i think i figured it out

[MrGoodBytes]

Ya --- people have died trying to eradicate it.

There are people dying right now for the same circular logic, applied to the Quran.

 

[Tomk80]

Ya --- people have died trying to eradicate it.

Yeah, that makes it, like, totally different from all other faiths.

[/sarcasm]

 

[lynn18]

A long time ago when people didn't understand things they made up gods (such as the Norse god Thor) to explain things. Thor explained how thunder worked. he didn't actually explain it, but nearly all Norse people belived in him. When Jesus was alive people still didn't understand many things. So he and other people created your god to explain it. Now scientists are figuring out things, slowly disproving intelligent design. One day they might figure out how life started, hopefully resolving christians ignorance of the facts once and for all.

sodapop112 Is this what you believe or
do you have some evidence of this?

sodapop112 Do you accept Human’s belief in god is a result of evolution and has an evolutionary reason?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Pretty convincing lies then. (q.v. my response to Beastt's thread about how you can tell if God is lying or not).

Indeed, most of the world is tricked.
Care to link me to that thread? It looks interesting.

I don't have "animalistic urges" --- in fact, there are no animals in my family tree.

On the contrary, you fit the scientific definition of 'animal'.

To maim and kill, yes. I made a pledge in 1972 to give my life for this country if I had to; and thanks to those who have made that pledge in the past, I'm not speaking German right now (or British).

You are speaking 'British'. The language of Britain is English. You speak English. Therefore, you speak 'British'.
And the German's had no intention of conquering the US. In Hitler's case, he desired an Aryan race, among other things.

 

[Logic_Fault]

AFAIK --- no proof has survived.

Then the claim is meaningless and you should stop making it.

 

[Baggins]

NI made a pledge in 1972 to give my life for this country if I had to; and thanks to those who have made that pledge in the past, I'm not speaking German right now (or British).

Good grief man, are they all as smart as you where you come from?

I'm sure I won't be the first person to point out that you are typing in English the language of Great Britain. There is a reason for this, the original settlers on the East coast of America were British.

The war of independance was not a war between Americans and the British, it was a British civil war, in some ways a continuation of the English civil war in that it was about representation in Parliament.

You really should learn some of your own history, it is fascinating

 

[Biologist]

You're only 14! That is not enough time to study and research the evidence. It seems that you are taking the conclusions of others and making them your own.

Interesting enough you have no problem with a 14 year old Christian or even a 0-13 year old Christian.

Take the time to study ID from a non-bias source, you may be surprised.

Considering ID is just Christian creationism it would be hard to find a non-bias source.

Look how un-bias Answers in Genesis is:

Answers in Genesis is an apologetics (i.e., Christianity-defending) ministry, dedicated to enabling Christians to defend their faith, and to proclaim the gospel of Jesus Christ effectively

 

[djbcrawford]

How was it your savior got here again? Oh yes, because your deity impregnated a virgin. How is this different from the Greek and Roman deities impregnating a woman/virgin with the result of a demigod being produced?

Again, different from the other legends where the gods lust after human woman and the resulting demi-god is more of an unwanted by-product than a salvation plan. It doesn't say He slept with her, merely she became pregnant while still remaining a virgin. You don't have to believe it, but don't mis-quote it.

The victims of the genocides he apparently ordered would beg to differ.

I agree, this is difficult to reconcile and I wish I had a satisfactory answer. Much of the old testament is Jewish history with battles and wars. Whether they justified it at the time in God's name I don't know. But I still believe in a loving God.

It's likely that the Biblical stories were based on an actual person but no, I don't believe he existed as he is depicted in the Bible. At best he was an apocalyptic preacher (likely one of many) who gained a cult following and was, possibly, crucified for some reason or other. I do not believe anything that was written about him in the Bible and nobody else in the entire area seems to have noticed him at all.

Then why was it written and why did so many people believe it in such a short period of time.

Possibly. If it could be verified that the person actually was an eye witness and the document or documents could be authenticated in some way. Unfortunately, like I said, it seems everyone in the world failed to notice God incarnate except for a handful of people who can't even be shown to have existed themselves.

So where did it come from? The gospels were by 4 of his disciples. Letters between church leaders quoted extensively from them.

Less useful. Anyone can write a book about a fictional character, or a person who's real whom they've never actually met.

If they were written as plays or stories maybe. Do you actually believe anything that wasn't written by yourself or within the last 100 years?

Even less useful than documents mentioning him. I'm sure there are letters explaining the teachings of Vishnu too.

As far as I'm aware it can't be shown that the Apostles, which is who I assume you're speaking of, existed. Even if all of them did exist and they all died for a belief it doesn't make it true. Many people die for beliefs that aren't true.

So where did it come from. Maybe it happened like evolution. No life... poof! ....life. No Christianity ...poof!... Christianity! That seems to fit more with your world view.

It's not based on interpretation, it's based on repeatable experimentation among other things.

I disagree. Observation of what happens during an experiment and theory about why it happened. If I repeatably drop a ball on my foot, I don't come up with gravity unless i observe and theorize. Incidentally what repeatable experiment proved random mutation evolution? It's observation and theory, not experimentation.

Science doesn't claim to get it's knowledge from the creator of the universe or an infallible book, now does it? If your God tells you something is so then it should be so. Unfortunately science often shows that that isn't the case.

While the book may be infallible, man isn't. Hence our view can change about how we perceive it. It's basics still hold true while we can discuss the details at our leisure.

 

[sodapop112]

from AV1611VET's message you say that you have no animalistic urges..how about fear? That is a urge shared by animals. How about if you want to have sex? is that not a animalistic urge?

 

[Logic_Fault]

Again, different from the other legends where the gods lust after human woman and the resulting demi-god is more of an unwanted by-product than a salvation plan.

Fair enough. Different, however, does not mean true.

It doesn't say He slept with her, merely she became pregnant while still remaining a virgin. You don't have to believe it, but don't mis-quote it.

I didn't misquote it. I never said your deity slept with her, simply that he impregnated her.

I agree, this is difficult to reconcile and I wish I had a satisfactory answer. Much of the old testament is Jewish history with battles and wars. Whether they justified it at the time in God's name I don't know. But I still believe in a loving God.

Believe if you will, but your Bible doesn't back it up.

Then why was it written and why did so many people believe it in such a short period of time.

Do you have some sort of records that give accurate numbers of Christians before Rome made it the state religion? If not then I don't see how you can imply that the religion had any more followers than any other newly formed religion at the time. Besides, the number of people that believe something does not mean it's true.

So where did it come from? The gospels were by 4 of his disciples. Letters between church leaders quoted extensively from them.

The Gospels were not written by those they are attributed to. They weren't even written until a number of decades after the events they record happened.

If they were written as plays or stories maybe. Do you actually believe anything that wasn't written by yourself or within the last 100 years?

Only what's either verifiable by myself personally or by someone else who is an expert working in the field. This of course only applies to non-fiction obviously.

Why is it you don't believe the Hindu Vedas or the Qur'an, or the Maya Codices? They have just as much support for their claims as the Gospels do of theirs.

So where did it come from. Maybe it happened like evolution. No life... poof! ....life. No Christianity ...poof!... Christianity! That seems to fit more with your world view.

First, the Theory of Evolution doesn't state this. Second, you could say the same for any religion, though I don't personally believe that Christianity simply popped into existence as you're implying I do.

I disagree. Observation of what happens during an experiment and theory about why it happened. If I repeatably drop a ball on my foot, I don't come up with gravity unless i observe and theorize.

I suppose that observation and theorization could be considered "interpreting" things, but repeatable experiments leave little to be interpreted. Either the experiment works like it's said to or it doesn't. If it works great, your theory seems valid. If it fails then your previous "interpretations" of what was happening are incorrect and it's back to the drawing board. That's the whole point of experimentation in the first place.

Incidentally what repeatable experiment proved random mutation evolution? It's observation and theory, not experimentation.

Check TalkOrigins.org There's likely something there.

While the book may be infallible, man isn't. Hence our view can change about how we perceive it. It's basics still hold true while we can discuss the details at our leisure.

What parts of it still hold true? Nearly anything testable has been shown to be either entirely or partially incorrect. Not what I'd expect from the Word of an omniscient God.

 

[Tomk80]

from AV1611VET's message you say that you have no animalistic urges..how about fear? That is a urge shared by animals. How about if you want to have sex? is that not a animalistic urge?

I always like the research that has been done (and is still being done) on politics in chimp and babboon colonies. They look surprisingly like human politics.

 

[Tomk80]

I disagree. Observation of what happens during an experiment and theory about why it happened. If I repeatably drop a ball on my foot, I don't come up with gravity unless i observe and theorize. Incidentally what repeatable experiment proved random mutation evolution? It's observation and theory, not experimentation.

Search for Luria-Delbruck (IIRC). Their experiments showed mutations to be random with respect to fitness.

 

[AV1611VET]

There are people dying right now for the same circular logic, applied to the Quran.

There's a big difference though: they could fight back.

Three astronauts strapped into seats inside a capsule that's devoid of air, with an escape hatch that opens outward cannot.

A 92-pound woman, like my mother was, with advanced emphysema from smoking two packs of Pall Mall a day for n-years cannot.

 

[AV1611VET]

I always like the research that has been done (and is still being done) on politics in chimp and babboon colonies. They look surprisingly like human politics.

The difference though is who learned from whom.

 

[Morcova]

Ya --- people have died trying to eradicate it.

LOL.

Christians died trying to eradicate paganism. By your own word that proves that the pagans were right! OH NOES!

 

[AV1611VET]

LOL.

Christians died trying to eradicate paganism. By your own word that proves that the pagans were right! OH NOES!

Nope --- our orders are to "let them alone".

• [bible]Matthew 15:14[/bible]

 

[Morcova]

To maim and kill, yes. I made a pledge in 1972 to give my life for this country if I had to; and thanks to those who have made that pledge in the past, I'm not speaking German right now (or British).

Wow.... that's the most impressivly stupid thing I've read in years.

 

[AV1611VET]

Wow.... that's the most impressivly stupid thing I've read in years.

Well, I'll do your fellow Atheists a favor and not attribute your attitude to cause-and-effect, how's that?

 

[Morcova]

Nope --- our orders are to "let them alone".

Now if only that had anything to do with reality.

 

[Morcova]

Well, I'll do your fellow Atheists a favor and not attribute your attitude to cause-and-effect, how's that?

If it was cause and effect your stupidity would be the cause.