If Jesus died for the whole world why isn't the whole world saved?

[eleos1954]

Jesus did not die for the whole world, but those who believe in Him, by His grace.

John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Who are the ones who believe in Him?

John 6:37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
John 6:39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.

John 6:40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

Romans 8:28-30 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. (29) For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. (30) And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

2 Timothy 2:10 Therefore I endure everything for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation that is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

******

Romans 8:28-30 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. (29) For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. (30) And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

word called

Greek
klétos: called
Original Word: κλητός, ή, όν
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: klétos
Phonetic Spelling: (klay-tos')
Short Definition: called, summoned
Definition: called, invited, summoned by God to an office or to salvation.

 

[Marvin Knox]

...........Well if Jesus died for the sins of the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why doesn't everyone go to be with Jesus when they die?...........

Because everyone's sins are not covered (as you say). The scriptures don't say that they are.

The world is not saved by the sacrifice of Jesus in and of itself. If that were so - then everything would have come up roses the split second it was "finished".

That has never been God's plan.

Nor are the "elect" saved by Christ's sacrifice for them in and of itself. The elect are enemies of God just as the rest of mankind up until they are justified before God by believing on Jesus as their Savior.

I always find it interesting that some "limited atonement" types use the old "if Jesus died for the whole world the whole world would be saved" logic when teaching this false doctrine.

Even the most die hard Calvinist should know that the elect were enemies of God and children of wrath for quite some time before being actually "saved" by His work at Calvary.

There is no logical reason why a person for whom Christ died can be labeled an enemy of God for, say, 90 years and not for eternity.

Limited atonement proponents use faulty logic to arrive at this false conclusion.

The scriptures are not contradictory in this matter. Jesus died for the elect and Jesus died for the rest of the world as well.

Now we preach to both the elect and the world "be ye reconciled to God".

That total reconciliation only comes through saving faith.

Whether that saving faith is from God or man should not be in dispute either. God is the author of our faith as the scriptures tell us plainly and it is, indeed, OUR faith we exercise in order to be justified before God.

Our faith is a gift from God lest any man should boast.

 

[Deadworm]

To anticipate criticisms, the OP's issue might best be reformulated this way:
"God...is the Savior of all people, especially those who believe (2 Timothy 4;10)."
This proclamation does not say that God is potentially everyone's Savior, but rather that He actually is everyone's Savior. The word "especially" has the force of "more immediately" and thus raises the question of how God is ultimately also the Savior of those who presently don't believe. The doctrine of omnipotence implies that nothing can prevent God's will from being done. So when we learn that it is our omnipotent and omniscient God's will to save everyone, then we must ask whether God still loves the damned after their death and continues to pursues them with His love after death:
"
"God our Savior...desires everyone to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth (1 Timothy 2:4)."

True, "it is appointed unto people once to die, but after that the judgement (Hebrews 9:28), but God is still the Savior of those under postmortem judgment. So what happens after the judgment? So we must ask, "What are the practical consequences of God's love for the damned and His desire to save everyone?"

This question brings us to at least 6 NT texts before which many conservative evangelicals tend to freeze like Bambi in the headlights"
(1) Jesus teaches that Gehenna is in effect a debtor's prison, from which release is theoretically possible through payment or cancellation of the debt (Matthew 8:34).
(2) Paul approves of proxy baptism for the unrighteous dead as part of the process by which God ultimately becomes "all in all" or "everything to everyone (1 Corinthians 15:28-29)."
(3) Peter teaches that Jesus preaches the Gospel to evil deceased spirits "in prison" (i. e. in Hell) and this implies that they can respond to this preaching and be saved (1 Peter 3:19; 4:6).
(4) It is revealed to John the seer that the "gates" of the New Jerusalem always remain open and that it is the wicked who languish outside the gates (Revelation 21:25; 22:15). The implication is that the wicked dead have a chance to repent and enter the gates.
(5) The hymn in Philippians 2:6-11 envisions all the living and dead, righteous and wicked alike, confessing Jesus as Lord. Paul adds that no one can sincerely confess Jesus as Lord apart from the inspiration of the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 12:3). Are we to assume that after a forced confession, an angel pulls a lever and the unbelievers are then sucked down into Hell? This grotesque image is refuted by the fact that the hymn takes as it is starting point the invitation to universal salvation in Isaiah 45:22-23, which has striking parallels to the hymn.

(6) In a similar hymn (Revelation 5:13), all the living and dead, righteous and unrighteous alike, are envisioned as worshiping Christ and God in heaven; and this vision neatly fits the seer's hopeful image of the wicked dead lurking outside the eternally open gates of the New Jerusalem.

All this need not imply that God will eventually save everyone. But it does seem to imply that God's love for everyone, combined with His ability to pursue the hearts of the unrighteous dead, allows for the possibility that everyone will have the chance to make better choices and get saved. As C. S. Lewis has pithily put it, "The gates of Hell are locked from the inside."

 

[1stcenturylady]

For most of my Christian walk I believed that Jesus died for the elect a.k.a his sheep as said in John 10:7, John 10:11, , John 10:15, and John 10:26. Also in John 17 in Jesus's prayer to the Father he talks about saving the sheep and not the whole world. But there are other verses in the bible that begin to bother me like 1 John 2:2 where it says:

"He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world."

and John 3:16-17 where it says

" For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him."

Well if Jesus died for the sins of the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why doesn't everyone go to be with Jesus when they die? Why is it only the elect that enter heaven? It makes more sense that Jesus died for all who he foreknew would come to him to salvation doesn't it? Only Jesus's sheep are saved in the long run all others are not. All Christians can agree on this. So, why die for the whole world when the whole world can't be saved? Only those who come to Jesus for salvation can be saved and God knew ahead of time who would and who wouldn't come to Jesus for salvation so it makes the most amount of sense that Jesus died for his sheep doesn't it? After all, why would Jesus say in most of John 10 "I die for my sheep" if he didn't die for his sheep?. So, I don't understand it. If it is the truth that Jesus died for the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why do people still go to hell and why are only Jesus's sheep saved? It doesn't make any sense to me. Not at all. That sounds a lot more unfair to me personally then to say that Jesus died for everyone who he foreknew would come to him for salvation. I mean, that doesn't say that Jesus chose people for hell it says that Jesus chose every single person on the Earth that could possibly be saved.

I mean, predestination is something taught in Ephesians 1:4 and 1 Peter 1:20. So, why does some parts of the Bible seem to teach that Jesus died for the sins of the world? The bible can't contradict itself can it?

It is good that you questioned the beliefs you learned, and found that "Limited Atonement" is not truth. There is no one ineligible to apply the blood of Jesus to their sins. That is what "for the whole world" means. The problem is not everyone in the whole world accepts the light, but wants and chooses to stay in darkness. It is free to anyone who chooses to accept it. "Irresistible grace" is another fallacy. We have free will and are not mindless robots and must first accept the sacrifice and receive the Holy Spirit to make us dead to sin before He can bring us to completion if we don't quench Him. The Holy Spirit is drawing all mankind, but some in mankind quench Him. "Total depravity" does not apply to Christians who have received the Holy Spirit, because we are now new creatures, alive in Christ.

 

[Winken]

For most of my Christian walk I believed that Jesus died for the elect a.k.a his sheep as said in John 10:7, John 10:11, , John 10:15, and John 10:26. Also in John 17 in Jesus's prayer to the Father he talks about saving the sheep and not the whole world. But there are other verses in the bible that begin to bother me like 1 John 2:2 where it says:

"He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world."

and John 3:16-17 where it says

" For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him."

Well if Jesus died for the sins of the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why doesn't everyone go to be with Jesus when they die? Why is it only the elect that enter heaven? It makes more sense that Jesus died for all who he foreknew would come to him to salvation doesn't it? Only Jesus's sheep are saved in the long run all others are not. All Christians can agree on this. So, why die for the whole world when the whole world can't be saved? Only those who come to Jesus for salvation can be saved and God knew ahead of time who would and who wouldn't come to Jesus for salvation so it makes the most amount of sense that Jesus died for his sheep doesn't it? After all, why would Jesus say in most of John 10 "I die for my sheep" if he didn't die for his sheep?. So, I don't understand it. If it is the truth that Jesus died for the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why do people still go to hell and why are only Jesus's sheep saved? It doesn't make any sense to me. Not at all. That sounds a lot more unfair to me personally then to say that Jesus died for everyone who he foreknew would come to him for salvation. I mean, that doesn't say that Jesus chose people for hell it says that Jesus chose every single person on the Earth that could possibly be saved.

I mean, predestination is something taught in Ephesians 1:4 and 1 Peter 1:20. So, why does some parts of the Bible seem to teach that Jesus died for the sins of the world? The bible can't contradict itself can it?

Romans 10:8-13. Not everyone makes that confession, audibly or silently or prayerfully or whatever.

 

[dqhall]

For most of my Christian walk I believed that Jesus died for the elect a.k.a his sheep as said in John 10:7, John 10:11, , John 10:15, and John 10:26. Also in John 17 in Jesus's prayer to the Father he talks about saving the sheep and not the whole world. But there are other verses in the bible that begin to bother me like 1 John 2:2 where it says:

"He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world."

and John 3:16-17 where it says

" For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him."

Well if Jesus died for the sins of the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why doesn't everyone go to be with Jesus when they die? Why is it only the elect that enter heaven? It makes more sense that Jesus died for all who he foreknew would come to him to salvation doesn't it? Only Jesus's sheep are saved in the long run all others are not. All Christians can agree on this. So, why die for the whole world when the whole world can't be saved? Only those who come to Jesus for salvation can be saved and God knew ahead of time who would and who wouldn't come to Jesus for salvation so it makes the most amount of sense that Jesus died for his sheep doesn't it? After all, why would Jesus say in most of John 10 "I die for my sheep" if he didn't die for his sheep?. So, I don't understand it. If it is the truth that Jesus died for the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why do people still go to hell and why are only Jesus's sheep saved? It doesn't make any sense to me. Not at all. That sounds a lot more unfair to me personally then to say that Jesus died for everyone who he foreknew would come to him for salvation. I mean, that doesn't say that Jesus chose people for hell it says that Jesus chose every single person on the Earth that could possibly be saved.

I mean, predestination is something taught in Ephesians 1:4 and 1 Peter 1:20. So, why does some parts of the Bible seem to teach that Jesus died for the sins of the world? The bible can't contradict itself can it?

If someone plants seeds in a field, not all the seeds will germinate. Of those that sprout, not all will produce heads of grain.

Not everyone went to listen to Jesus' preaching. Of those who listened to him, a few believed. Jesus risked his life opposing corruption. Is it any wonder those who side with corrupt leaders will not be saved?

Matthew 11:20-30 (WEB)
20 Then he began to denounce the cities in which most of his mighty works had been done, because they didn’t repent. 21 “Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the mighty works had been done in Tyre and Sidon which were done in you, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. 22 But I tell you, it will be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon on the day of judgment than for you. 23 You, Capernaum, who are exalted to heaven, you will go down to Hades. For if the mighty works had been done in Sodom which were done in you, it would have remained until today. 24 But I tell you that it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom, on the day of judgment, than for you.”

 

[PanDeVida]

For most of my Christian walk I believed that Jesus died for the elect a.k.a his sheep as said in John 10:7, John 10:11, , John 10:15, and John 10:26. Also in John 17 in Jesus's prayer to the Father he talks about saving the sheep and not the whole world. But there are other verses in the bible that begin to bother me like 1 John 2:2 where it says:

"He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world."

and John 3:16-17 where it says

" For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him."

Well if Jesus died for the sins of the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why doesn't everyone go to be with Jesus when they die? Why is it only the elect that enter heaven? It makes more sense that Jesus died for all who he foreknew would come to him to salvation doesn't it? Only Jesus's sheep are saved in the long run all others are not. All Christians can agree on this. So, why die for the whole world when the whole world can't be saved? Only those who come to Jesus for salvation can be saved and God knew ahead of time who would and who wouldn't come to Jesus for salvation so it makes the most amount of sense that Jesus died for his sheep doesn't it? After all, why would Jesus say in most of John 10 "I die for my sheep" if he didn't die for his sheep?. So, I don't understand it. If it is the truth that Jesus died for the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why do people still go to hell and why are only Jesus's sheep saved? It doesn't make any sense to me. Not at all. That sounds a lot more unfair to me personally then to say that Jesus died for everyone who he foreknew would come to him for salvation. I mean, that doesn't say that Jesus chose people for hell it says that Jesus chose every single person on the Earth that could possibly be saved.

I mean, predestination is something taught in Ephesians 1:4 and 1 Peter 1:20. So, why does some parts of the Bible seem to teach that Jesus died for the sins of the world? The bible can't contradict itself can it?

Mark 22And whilst they were eating, Jesus took bread; and blessing, broke, and gave to them, and said: Take ye. This is my body. 23And having taken the chalice, giving thanks, he gave it to them. And they all drank of it. 24And he said to them: This is my blood of the new testament, which shall be shed for many. 25Amen I say to you, that I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day when I shall drink it new in the kingdom of God.

Jesus Christ, Knows that not All will be saved, therefore He Uses the word MANY and not all.

What Protestants don't understand is that we MUST Eat and Drink His Body and Blood to be considered among the Many that He speaks of! For not all who say Lord Lord will be saved, but those who Eat and Drink, they will be among the Many that His Blood was Shed for.

 

[Oldmantook]

The doctrine of apokatastasis accommodates 1 Jn 2:2 where it states that Jesus died for the sins of the whole world.

 

[Smylie]

The whole world does not accept/know Jesus.

 

[ClementofA]

Well if Jesus died for the sins of the whole world and everyone's sins are covered why doesn't everyone go to be with Jesus when they die?

Why are Christians chastened by God if Jesus died for them?

Why don't Christians immediately fly off to heaven when they're saved, as opposed to continuing to suffer in this world?

Jesus did die for the sins of all & all will be saved, even though some will have to suffer "hell" after they die.

https://www.tentmaker.org/books/hope_beyond_hell.pdf

my threads:

Have you been decieved by your Bible translation?

For the Lord will NOT cast off FOR EVER:

Augustine's ignorance & error re Matthew 25:46

 

[ClementofA]

But if God DID die for the whole world why isn't the whole world saved?

Salvation involves believing & receiving, not just Jesus death.

 

[A_Thinker]

Why are Christians chastened by God if Jesus died for them?

Because they are now God's children ... and they are, sometimes, disobedient.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Salvation involves believing & receiving, not just Jesus death.

Most of all, following. Even the demons believe and tremble.

 

[A_Thinker]

Why don't Christians immediately fly off to heaven when they're saved, as opposed to continuing to suffer in this world?

Christians have become a part of God's family/team ... and remain on Earth to serve as God's representatives/servants on Earth.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Lutheran perspective:

Christ died for everyone. Full stop. Yes, everyone.

We cannot save ourselves, we cannot even choose to accept Christ, indeed, the Lord says "You did not choose Me, I chose you" (John 15:16) and further that God elected and predestined us in Christ (Ephesians 1:11).

So what do we say then, that God has chosen some and rejected others? Absolutely not. Christ died for the whole world, and it is God's will and desire that all be saved (1 Timothy 2:3-4, 1 Timothy 4:10, 2 Peter 3:9).

So then if God has chosen us in Christ and causes this to happen by His own gracious kindness through what He has done through Christ, the Spirit, and the Means of Grace of His Word and Sacraments, why then are there those who in the end, won't be saved? Because they refuse it, they choose their own destruction. "Here's the verdict: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil." (John 3:19)

C.S. Lewis puts it brilliantly when he writes,

"There are only two kinds of people in the end: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those to whom God says, in the end, 'Thy will be done.'"

-CryptoLutheran

 

[S.O.J.I.A.]

They keep using those verses. They don't mean what people think they mean.

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

I suppose. I mean I'm trying to believe that God died for the sins of the whole world. I mean, most Christians do believe that so why can't I? But if God DID die for the whole world why isn't the whole world saved? Because the whole world won't come to him for salvation? That makes sense. But if the whole world won't come to him for salvation why bother dying for them at all? See what I'm getting at? It makes more sense to say that God died for those who will come to believe in him. Those sins are forever covered. Because aren't only the sins of the saved covered? Let's say for example that Jesus did die for the sins of the whole world and that the sins of the whole world are covered. Why do people still die? Doesn't sin lead to death? After all Jesus promised that everyone who believes in him will never die even though their bodies die. And if everyone's sins are covered why do people go to hell for not believing in Jesus? Because isn't it dying in our sins that cause us to go to hell (John 8:24)?

Scripture says, I have sworn by Myself, The word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness And will not turn back, That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance. (Isaiah 45:23)

That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; (Philippians 2:10)

Behold the lamb who takes away the sin of the world...slain before the foundation of the world...And Jesus's very words, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth. Which has everything to do with perception (where we are perceiving from) as it relates to single of eye (again) seeing that Jesus speaks of "The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light."

The process taking place within us (the kingdom is within you and Paul's said, "Christ IN YOU, the hope of glory") is a waking up of the spirit, death of our 'self' soul that we KNOW He lives within...we being the temple not made with human hands/dwelling place of God. That which is being restored is what happened to Adam in the garden...deep slumber and change of eyesight/perception (God asked, "Where art thou?" which has everything to do with how and from where we are perceiving/seeing.) Before Adam and the women ate the fruit and 'the fall', God "saw all that He had made and it was Very Good."

Man looks at outward appearances and God looks at the heart. He loves all, impartially...even while yet sinners...God had a plan He purposed in Himself from the beginning. He spoke His word and it will be accomplished...everyone is somewhere within HIS plan...some still sleep in the dust realm of perception (Awake O sleeper...) some are waking up to the Truth that we have always been...a son created in His image. That which is being revealed within our very inner being, as Paul knew..."But when God, who set me apart from my mother’s womb and called me by His grace, was pleased to reveal His Son in me so that I might preach Him among the Gentiles, I did not rush to consult with flesh and blood, (Galatians 1:15-16)

To see the spirit as something outside of our being is to not yet be single of eye, perceiving lack that causes us to measure and divide that which is immeasurable. God is infinite and fills all in all...father of us all...whether we can see it or not...

P.S. You mention death...the body of flesh dies and returns to the dust of the earth for the flesh profiteth nothing. It is the spirit that is LIFE. We must lose our soul to find it (again) in Him, as a son.

 

[thesunisout]

The sacrifice of Jesus Christ overcame the curse that came though Adams sin. We can now have intimate fellowship with God again. I think that proves that He paid for the whole thing. However, we all still have the choice that Adam and Eve had, which is to obey or disobey. His sacrifice doesn't eliminate that choice, and there are consequences for making that choice, because His atonement doesn't cover those who reject Him.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

When John says in his first letter that Jesus died "not only for our sins, but also for the sins of the whole world" he does not mean every individual. Rather, he means people from all around the world and people in every nation. There's a nice parallel in John's gospel which demonstrates that this is his meaning:

John 11:51-52 - 51 He (Caiaphas) did not say this of his own accord, but being high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the nation, 52 and not for the nation only, but also to gather into one the children of God who are scattered abroad.

This means "not for Jews only, but also for people from every nation." It clearly does not mean every individual who has ever lived. The meaning is the same in 1 John.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

Great response, thanks for sharing it.