mentioned in this verse Bob, the new moon celebration and the sabbath, not one holy day
but two holy days. If you think that these two holy days are not in force for all eternity, then read the next verse.

2 Chronicles 2:4
To offer burnt offerings morning and evening, on sabbaths and on new moons and on the appointed feasts of the Lord our God, this being required forever in Israel.

You should be declaring two very special days, the new moon, i.e., first day of the lunar month and the sabbath day.
This is required forever in Israel.

There are a multitude of verses that mention both the new moon celebration and the sabbath together, they are rarely separated from one another.

Some misinformed folk may think that they worship God on the sabbath but these same folk ignore the worship on the
new moon festival day. How can this be possible?

Ezekiel 46:3
The people of the land shall also worship at the doorway of that gate before the Lord on the sabbaths and on the
new moons.

From now on Bob, please include the new moon worship in your church, it is an eternal decree for Israel.

What were you thinking Bob?

 

[BobRyan]

BobRyan said: ↑
Isaiah is writing in Isaiah 66:23 and his readers are reading. Exegesis includes the rule that you must strive to understand what the author intended his readers to think by the way he is writing. What did Isaiah think "From year to year" and from "new moon to new moon" and "from Sabbath to Sabbath" meant to his readers?

That part is incredibly easy.

The point is to show cycles - from Sabbath to Sabbath -- weekly from New Moon to New Moon Monthly. And of course "From Year to Year" which we see in places like --


Zechariah 14:16 : 'And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came up against Jerusalem, shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.'

1. Exodus 13:10
   Therefore, you shall keep this ordinance at its appointed time from year to year.
2. Judges 21:19
   So they said, “Behold, there is a feast of the LORD from year to year in Shiloh, which is on the north side of Bethel, on the east side of the highway that goes up from Bethel to Shechem, and on the south side of Lebonah.”
3. 1 Samuel 2:19
   And his mother would make him a little robe and bring it to him from year to year when she would come up with her husband to offer the yearly sacrifice.

Hello Bob.
Not sure if you understand the verse you quoted Bob, you may think your reading of this verse is correct, but you are mistaken.

Here is the verse you quoted below.

Isaiah 66:23
"And it shall be from new moon to new moon, and from Sabbath to Sabbath, all mankind will come to bow down before Me, says the Lord.

There are two holy days mentioned in this verse Bob,

Two cycles - one is monthly and the other is weekly. And of course the Sabbath is clearly mentioned.

the new moon celebration and the Sabbath, not one holy day
but two holy days.

True because at the time of the New Earth mentioned in Isaiah 66 you are in Rev 21 where the Earth has been made New - the NEW Earth. So there are TWO creation events at that time - not just ONE to be remembered.


You on the other hand are promoting ? ignoring everything???

As well as ignoring the teaching of Christ in Mark 7:6-13??

How many books in your Bible??

 

[W2L]

The point is to show cycles - from Sabbath to Sabbath -- weekly from New Moon to New Moon Monthly. And of course "From Year to Year" which we see in places like --


Zechariah 14:16 : 'And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came up against Jerusalem, shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.'

1. Exodus 13:10
   Therefore, you shall keep this ordinance at its appointed time from year to year.
2. Judges 21:19
   So they said, “Behold, there is a feast of the LORD from year to year in Shiloh, which is on the north side of Bethel, on the east side of the highway that goes up from Bethel to Shechem, and on the south side of Lebonah.”
3. 1 Samuel 2:19
   And his mother would make him a little robe and bring it to him from year to year when she would come up with her husband to offer the yearly sacrifice.

Two cycles - one is monthly and the other is weekly. And of course the Sabbath is clearly mentioned.



True because at the time of the New Earth mentioned in Isaiah 66 you are in Rev 21 where the Earth has been made New - the NEW Earth. So there are TWO creation events at that time - not just ONE to be remembered.


You on the other hand are promoting ? ignoring everything???

As well as ignoring the teaching of Christ in Mark 7:6-13??

How many books in your Bible??

Yes, and the sacrifice has been made once for all time, why cannot the rest be the same way?

1 Samuel 2:19
And his mother would make him a little robe and bring it to him from year to year when she would come up with her husband to offer the yearly sacrifice.

 

[W2L]

@bob.

Key words, "at the appointed time"


Exodus 13:10
Therefore, you shall keep this ordinance at its appointed time from year to year.

2 Corinthians 6:2 (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

 

[Bob S]

hmm... i thought you said recently that you prefer to keep going to the SDA church so that you can promote division within the local congregation where you attend. Did I misread your statement?



It is possible I am mistaking you for some other former-SDA on this board. I was simply asking for clarification.

Just proves you are human.

From now on when I point out that your own pro-Sunday scholars oppose your war against God's TEN Commandments - you will feel more like owning up to that scenario.

Guess you have not been reading my posts or you would know that I am not "pro Sunday".

Well then I suppose you fully enjoy the Sunday church you now attend instead - and are here as a public service. So that is fine.

The fact is I enjoyed the Sabbath worship service most of the time. Sabbath school was an entirely different ball game. You talk about a hostile bunch of Ellen White thumpers, boy what a mess they were.

From now on when I point out that the majority of your own pro-Sunday scholars affirm God's TEN Commandments and oppose your war against the LAW of God - you will see the point.

Ha! It will be a very cold day in h before I would agree with those guys. Just as you have never studied Paul's writings the same goes for them. they wouldn't have been "pro" 10 commandments if they had studied instead of parroting others.

 

[BobRyan]

they wouldn't have been "pro" 10 commandments if they had studied instead of parroting others.

Hmmm.. i guess it sums up like this then --

=================================

What a true blessing it has been. Try it and you will like it. I will have to tell you that we do fellowship with believers. I love to hear the gospel preached and study God's word with others. When we put away pre conceived beliefs and study the Holy Writ with newness a lot of thing become clear. The plan of salvation is simple. Claim the promises!

hmm... i thought you said recently that you prefer to keep going to the SDA church so that you can promote division within the local congregation where you attend. Did I misread your statement?

You certainly did. To do such a thing would certainly be a nasty thing to do. I have never said or written such a thing Bob.

It is possible I am mistaking you for some other former-SDA on this board. I was simply asking for clarification.

From now on when I point out that your own pro-Sunday scholars oppose your war against God's TEN Commandments - you will feel more like owning up to that scenario.

Well then I suppose you fully enjoy the Sunday church you now attend instead - and are here as a public service. So that is fine.

From now on when I point out that the majority of your own pro-Sunday scholars affirm God's TEN Commandments and oppose your war against the LAW of God - you will see the point.

Guess you have not been reading my posts or you would know that I am not "pro Sunday".

The fact is I enjoyed the Sabbath worship service most of the time. Sabbath school was an entirely different ball game. You talk about a hostile bunch of Ellen White thumpers, boy what a mess they were.

Ha! It will be a very cold day in h before I would agree with those guys. .

Well... that didn't last long.

 

[BobRyan]

@bob.

Key words, "at the appointed time"


Exodus 13:10
Therefore, you shall keep this ordinance at its appointed time from year to year.

2 Corinthians 6:2 (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

interesting.

And then there is

"from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship" Is 66:23

And of course "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments" Ex 20:6.

"If you Love Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15

"Do we then make void the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the LAW of God" Rom 3:31

"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12

"what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19

The 5th Commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2 in that still valid - unit of TEN.

============================

So while I do differ with your own pro-sunday scholars on a few points -- this is not one of them. Rather this is where you oppose the position of your own group as well as the Bible. And I think that is sort of a wake-up call for someone on that side of this issue.

It would be for me.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

Yes, and the sacrifice has been made once for all time, why cannot the rest be the same way?
.

The day was sanctified and made holy by God -- in Genesis 2:1-3 as even Ex 20:11 admits. That is before any sacrifice... before any SIN - before the Gospel. Redemption and the Gospel does not delete paradise - it affirms it.

Marriage and the Sabbath instituted in Genesis 2 -- and both continue after the cross. Neither one based in animal sacrifice nor given to fix sin.

And in Is 66:23 - Sabbath to continue for all eternity for all mankind.

Thus even in Heb 4:9 "There REMAINS therefore a Sabbath rest for the people of God" JUST as it was in Psalms 96 according to Hebrews 4.

And as we see in Rev 14:7 we are still to worship God as the one who "created the heavens and the earth the seas and the springs of water" -- the same language as in the Sabbath memorial commandment for that same event.

Christ did not come to delete His Law. -- see Matt 5.

And frankly - it does not bother me that even your own pro-sunday scholars agree with me on this one.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[klutedavid]

Hello Bob.

There seems to be some confusion in your last post regarding the new moon celebration.

Here is the verse again.

2 Chronicles 2:4
To offer burnt offerings morning and evening, on sabbaths and on new moons and on the appointed feasts of the Lord
our God, this being required forever in Israel.

The new moon is the critical first day under a lunar calendar, that is how you will know what day is the sabbath day.
Hope your not following a Gregorian calendar Bob, you will end up worshiping some Roman God on the wrong day
of the week. What the scripture states is what you need to obey Bob, not what is printed in the SDA handbook.

This is the eternal decree for Israel, new moon and sabbath, both together Bob and not one without the other.
You can't quote a verse from Isaiah and then ignore half of the verse your quoting, that is extremely poor exegesis.

Then you responded in a very typical manner below.

You on the other hand are promoting ? ignoring everything???

An absurd comment Bob, your promoting half of the law and attempting to craft a theology on the basis of half of the scripture. Your interpreation is in clear view for everyone to see, you can't say 'honor the sabbath' and then ignore
the new moon celebration. That is an extremely unsound treatment of the scripture. Your the one half reading the
scripture not me.

What do I promote?

What the scripture clearly promotes Bob, my interpretation is faultless. I read the verse in the text (Isaiah 63) and I note both the day of the new moon and also the sabbath day, I will not half interpret any passage in the Bible, Bob.

I may sound as if I am being tough on you Bob, but when you quote a passage and ignore half of the passage,
what do you expect me to do Bob?

As well as ignoring the teaching of Christ in Mark 7:6-13??

Here is the key statement from the verses you quoted from the Gospel of Mark.

'This people honors Me with their lips'

Jesus is talking to the Jews here Bob, Jesus is not talking to the Gentile nations. The phrase 'this people' means
the Jews and not the Gentiles. I would not expect you to notice such things Bob, your method of interpretation is
appalling and erroneous.

How many books in your Bible??

The number of books depends on the specific translation, some translations have more books and some less.

Once again Bob, will you or will you not, obey the instruction from the Lord to obey the new moon celebration?

 

[Travis93]

New moons are sacrifice days but not sabbaths, just like the middle days of the feast of tabernacles (Numbers 29:12-38 shows how there are sacrifices every day but only the first and eighth days are sabbaths). The only new moon you actually have to take off work for is Day of Trumpets, since it is always the first of the month. It's not possible to carry out any aspect of the new moons until the temple is rebuilt, it's not something to worry about right now.

 

[W2L]

interesting.

And then there is

"from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship" Is 66:23

And of course "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments" Ex 20:6.

"If you Love Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15

"Do we then make void the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the LAW of God" Rom 3:31

"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12

"what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19

The 5th Commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2 in that still valid - unit of TEN.

============================

So while I do differ with your own pro-sunday scholars on a few points -- this is not one of them. Rather this is where you oppose the position of your own group as well as the Bible. And I think that is sort of a wake-up call for someone on that side of this issue.

It would be for me.

in Christ,

Bob

You just want you cake and eat it too. You want to call your opposition false teachers until it suits you to agree with them. God hates unjust scales bro, keep it real.

Matthew 7:1-2
Proverbs 20:23

 

[1John2:4]

What I find very interesting is why did Satan attack the Holy Convocations? Sabbath the feasts, these should be easy to keep, lying commiting adultery in our hearts , having hate in one's heart those are the ones that are hard to overcome.(in my opinion anyway) why are people not attacking those instructions?

When I read the Word I am fully convinced we must keep His days forever. Others read the same text and decide that they have been done away with and are no longer needed.

Maybe the enemy wanted the new converts to be separated and distroy one another. When the Judizers came into the flock they caused devision. They were not the only false teachers that crept into the flock the lawless men came in too. They caused devision look at history. Early church fathers did not want to Judize so they found different days to worship God, they caused more separation in the body.

Look at the crusades and Spanish Inquisition, this was all about getting rid of the Jews and Judizers.

I find it so sad that anyone who keeps his Holy days is labeled a legalist. Does He not teach man shall not live by bread alone ?

These are the days He wants all of His children to come together and worship Him as one body, no wonder the enemy created this agenda.

 

[BobRyan]

You just want you cake and eat it too. You want to call your opposition false teachers until it suits you to agree with them.

Interesting accusation when confronted with those Bible texts.

Let's look at some irrefutable facts -

The incredibly obvious point that you seem to be objecting to - is that there is always at least some agreement on something between different Christian denominations. And this example of the Ten Commandments is no exception -

What IS the elephant in your living room here - is that it is your own pro-sunday scholars that point out your error in rejecting these Bible texts.

It is not as if you would only come across this fact by talking to me.

These points are irrefutable. And objective.

 

[BobRyan]

What I find very interesting is why did Satan attack the Holy Convocations? Sabbath the feasts, these should be easy to keep, lying commiting adultery in our hearts , having hate in one's heart those are the ones that are hard to overcome.(in my opinion anyway) why are people not attacking those instructions?

Marriage and the Sabbath are the two institutions that mankind took from Eden after the fall. Satan attacks both of them.

In Rev 14 God says that a division takes place at the end of time just before the second coming - those who "keep the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" vs those who don't. What is interesting is that in that same chapter the Sabbath commandment is quoted in verse 7.

 

[bugkiller]

The point is to show cycles - from Sabbath to Sabbath -- weekly from New Moon to New Moon Monthly. And of course "From Year to Year" which we see in places like --

You finally admit to this. Great!!!

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

interesting.

And then there is

"from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship" Is 66:23

And of course "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments" Ex 20:6.

"If you Love Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15

"Do we then make void the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the LAW of God" Rom 3:31

"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12

"what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19

The 5th Commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2 in that still valid - unit of TEN.

============================

So while I do differ with your own pro-sunday scholars on a few points -- this is not one of them. Rather this is where you oppose the position of your own group as well as the Bible. And I think that is sort of a wake-up call for someone on that side of this issue.

It would be for me.

in Christ,

Bob

Unfortunately you don't understand what they're sying.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

The day was sanctified and made holy by God -- in Genesis 2:1-3 as even Ex 20:11 admits. That is before any sacrifice... before any SIN - before the Gospel. Redemption and the Gospel does not delete paradise - it affirms it.

No it doesn't Bob.

Marriage and the Sabbath instituted in Genesis 2 -- and both continue after the cross. Neither one based in animal sacrifice nor given to fix sin.

And in Is 66:23 - Sabbath to continue for all eternity for all mankind.

Where? You just posted the verse is about cycles.

Thus even in Heb 4:9 "There REMAINS therefore a Sabbath rest for the people of God" JUST as it was in Psalms 96 according to Hebrews 4.

No that's not what the verse says. The subject of the chapter is rest and not the Sabbath. Besides that they kept the 7th day Sabbath and had no rest. On top of that they were told they would never enter that rest even though they kept the 7th day Sabbath.

And as we see in Rev 14:7 we are still to worship God as the one who "created the heavens and the earth the seas and the springs of water" -- the same language as in the Sabbath memorial commandment for that same event.

So what does your statement and partial quote prove? Nothing.

Christ did not come to delete His Law. -- see Matt 5.

And you disbelieve LK 24:44. And that ain't all either.

And frankly - it does not bother me that even your own pro-sunday scholars agree with me on this one.

In context and practice they don't say what you think they say.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Marriage and the Sabbath are the two institutions that mankind took from Eden after the fall. Satan attacks both of them.

In Rev 14 God says that a division takes place at the end of time just before the second coming - those who "keep the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" vs those who don't. What is interesting is that in that same chapter the Sabbath commandment is quoted in verse 7.

The Sabbath commandment - Ex 20:8-11 is not quoted in the NT anywhere.

bugkiller

 

[Travis93]

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

1 Chronicles 16:15 Be ye mindful always of his covenant; the word which he commanded to a thousand generations;

Have 1000 generations passed since the giving of the law yet? I count about 50 from the law till Jesus according to his genealogy (Luke 3:23-33). Even if you go with a seriously small number of years per generation (maybe people giving birth right when they hit puberty), you still get over 10,000 years after Jesus the law would still be binding.

 

[bugkiller]

As you said yourself,

you chose to trust men who failed* and lied*.(according to Scripture).

I trust Jesus, Who is Trustworthy.

*When any man's words/ teachings contradict Scripture,
even Paul said if it was himself or an angel,
don't accept them.
So Scripture is the Standard Yhwh Himself gave us to judge all things by.
NOT any man's teachings,
ESPECIALLY when man's teachings contradict Yhwh Himself.
As many of man's teachings contradict Yhwh Himself,
those men cannot be accepted, nor their teachings,
no matter if even the whole world is deceived (as it is).

So why should we trust you?

bugkiller