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If you Love Me - KEEP My Commandments

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BobRyan

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Acts 15 -
James’s Judgment
13 After they had stopped speaking, James answered, saying, “Brethren, listen to me. ..

19 Therefore it is my judgment that we do not trouble those who are turning to God from among the Gentiles, 20 but that we write to them that they abstain from things contaminated by idols and from fornication and from what is strangled and from blood. 21 For Moses from ancient generations has in every city those who preach him, since he is read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”

James' "solution" points to the fact that BOTH Jews and gentiles who worship God - are (in every city) hearing scripture every Sabbath in the synagogues as we see in Acts 13 "Sabbath after Sabbath" and in Acts 17, and in Acts 18

I keep looking at the passage, but I have not been able to find the word Sabbath so far...

It is great that we can differ on the easy part.

No wonder they are fully accepting of these scriptures.

Ex 20:6 "love Me and KEEP My Commandments"
John 14:15 "IF you Love Me KEEP My Commandments"

"what matters is KEEPiNG the Commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19
"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12
 
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BABerean2

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It is great that we can differ on the easy part.
Bob,

Just keep it in context.



Act 15:4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.

Act 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

Act 15:6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.

Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;

Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Act 15:12 Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.

Act 15:13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:

Act 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.

Act 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,

Act 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:

Act 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

Act 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:

Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Act 15:22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:

Act 15:23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:

Act 15:24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:

Act 15:25 It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,

Act 15:26 Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Act 15:27 We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.

Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

.
 
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Poster0

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Its true that we have been given liberty from the law, however its not true that all we must do is love oneanother. Paul teaches us not to use our liberty to indulge in the flesh. He is telling us not to indulge in acts of immoraity, greed and other carnel acts. We will reap what we sow. IM displeased with posters who teach this so called grace theology, because they ignore part of pauls teaching, the part about not indulging in the flesh. Paul teaches the corinthians not to take Gods grace in vain, he teaches us to be sepparate from the world and to perfect holiness.

Galatians 5:13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh[a]; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.
 
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Poster0

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To disregard the teaching in the bible is to forsake wisdom and truth. If we do not study, meditate on, and do the things that we are taught, then we will stray from the right path and will become carnal rather than spiritual, and foolish rather than wise. Perhaps we need not follow the law, but surely there is wisdom and good instruction in the bible, and in the proverbs, and the New testament commands. The Lord said that his sheep know his voice and they follow it. Paul teaches us not to be foolish but to be wise, and understand what the will of the Lord is. Christ said whoever hears and obeys his words (incuding his commands and those of HIs apostles) will be like a wise man who built his house on a rock.
 
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BobRyan

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Bob,

It is impossible that one can keep God's Law perfectly without accepting Christ and his doctrine and repenting if they have sinned in the past.

That is true - did you see me make an argument here for keeping the law while rejecting Christ, or while lost??
 
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Jan001

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Wouldn't it be great to have at least one text in the entire Bible that said "week day 1 is the Lord's Day" or to have Christ commanding his people to "keep week-day-1 holy" -- in the actual Bible?

I think that having to quote yourself to get that statement to be said - is not as compelling as being able to quote something like "and rested the seventh day - therefore God blessed the Sabbath day and made IT holy" Ex 20:11, only with week-day-1 as the subject - not the seventh day.

in Christ,

Bob

Why should there have to a specific quote such as "'keep week-day-1 holy'-- in the actual Bible" when every single Christian alive at that time was already meeting on Sunday, the first day of the week, also called the Lord's day? There was no NT Bible at that time, but they still all knew that they were to worship on Sunday.


The Didache
"But every Lord’s day . . . gather yourselves together and break bread, and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure. But let no one that is at variance with his fellow come together with you, until they be reconciled, that your sacrifice may not be profaned" (Didache 14 [A.D. 70]).


The Letter of Barnabas
"We keep the eighth day [Sunday] with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead" (Letter of Barnabas 15:6–8 [A.D. 74]).


Ignatius of Antioch
"[T]hose who were brought up in the ancient order of things [i.e. Jews] have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s day, on which also our life has sprung up again by him and by his death" (Letter to the Magnesians 8 [A.D. 110]).


Justin Martyr
"[W]e too would observe the fleshly circumcision, and the Sabbaths, and in short all the feasts, if we did not know for what reason they were enjoined [on] you—namely, on account of your transgressions and the hardness of your heart. . . . [H]ow is it, Trypho, that we would not observe those rites which do not harm us—I speak of fleshly circumcision and Sabbaths and feasts? . . . God enjoined you to keep the Sabbath, and imposed on you other precepts for a sign, as I have already said, on account of your unrighteousness and that of your fathers . . ." (Dialogue with Trypho the Jew 18, 21 [A.D. 155]).


"But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Savior on the same day rose from the dead" (First Apology 67 [A.D. 155]).

Tertullian
"[L]et him who contends that the Sabbath is still to be observed as a balm of salvation, and circumcision on the eighth day . . . teach us that, for the time past, righteous men kept the Sabbath or practiced circumcision, and were thus rendered ‘friends of God.’ For if circumcision purges a man, since God made Adam uncircumcised, why did he not circumcise him, even after his sinning, if circumcision purges? . . . Therefore, since God originated Adam uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, consequently his offspring also, Abel, offering him sacrifices, uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, was by him [God] commended [Gen. 4:1–7, Heb. 11:4]. . . . Noah also, uncircumcised—yes, and unobservant of the Sabbath—God freed from the deluge. For Enoch too, most righteous man, uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, he translated from this world, who did not first taste death in order that, being a candidate for eternal life, he might show us that we also may, without the burden of the law of Moses, please God" (An Answer to the Jews 2 [A.D. 203]).


The Didascalia
"The apostles further appointed: On the first day of the week let there be service, and the reading of the holy scriptures, and the oblation [sacrifice of the Mass], because on the first day of the week [i.e., Sunday] our Lord rose from the place of the dead, and on the first day of the week he arose upon the world, and on the first day of the week he ascended up to heaven, and on the first day of the week he will appear at last with the angels of heaven" (Didascalia 2 [A.D. 225]).


Origen
"Hence it is not possible that the [day of] rest after the Sabbath should have come into existence from the seventh [day] of our God. On the contrary, it is our Savior who, after the pattern of his own rest, caused us to be made in the likeness of his death, and hence also of his resurrection" (Commentary on John 2:28 [A.D. 229]).


Victorinus
"The sixth day [Friday] is called parasceve, that is to say, the preparation of the kingdom. . . . On this day also, on account of the passion of the Lord Jesus Christ, we make either a station to God or a fast. On the seventh day he rested from all his works, and blessed it, and sanctified it. On the former day we are accustomed to fast rigorously, that on the Lord’s day we may go forth to our bread with giving of thanks. And let the parasceve become a rigorous fast, lest we should appear to observe any Sabbath with the Jews . . . which Sabbath he [Christ] in his body abolished" (The Creation of the World [A.D. 300]).


Eusebius of Caesarea
"They [the early saints of the Old Testament] did not care about circumcision of the body, neither do we [Christians]. They did not care about observing Sabbaths, nor do we. They did not avoid certain kinds of food, neither did they regard the other distinctions which Moses first delivered to their posterity to be observed as symbols; nor do Christians of the present day do such things" (Church History 1:4:8 [A.D. 312]).


"[T]he day of his [Christ’s] light . . . was the day of his resurrection from the dead, which they say, as being the one and only truly holy day and the Lord’s day, is better than any number of days as we ordinarily understand them, and better than the days set apart by the Mosaic law for feasts, new moons, and Sabbaths, which the apostle [Paul] teaches are the shadow of days and not days in reality" (Proof of the Gospel 4:16:186 [A.D. 319]).


To be continued.....
 
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Jan001

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Continued:

Athanasius
"The Sabbath was the end of the first creation, the Lord’s day was the beginning of the second, in which he renewed and restored the old in the same way as he prescribed that they should formerly observe the Sabbath as a memorial of the end of the first things, so we honor the Lord’s day as being the memorial of the new creation" (On Sabbath and Circumcision 3 [A.D. 345]).


Cyril of Jerusalem
"Fall not away either into the sect of the Samaritans or into Judaism, for Jesus Christ has henceforth ransomed you. Stand aloof from all observance of Sabbaths and from calling any indifferent meats common or unclean" (Catechetical Lectures 4:37 [A.D. 350]).


Council of Laodicea
"Christians should not Judaize and should not be idle on the Sabbath, but should work on that day; they should, however, particularly reverence the Lord’s day and, if possible, not work on it, because they were Christians" (Canon 29 [A.D. 360]).


John Chrysostom
"[W]hen he [God] said, ‘You shall not kill’ . . . he did not add, ‘because murder is a wicked thing.’ The reason was that conscience had taught this beforehand, and he speaks thus, as to those who know and understand the point. Wherefore when he speaks to us of another commandment, not known to us by the dictate of conscience, he not only prohibits, but adds the reason. When, for instance, he gave commandment concerning the Sabbath— ‘On the seventh day you shall do no work’—he subjoined also the reason for this cessation. What was this? ‘Because on the seventh day God rested from all his works which he had begun to make’ [Ex. 20:10-11]. . . . For what purpose then, I ask, did he add a reason respecting the Sabbath, but did no such thing in regard to murder? Because this commandment was not one of the leading ones. It was not one of those which were accurately defined of our conscience, but a kind of partial and temporary one, and for this reason it was abolished afterward. But those which are necessary and uphold our life are the following: ‘You shall not kill. . . . You shall not commit adultery. . . . You shall not steal.’ On this account he adds no reason in this case, nor enters into any instruction on the matter, but is content with the bare prohibition" (Homilies on the Statutes 12:9 [A.D. 387]).


"You have put on Christ, you have become a member of the Lord and been enrolled in the heavenly city, and you still grovel in the law [of Moses]? How is it possible for you to obtain the kingdom? Listen to Paul’s words, that the observance of the law overthrows the gospel, and learn, if you will, how this comes to pass, and tremble, and shun this pitfall. Why do you keep the Sabbath and fast with the Jews?" (Homilies on Galatians 2:17 [A.D. 395]).

"The rite of circumcision was venerable in the Jews’ account, forasmuch as the law itself gave way thereto, and the Sabbath was less esteemed than circumcision. For that circumcision might be performed, the Sabbath was broken; but that the Sabbath might be kept, circumcision was never broken; and mark, I pray, the dispensation of God. This is found to be even more solemn than the Sabbath, as not being omitted at certain times. When then it is done away, much more is the Sabbath" (Homilies on Philippians 10 [A.D. 402]).

The Apostolic Constitutions
"And on the day of our Lord’s resurrection, which is the Lord’s day, meet more diligently, sending praise to God that made the universe by Jesus, and sent him to us, and condescended to let him suffer, and raised him from the dead. Otherwise what apology will he make to God who does not assemble on that day . . . in which is performed the reading of the prophets, the preaching of the gospel, the oblation of the sacrifice, the gift of the holy food" (Apostolic Constitutions 2:7:60 [A.D. 400]).


Augustine
"Well, now, I should like to be told what there is in these ten commandments, except the observance of the Sabbath, which ought not to be kept by a Christian. . . . Which of these commandments would anyone say that the Christian ought not to keep? It is possible to contend that it is not the law which was written on those two tables that the apostle [Paul] describes as ‘the letter that kills’ [2 Cor. 3:6], but the law of circumcision and the other sacred rites which are now abolished" (The Spirit and the Letter 24 [A.D. 412]).


Pope Gregory I
"It has come to my ears that certain men of perverse spirit have sown among you some things that are wrong and opposed to the holy faith, so as to forbid any work being done on the Sabbath day. What else can I call these [men] but preachers of Antichrist, who when he comes will cause the Sabbath day as well as the Lord’s day to be kept free from all work. For because he [the Antichrist] pretends to die and rise again, he wishes the Lord’s day to be held in reverence; and because he compels the people to Judaize that he may bring back the outward rite of the law, and subject the perfidy of the Jews to himself, he wishes the Sabbath to be observed. For this which is said by the prophet, ‘You shall bring in no burden through your gates on the Sabbath day’ [Jer. 17:24] could be held to as long as it was lawful for the law to be observed according to the letter. But after that the grace of almighty God, our Lord Jesus Christ, has appeared, the commandments of the law which were spoken figuratively cannot be kept according to the letter. For if anyone says that this about the Sabbath is to be kept, he must needs say that carnal sacrifices are to be offered. He must say too that the commandment about the circumcision of the body is still to be retained. But let him hear the apostle Paul saying in opposition to him: ‘If you be circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing’ [Gal. 5:2]" (Letters 13:1 [A.D. 597]).


Sabbath worship or Sunday worship?
I'll continue to worship God on Sunday because Jesus commanded it. Jesus' true followers strive to obey Him. "If you love me, keep my commandments." Jesus promised the crown of eternal life only to the persons who do love/obey Him to the best of their ability.

James 1:12
"Blessed is the one who perseveres under trial because, having stood the test, that person will receive the crown of life that the Lord has promised to those who love him."
 
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BobRyan

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Acts 15 -
James’s Judgment
13 After they had stopped speaking, James answered, saying, “Brethren, listen to me. ..

19 Therefore it is my judgment that we do not trouble those who are turning to God from among the Gentiles, 20 but that we write to them that they abstain from things contaminated by idols and from fornication and from what is strangled and from blood. 21 For Moses from ancient generations has in every city those who preach him, since he is read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”

James' "solution" points to the fact that BOTH Jews and gentiles who worship God - are (in every city) hearing scripture every Sabbath in the synagogues as we see in Acts 13 "Sabbath after Sabbath" and in Acts 17, and in Acts 18

Bob,

Just keep it in context.

crucial context - that you skipped.

Acts 15
Some men came down from Judea and began teaching the brethren, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 And when Paul and Barnabas had great dissension and debate with them, the brethren determined that Paul and Barnabas and some others of them should go up to Jerusalem to the apostles and elders concerning this issue. 3 Therefore, being sent on their way by the church, they were passing through both Phoenicia and Samaria, describing in detail the conversion of the Gentiles, and were bringing great joy to all the brethren

Act 15:4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
Act 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
======================================================

The gentiles were never commanded in the actual Bible to be circumcised and become Jews - this is true in both OT and NT. Those who were arguing for such a thing - were 'making stuff up'.

so much so that the Jewish Christian council in Acts 15 rejects that idea.

Act 15:6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

The burden of "making stuff up" was too great even for the Jews to bear. By contrast the Word of God was a joy!


Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
Act 15:12 Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.
Act 15:13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:
Act 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
Act 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Act 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
Act 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

19 Therefore it is my judgment that we do not trouble those who are turning to God from among the Gentiles, 20 but that we write to them that they abstain from things contaminated by idols and from fornication and from what is strangled and from blood. 21 For Moses from ancient generations has in every city those who preach him, since he is read in the synagogues every Sabbath.

James' "solution" points to the fact that BOTH Jews and gentiles who worship God - are (in every city) hearing scripture every Sabbath in the synagogues as we see in Acts 13 "Sabbath after Sabbath" and in Acts 17, and in Acts 18

The Acts 15 council was not there to "delete the Bible" or to "delete the command to Love God with all your heart" or to "Delete the command to not take God's name in vain" or to "delete the command to honor parents" ...
 
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BobRyan

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Jan001 said:
Practicing Christians do keep the Lord's day holy on Sunday, the first day of the week, just as Jesus commanded His followers to do. .

Wouldn't it be great to have at least one text in the entire Bible that said "week day 1 is the Lord's Day" or to have Christ commanding his people to "keep week-day-1 holy" -- in the actual Bible?

I think that having to quote yourself to get that statement to be said - is not as compelling as being able to quote something like "and rested the seventh day - therefore God blessed the Sabbath day and made IT holy" Ex 20:11, only with week-day-1 as the subject - not the seventh day.

Why should there have to a specific quote such as "'keep week-day-1 holy'-- in the actual Bible"

Because you said -- "Practicing Christians do keep the Lord's day holy on Sunday, the first day of the week, just as Jesus commanded His followers to do"

And because "details matter" when supporting a claim like that.

[quote


when every single Christian alive at that time was already meeting on Sunday, the first day of the week, also called the Lord's day? There was no NT Bible at that time,

That had the NT letters before the end of the first century and not one of those letters said 'we meet every week-day-1 for a worship service"
Not one of those letters said "week-day-1 is the Lord's Day".

Therefore you could say -- as you did -- "Why should there have to a specific quote such as "'keep week-day-1 holy'-- in the actual Bible" - while making claims for that NT age in the first century you seem to willingly admit you have no documented support for your suggestion in the actual first century.



but they still all knew that they were to worship on Sunday.


The Didache
"But every Lord’s day . . . gather yourselves together and break bread, and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure. But let no one that is at variance with his fellow come together with you, until they be reconciled, that your sacrifice may not be profaned" (Didache 14 [A.D. 70]).

Nothing in that quote says the "Lord's Day" is week-day-1.

The Letter of Barnabas
"We keep the eighth day [Sunday] with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead" (Letter of Barnabas 15:6–8 [A.D. 74]).


Ignatius of Antioch
"[T]hose who were brought up in the ancient order of things [i.e. Jews] have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s day, on which also our life has sprung up again by him and by his death" (Letter to the Magnesians 8 [A.D. 110]).

Of the 15 forged letters claimed for Ignatius - which one are you quoting??



A lot of fraudulent material came up in the centuries after the Apostles were gone.




Barnabas

First of these two comes the Catholic Epistle of Barnabas. This has been attributed to the companion of St. Paul in his missionary labors, and dated as early as A.D. 71. The following from standard authorities will show that such claims are false. Neander speaks as follows:


"The writings of the so-called Apostolic Fathers are, alas! come down to us, for the most part, in a very uncertain condition; partly, because in early times writings were counterfeited, under the name of these venerable men of the church, in order to propagate certain opinions or principles; partly, because those writings which they had really published were adulterated, and especially so to serve a Judao-hierarchical party, which would fain crush the free evangelical spirit. We should here, in the first place, have to name Bamabas, the well known fellow traveler of St. Paul, if a letter, which was first known in the second century, in the Alexandrian church, under his name, and which bore the inscription of a Catholic epistle, was really his composition. But it is impossible that we should acknowledge this epistle to belong to that Barnabis who was worthy to be the companion of the apostolic labors of St. Paul, and had received his name from the power of his animated discourses in the churches. We find, also, nothing to induce us to believe the author of the Epistle was desirous of being considered Barnabas. But since its spirit and its mode of conception corresponded to the Alexandrian taste, it may have happened, that as the author's name was unknown, and persons were desirous of giving it authority, a report was spread abroad in Alexandria, that Barnabas was the author." (History of the Christian Church of the First Three Centuries, pp. 407, 408, Rose's Trans.)



Mosheim says:



"The Epistle of Barnabas was the production of some Jew, who most probably lived in this [the second] century, and whose mean abilities and superstitious attachment to Jewish fables, show, notwithstanding the uprightness of his intentions, that he must have been a very different person from the true Barnabas who was St. Paul's companion." (Church History, Vol. 1, p. 113, Maclaine's Trans.)



Also from the same author:



"For what is suggested by some of its having been written by that Barnabas who was the friend and companion of St. Paul, the futility of such a notion is easily to be made apparent from the letter itself. Several of the opinions and interpretations of Scripture which it contains, having in them so little, either of truth, or dignity, or force, as to render it impossible that they ever could have proceeded from the pen of a man divinely inspired." (Historical Commentaries, Century 2, See. 53.)



Eusebius says:



"Among the rejected writings must be reckoned also the Acts of Paul, and the so-called Shepherd, and the Apocalypse of Peter, and in addition to these the extant Epistle of Barnabas, and the so-called Teachings of the Apostles." (Church History, Book III., chap. 25, Sec. 4. The Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, Vol. I., p. 156.



Prof. Hackett says:



"The letter still extant, which was known as that of Bamabas, even in the second century, cannot be defended as genuine. (Commentary on Acts, p. 251.)



Millner says:



"Of the Apostle Barnabas, nothing is known, except what is recorded in the Acts. There we have an honorable enconium of his character, and a particular description of his joint labors with St. Paul. It is a great injury to him, to apprehend the Epistle which goes by his name to be his." (Vol. I., p. 126, Church History. Boston, 1809.)



Kitto says:



"The so-called Epistle of Barnabas, probably a forgery of the second century." (Cyclopedia Biblical Literature, article Lord's-day.)

Sir William Domville, after an exhaustive examination of the whole question, concludes as follows:


"But the Epistle was not written by Bamabas; it is not merely "unworthy of him," it would be a disgrace to him, and, what is of much more consequence, it would be a disgrace to the Christian religion, as being the production of one of the authorized teachers of that religion in the time of the apostles, which circumstance would seriously damage the evidence of its divine origin." (An Examination of the Six Texts, p. 233.)


Prof. W.D. Killen, a prominent representative of the Presbyterian church in Ireland, bears testimony as follows:



"The tract known as the "Epistle of Barnabas" was probably composed in A.D. 135. It is the production, apparently, of a convert from Judaism, who took special pleasure in allegorical interpretation of Scripture." (History of the Ancient Church, p. 367. New York, 1859. See also The Old Catholic Church, pp. 8, 13. T. & T. Clark, 1871.)



Rev. Lyman Coleman says:



"The Epistle of Barnabas, bearing the honored name of the companion of Paul in his missionary labors, is evidently spurious. It abounds in fabulous narratives, mystic allegorical interpretations of the Old Testament, and fanciful conceits; and is generally agreed by the learned to be of no authority. Neander supposes it to have originated in the Alexandrian school; but at what particular time he does not define. (Ancient Christianity Exemplified. chap. 2, sec. 2, p. 47. Philadelphia, 1852.)







Didache - can be a bit sketchy


The “Didache” or Teaching (longer title, “The Teaching of the Lord, by
(diañ) the Twelve Apostles, to the Gentiles
”).—This work is quoted as
“Scripture,” without being named, by Clement of Alexandria (circa 170 AD, in
Strom., i. 20). It is mentioned in HE, III, 25 as the “Teachings so-called of the
Apostles,” “recognized by most ecclesiastical writers,” although “not a genuine”
composition of apostles.
Athanasius (Fest. Epistle, 39) denies its canonicity, but
acknowledges its utility. The latest ancient reference to the work from personal
knowledge is by Nicephoros (9th century) who includes it among apocryphal
writings. Thenceforth it disappears until its recent recovery in 1875 by
Bryennios.
 
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BobRyan

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So you started with the claim that it was "commanded by Christ to His followers" in the first century -- but immediately switched to documents long after the first century - not even scripture at all.
 
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Jan001

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....
James:
19 Therefore it is my judgment that we do not trouble those who are turning to God from among the Gentiles, 20 but that we write to them that they abstain from things contaminated by idols and from fornication and from what is strangled and from blood. 21 For Moses from ancient generations has in every city those who preach him, since he is read in the synagogues every Sabbath.

James' "solution" points to the fact that BOTH Jews and gentiles who worship God - are (in every city) hearing scripture every Sabbath in the synagogues as we see in Acts 13 "Sabbath after Sabbath" and in Acts 17, and in Acts 18

The Acts 15 council was not there to "delete the Bible" or to "delete the command to Love God with all your heart" or to "Delete the command to not take God's name in vain" or to "delete the command to honor parents" ...

The Jews who are not Christians do indeed read Moses' Law in their synagogues every Sabbath. Christians do not.

So, if the circumcision rite that was required by Moses' Law is not required of the Christians, why do you think that Christians are required to worship according to Moses' Saturday Sabbath Law, especially when the Bible records that they actually gathered to worship on the first day of the week?
 
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Meowzltov

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Why should there have to a specific quote such as "'keep week-day-1 holy'-- in the actual Bible" when every single Christian alive at that time was already meeting on Sunday, the first day of the week, also called the Lord's day? There was no NT Bible at that time, but they still all knew that they were to worship on Sunday.
You said it, Jan!

You'll find that Bob resorts to calling the Ignatius text a fraud rather than acknowledging he is mistaken.
 
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Jan001

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And because "details matter" when supporting a claim like that......

Very interesting how the early church's writings show that Christians actually worshiped on Sunday and not on Saturday and also that none of these writings say that the early Christians worshiped on Saturday.
 
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Jan001

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So you started with the claim that it was "commanded by Christ to His followers" in the first century -- but immediately switched to documents long after the first century - not even scripture at all.

The "early" church fathers recorded that the Christians worshiped on the first day of the week, Sunday.
"Later" church fathers recorded that the Christians worshiped on the first day of the week, Sunday.
"Much later" church fathers recorded that the Christians worshiped on the first day of the week, Sunday.
Today, Christians worship on the first day of the week, Sunday.

I do see a pattern here.
:)
 
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In other words you are saying the text does not mean what it says...

You conclude it is really is about keeping the Sabbath, if you read between the lines...

Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

I keep looking at the passage, but I have not been able to find the word Sabbath so far...
Yes, I know, I told you that you were blind earlier, but you did not believe. How can one be cured, if he does not acknowledge his willing disease?

Read the previous passages, and ask God for eyesight, but if you do not believe you are blind, spiritually, you will not ask, being set in pride, thinking you have no need of a physician.

Acts 15:20 KJV - But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and [from] fornication, and [from] things strangled, and [from] blood.

Acts 15:21 KJV - For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Acts 15:23 KJV - And they wrote [letters] by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren [send] greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:

Acts 15:30 KJV - So when they were dismissed, they came to Antioch: and when they had gathered the multitude together, they delivered the epistle:

Acts 15:31 KJV - [Which] when they had read, they rejoiced for the consolation.​

Where were the epistles to be "read"? Where does the "multitude" "gathered ...together" in those cities?

Acts 13:14 KJV - But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.

Acts 13:27 KJV - For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled [them] in condemning [him].

Acts 13:42 KJV - And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

Acts 13:44 KJV - And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

Acts 16:13 KJV - And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted [thither].

etc.​
 
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Meowzltov

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Of the 15 forged letters claimed for Ignatius - which one are you quoting??
We've been through this before, Bob. The letter to Smyrna is accepted as authentic by Scholars. I've provided you with multiple links -- it's all over the web as its conventional wisdom, the CONSENSUS of scholars. It is ridiculous for you to point to other letters of Ignatius that are fraudulent and argue fallaciously that because some are fraudulent that all must be.
 
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