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If there is "no evidence" for evolution...

Jjmcubbin

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but what if we will find such a watch? you will conclude design or not?
Let's first find such a watch. Then we'll see.
How would a watch even replicate anyways, how would it create matter? It can't.
 
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Speedwell

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but what if we will find such a watch? you will conclude design or not?
If it shows evidence of human manufacture we can conclude design. If we cannot find evidence of human manufacture we cannot conclude design. We have been giving you the same answer for a year. It's not going to change, no matter how many whacky examples of imaginary objects you present to us.

When determining the presence of design in any object or phenomena there are only two possible outcomes:

1. There is evidence of human manufacture, therefore we conclude design.
2. There is no evidence of human manufacture, therefore we can come to no conclusion about design.

Design may be present, but we cannot detect it without evidence of human manufacture.
 
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Aman777

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Sorry, it makes no sense to elevate the King James higher than other translations.

Sure there is. IF you understand the KJV, you understand the agreement of Scripture with Science and History. Instead of having the ancient superstitious half/truth of men who lived thousands of years before Science, you have God's Truth. Your "altered" version doesn't make scientific sense any better than the ancient Hebrew view. Both falsely presume that a "plain reading" is the best in spite of what God tells us:

1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Only those born again Christians, who live in the last days, can possibly understand. Dan 12:4
 
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Paul of Eugene OR

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Oh, you're one of those people who think you have mystic understanding which others lack. Such people are very common throughout history.
 
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Aman777

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Oh, you're one of those people who think you have mystic understanding which others lack. Such people are very common throughout history.

False accusation since I post of the AGREEMENT of Scripture, Science and History, which is apparent to the Christians of the last days, but NOT to any other generation according to the Lord in Daniel 12:4. If you don't agree with the Lord, then please tell us of another understanding. Amen?
 
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HitchSlap

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Oh, you're one of those people who think you have mystic understanding which others lack. Such people are very common throughout history.
Unfortunately, before modern psychiatry, most of these people were improperly diagnosed and treated. They were in large part, thrown into the 'looney bin,' and were subjected to horrific experiments and procedures.
 
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DogmaHunter

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in this case by good i mean that this backward retina structure actually improve vision. the opposite of dawkins claim.

How does having a blind spot "improve" vision?

For example... there is a specific point in my line of sight where, if I hold a pencil there, I can not see it. Eventhough it is within my line of sight.

How does this blind spot, which causes me to NOT SEE objects sitting in a specific place in my line of sight, "improve" my vision?
 
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DogmaHunter

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but what if we will find such a watch? you will conclude design or not?

What if we would find an undesigned car? Would you conclude it was designed?

What if you stop asking silly "what if" questions and actually would limit yourself to observable reality?
 
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xianghua

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Speedwell

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If it shows evidence of human manufacture we can conclude design. If we cannot find evidence of human manufacture we cannot conclude design. We have been giving you the same answer for a year. It's not going to change, no matter how many whacky examples of imaginary objects you present to us, or cartoons of real objects.

When determining the presence of design in any object or phenomena there are only two possible outcomes:

1. There is evidence of human manufacture, therefore we conclude design.
2. There is no evidence of human manufacture, therefore we can come to no conclusion about design.

Design may be present, but we cannot detect it without evidence of human manufacture.
 
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Jjmcubbin

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Hey! ETC!
How is that a evidence for design? A watch is very different. And I agree with the speedwell although I think "God" isn't a human.
How do the cytochromes replicate itself? We know the mechanism for that. We know nothing about this watch of yours.
Also, how is a watch similar to a cytochrome (I think that's what is depicted)?
EDIT: It was an oxysome.
 
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xianghua

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Hey! ETC!
How is that a evidence for design?

how its not? its a spinning motor. we know that a spinning motor is evidence for d esign like any spinning motor designed by humans.

we also found another motor called flagellum:



again: we know that a motor is evidence for design and not for a natural process.

(image from Bacterial Flagellum)
 
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pitabread

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we know that a spinning motor is evidence for d esign like any spinning motor designed by humans.

No, we don't. Once again, you keep trying to make an argument based on the False Equivalence fallacy.

Your argument is invalid and it will continue to be invalid no matter how much you keep ignoring this.
 
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Speedwell

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If the "spinning motor" shows evidence of human manufacture we can conclude design. If we cannot find evidence of human manufacture we cannot conclude design. We have been giving you the same answer for a year. It's not going to change, no matter how many whacky examples of imaginary objects you present to us, or cartoons of real objects.

When determining the presence of design in any object or phenomena there are only two possible outcomes:

1. There is evidence of human manufacture, therefore we conclude design.
2. There is no evidence of human manufacture, therefore we can come to no conclusion about design.

Design may be present, but we cannot detect it without first finding evidence of human manufacture.
 
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doubtingmerle

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Also, how is a watch similar to a cytochrome (I think that's what is depicted)?
That is the beauty of Xianghua's argument. It doesn't have to make sense. His basic argument is.

1) A and B exist (or conceivably could exist).
2) A was designed.
3) Therefore B was designed.

The argument has taken a hundred forms. A could be a beer can and B could be a mermaid. It does not have to make sense. He just repeats it. Suppose beer cans and mermaids exist. Beer cans are designed. Therefore mermaids are designed.

If you tell him he is wrong, it will be about the 2000th time he was told that in the past year.
 
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Jjmcubbin

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There's a term in evolution called analogous organs, and this case might be similar to that (similar, flagellum is not an organ).
All I understand is
A flagellum looks like a motor, and motor is something designed by humans.
Therefore, flagellum is designed by a human.
It makes no sense. They look similar. So do bird and bat wings. This really doesn't prove anything.
Agree. I still don't understand the logic behind his argument.
 
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