We already had this discussion. There is no evidence of intelligence behind everything. Your biased a priori conclusion is not evidence, it is simply wishful thinking.
Upvote
0
Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
We already had this discussion. There is no evidence of intelligence behind everything. Your biased a priori conclusion is not evidence, it is simply wishful thinking.I tried explaining my "reasoning", but you won't accept it, so...?
Order, design, whatever, everything being determined and pre-determined by an intelligence, which is what the "evidence" is telling us, etc, or at the very least that "determinism" is true, etc, IMO, there having to be intelligence behind it, that made and/or designed it, set it all in motion, knows/knew it all fully, from the very beginning to it's very ending, etc, etc, etc, but you won't accept it, and even say it's "invalid", etc, so I don't know what else to say, etc...
Anyhow,
God Bless!
OK... at this point I'm beginning to feel embarrassed for you. It would be kinder to stop here.... I see determinism as true and I'm definitely not alone in that belief/view either, not even alone in it by many non-believers, etc...
Any kind of free will is only based on a not knowing, etc, for anyone, etc...So, do you believe in free will? If you do, how do you reconcile it with determinism - are you a compatibilist?
If not, how do you reconcile the absence of free will with Christian belief?
Why...?OK... at this point I'm beginning to feel embarrassed for you. It would be kinder to stop here.
Not it's based on a deterministic view of "everything", and the, or this world, and all of us, and this universe, etc...We already had this discussion. There is no evidence of intelligence behind everything. Your biased a priori conclusion is not evidence, it is simply wishful thinking.
It remains unevidenced.Not it's based on a deterministic view of "everything", and the, or this world, and all of us, and this universe, etc...
God Bless!
Many think it's pretty evident, etc...It remains unevidenced.
Evident =/= evidenced. If you have evidence, please present it. You failed to do so last time I engaged you, so I expect you'll come up blank again.Many think it's pretty evident, etc...
God Bless!
Your fully capable of doing a simple google search, so, do it...Evident =/= evidenced. If you have evidence, please present it. You failed to do so last time I engaged you, so I expect you'll come up blank again.
I think you will find that most of the people "against it" are people pushing so hard for their own will, or own "free will", etc...Your fully capable of doing a simple google search, so, do it...
Evidence for and/or against determinism, etc...
And "decide for yourself", etc...
God Bless!
I asked you to present your evidence. Asking me to find it myself indicates you either have nothing or you do not understand it and cannot put it in your own words.I think you will find that most of the people "against it" are people pushing so hard for their own will, or own "free will", etc...
But, anyway, decide for yourself, K...
God Bless!
All I'm going to be doing is giving you a bunch of links, now, you really want me to do that, or not...?I asked you to present your evidence. Asking me to find it myself indicates you either have nothing or you do not understand it and cannot put it in your own words.
The point is, there is no evidence, even in determinism, for your God. That's the part I'm asking you to present. Now, are you prepared to present anything? Or do we just accept you have nothing more than wishful thinking?All I'm going to be doing is giving you a bunch of links, now, you really want me to do that, or not...?
And I tried putting it my own words, but I can give you a bunch of links that say it much better than I can, now, you really want to do that, or not...?
You can't just google, "evidence for determinism", cause that's all I'm going to be doing, then choosing my favorites and linking them here for you...
Anyway, don't be lazy, or expect me to do it all for you, etc, if you really want to know just google it, OK...?
I learned about this a while back, and like I said, would just be giving you cherry picked links, so...? And I didn't save the information n my computer either, etc, cause I saw no need as long as I have google, etc...
And that is easily something your fully capable of doing yourself, and you could also look up the ones "against" as well, etc, and I wouldn't be choosing them for you, etc...
You need to look it/them up yourself and it's not that hard either, and then just decide for yourself, is all I am saying, etc...
Anyway,
God Bless!
But there is, because determinism means the there should be a one who determined it, or caused it from the very beginning, etc...The point is, there is no evidence, even in determinism, for your God. That's the part I'm asking you to present. Now, are you prepared to present anything? Or do we just accept you have nothing more than wishful thinking?
The fact you cannot understand that a cause does not have to be intelligent is all we need to know. Your arguments are based on a simple, unsupportable, a priori belief that the only explanation is intelligence. You have no evidence, just an assertion.But there is, because determinism means the there should be a one who determined it, or caused it from the very beginning, etc...
Since it is all dependent on "cause and effect", and things caused by things prior to/it them, etc, and those things, by things prior to that, etc, going all the way back, etc, what was the "original cause" if all is "cause and effect" going all the way back to the beginning, etc...?
Anyway,
God Bless!
Explain to me how intelligence could not be required, or involved, etc...? or how something, that has apparent order, etc, could come from nothing or complete disorder, etc...?
And you confusing the issues as well, intelligence is intelligence, and order is order, etc, etc, etc..
The intelligence in it all is seen by what proceeds forth from or after the original cause, etc...The fact you cannot understand that a cause does not have to be intelligent is all we need to know. Your arguments are based on a simple, unsupportable, a priori belief that the only explanation is intelligence. You have no evidence, just an assertion.
I appreciate that, I really do, but then there is still the old argument that "something does not ever come from nothing ever" also, etc...Here is my recommendation: take some time to read up on the following subjects, Chaos Theory, Complexity Theory, Emergent Properties, and Quantum Mechanics.
These subjects cover topics such as how order can appear out of chaos, self-organization, the emergence of properties in systems not independently found in constituent parts, and so on. While these topics can be heady, they can provide some conceptual understanding as to how things we observe in our universe can form. I will admit a lot of this material can see counter-intuitive. I remember when first reading about events that violate basic causality; trying to wrap one's head around these concepts is not easy! But I think it's worth it.
If you plan to make arguments using these terms, you should take some time to explicitly figure out what you mean by them. Simply defining a term with itself is not conducive to a productive discussion or debate.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?